Foggy
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Post by Foggy on Jul 28, 2024 19:15:07 GMT
Fewer than 5% of the population under the age of 40 at the next election will have any concept of what Glamorgan is/was. What about cricket followers? Or indeed lovers of leek sausages?? |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Jul 28, 2024 19:22:54 GMT
Just because you’ve heard of a sports team doesn’t mean you can find it on a map.
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Foggy
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Post by Foggy on Jul 28, 2024 21:05:45 GMT
