WJ
Non-Aligned
Posts: 3,265
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Post by WJ on Oct 16, 2023 5:59:48 GMT
Is Poland always this slow?
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Post by matureleft on Oct 16, 2023 6:55:35 GMT
20.5% now counted but progress very uneven.
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Oct 16, 2023 8:19:51 GMT
Oh look, it's the Lib Dem's Polish cousins
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johng
Labour
Posts: 4,849 
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Post by johng on Oct 16, 2023 10:16:06 GMT
Ipsos PiS - 200 KO - 163 TD - 55 NL - 30 Kon - 12 Opposition - 248 PiS/Kon - 212 IPSOS have updated their exit poll (common in Poland). Very slight change in the projected results.
PiS - 36.6% - 198
KO - 31% - 161
TD - 13.5% - 57
NL - 8.6% - 30
Kon - 6.4% - 14
Opposition - 248
PiS/Kon - 212
Glad I'm not the only one who noticed. Laughable.
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Post by matureleft on Oct 16, 2023 10:27:32 GMT
The count proceeds - now 45 per cent. The PiS share is dropping steadily as the count proceeds and is now 38.7 per cent. PiS have been employing “shy Tory” arguments about the exit polls but they look pretty accurate.
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Post by rcronald on Oct 16, 2023 10:33:44 GMT
Poland is probably one of 2 European countries where I would likely abstain from voting because all of the parties are woeful.
PiS-Too economically left wing and socially conservative (Polish Shas)
KO-Moved way too far to the left for me to vote for them (Polish Yesh Atid)
TD-Too Agrarian for a metropolitan like me
Lewica-Too left-wing
Confederation-Actual Lunatics
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Post by eastmidlandsright on Oct 16, 2023 10:56:54 GMT
Poland is probably one of 2 European countries where I would likely abstain from voting because all of the parties are woeful. PiS-Too economically left wing and socially conservative (Polish Shas) KO-Moved way too far to the left for me to vote for them (Polish Yesh Atid) TD-Too Agrarian for a metropolitan like me Lewica-Too left-wing Confederation-Actual Lunatics It is keeping with the fine Polish tradition lasting for well over 300 years of always having really, really shit leaders. |
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johng
Labour
Posts: 4,849
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Post by johng on Oct 16, 2023 11:26:37 GMT
Over 50% counted now. Given what's been counted, the exit poll looks pretty accurate.
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johng
Labour
Posts: 4,849
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Post by johng on Oct 16, 2023 11:32:33 GMT
Częstochowa is the first city to have finished counting. It's a city of around 200k in South/Central Poland home to a famous monastery/ picture of Mary. Changes based on 2019. PiS won then, but lost it this time around. KO 35.8% (+7.4) PiS 30.9% (-6.4) Lewica 12.3% (-8.7) TD/PSL 11.6% (+7.2) Kon 5.9% (-0.1) wybory.gov.pl/sejmsenat2023/en/sejm/wynik/pow/246400 |
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Post by finsobruce on Oct 16, 2023 11:39:06 GMT
Częstochowa is the first city to have finished counting. It's a city of around 200k in South/Central Poland home to a famous monastery/ picture of Mary. Changes based on 2019. PiS won then, but lost it this time around. KO 35.8% (+7.4) PiS 30.9% (-6.4) Lewica 12.3% (-8.7) TD/PSL 11.6% (+7.2) Kon 5.9% (-0.1) wybory.gov.pl/sejmsenat2023/en/sejm/wynik/pow/246400
The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
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Post by Adam in Stroud on Oct 16, 2023 11:50:57 GMT
Częstochowa is the first city to have finished counting. It's a city of around 200k in South/Central Poland home to a famous monastery/ picture of Mary. Changes based on 2019. PiS won then, but lost it this time around. KO 35.8% (+7.4) PiS 30.9% (-6.4) Lewica 12.3% (-8.7) TD/PSL 11.6% (+7.2) Kon 5.9% (-0.1) wybory.gov.pl/sejmsenat2023/en/sejm/wynik/pow/246400
The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
It's always startling to remember that the Swiss in the early 1500s and then the Swedes in the mid-to-later 1600s were the most effective soldiers in Europe and that both ran pretty expansionist foreign policies (without which Switzerland would be a straightforward German-speaking nation.) |
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Post by Peter Wilkinson on Oct 16, 2023 12:15:00 GMT
Częstochowa is the first city to have finished counting. It's a city of around 200k in South/Central Poland home to a famous monastery/ picture of Mary. Changes based on 2019. PiS won then, but lost it this time around. KO 35.8% (+7.4) PiS 30.9% (-6.4) Lewica 12.3% (-8.7) TD/PSL 11.6% (+7.2) Kon 5.9% (-0.1) wybory.gov.pl/sejmsenat2023/en/sejm/wynik/pow/246400The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
And taught the Prussians how to do the goose step (and the goose step is one thing the Swedish army hasn't stopped doing). |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Oct 16, 2023 12:30:48 GMT
The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
It's always startling to remember that the Swiss in the early 1500s and then the Swedes in the mid-to-later 1600s were the most effective soldiers in Europe and that both ran pretty expansionist foreign policies (without which Switzerland would be a straightforward German-speaking nation.) And individual cantons were themselves very expansionist. Bern in particular, which at one point owned most of Vaud and Jura, and stretched almost to Geneva. Most of Ticino had been conquered by Uri and was essentially run as a Swiss colony. |
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Post by Adam in Stroud on Oct 16, 2023 13:21:14 GMT
It's always startling to remember that the Swiss in the early 1500s and then the Swedes in the mid-to-later 1600s were the most effective soldiers in Europe and that both ran pretty expansionist foreign policies (without which Switzerland would be a straightforward German-speaking nation.) And individual cantons were themselves very expansionist. Bern in particular, which at one point owned most of Vaud and Jura, and stretched almost to Geneva. Most of Ticino had been conquered by Uri and was essentially run as a Swiss colony. Yeah, I did quite a lot of reading around the Valois Dukes of Burgundy at one point, and the imperialism of the Bernese was pretty striking. Not that Charles the Bold was any less so. (The latter's an interesting figure, if you're not familiar: rarely has anyone so strongly had the qualities you'd expect to result in success - workaholism, physical courage, physical fitness, intellect, ambition, determination, plus immense inherited wealth - but ended up failing so catastrophically, to the extent of consigning his whole dynasty and polity to the dustbin of history.) |
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Post by islington on Oct 16, 2023 13:56:48 GMT
And individual cantons were themselves very expansionist. Bern in particular, which at one point owned most of Vaud and Jura, and stretched almost to Geneva. Most of Ticino had been conquered by Uri and was essentially run as a Swiss colony. Yeah, I did quite a lot of reading around the Valois Dukes of Burgundy at one point, and the imperialism of the Bernese was pretty striking. Not that Charles the Bold was any less so. (The latter's an interesting figure, if you're not familiar: rarely has anyone so strongly had the qualities you'd expect to result in success - workaholism, physical courage, physical fitness, intellect, ambition, determination, plus immense inherited wealth - but ended up failing so catastrophically, to the extent of consigning his whole dynasty and polity to the dustbin of history.) Indeed a fascinating figure, and had he prospered to the end the modern map of Europe might look very different.
However, the quality of his leadership seemed to deteriorate quite sharply in his last few years, and it's notable that 'the Bold' is not the only cognomen he acquired - he is also sometimes known as Charles 'the Reckless' or 'the Rash'.
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Post by islington on Oct 16, 2023 14:07:23 GMT
Częstochowa is the first city to have finished counting. It's a city of around 200k in South/Central Poland home to a famous monastery/ picture of Mary. Changes based on 2019. PiS won then, but lost it this time around. KO 35.8% (+7.4) PiS 30.9% (-6.4) Lewica 12.3% (-8.7) TD/PSL 11.6% (+7.2) Kon 5.9% (-0.1) wybory.gov.pl/sejmsenat2023/en/sejm/wynik/pow/246400
The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
Indeed: the remarkable evolution from Erik Bloodaxe to Sven the Socially Responsible.
Does anyone else remember an old TV comedy sketch that posited that this transformation had happened one day with total suddenness? As I recall it, a fearsome Swedish raiding party descended on some peaceful village, mercilessly pillaging with fire and sword; then they had an abrupt 'Wait, what are we doing?' moment, apologized profusely to the surviving villagers, offered to pay for the damage, and shuffled off sheepishly.
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Post by finsobruce on Oct 16, 2023 14:36:06 GMT
The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
Indeed: the remarkable evolution from Erik Bloodaxe to Sven the Socially Responsible.
Does anyone else remember an old TV comedy sketch that posited that this transformation had happened one day with total suddenness? As I recall it, a fearsome Swedish raiding party descended on some peaceful village, mercilessly pillaging with fire and sword; then they had an abrupt 'Wait, what are we doing?' moment, apologized profusely to the surviving villagers, offered to pay for the damage, and shuffled off sheepishly.
Tee Hee. If there isn't already a book with that title, you should write it. |
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Post by finsobruce on Oct 16, 2023 14:42:05 GMT
The Black Madonna - an icon with a fascinating and disputed history. Credited with holding off a Swedish invasion (in the days when the Swedes invaded places, instead of handing out peace prizes).
Indeed: the remarkable evolution from Erik Bloodaxe to Sven the Socially Responsible.
Does anyone else remember an old TV comedy sketch that posited that this transformation had happened one day with total suddenness? As I recall it, a fearsome Swedish raiding party descended on some peaceful village, mercilessly pillaging with fire and sword; then they had an abrupt 'Wait, what are we doing?' moment, apologized profusely to the surviving villagers, offered to pay for the damage, and shuffled off sheepishly.
I don't think this is it, but i'll keep looking.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Oct 16, 2023 15:09:25 GMT
And individual cantons were themselves very expansionist. Bern in particular, which at one point owned most of Vaud and Jura, and stretched almost to Geneva. Most of Ticino had been conquered by Uri and was essentially run as a Swiss colony. Yeah, I did quite a lot of reading around the Valois Dukes of Burgundy at one point, and the imperialism of the Bernese was pretty striking. Not that Charles the Bold was any less so. (The latter's an interesting figure, if you're not familiar: rarely has anyone so strongly had the qualities you'd expect to result in success - workaholism, physical courage, physical fitness, intellect, ambition, determination, plus immense inherited wealth - but ended up failing so catastrophically, to the extent of consigning his whole dynasty and polity to the dustbin of history.) There's a concept called the Brünig-Napf-Reuss Line in Switzerland. Basically, there are certain cultural differences that transcend language barriers, such as the figures on decks of cards. And these broadly align to whether an area was ever under Burgundian domination. |
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iain
Lib Dem
Posts: 11,426
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Post by iain on Oct 16, 2023 15:10:58 GMT
Counting now up to 76%, and we're at:
PiS - 36.9%
PO - 29.2%
TD - 14.5%
New Left - 8.3%
Konfederacja - 7.2%
The three 'democratic opposition parties' have been trending up and the two right wing parties down, though mostly this is PO going up at the expense of PiS.
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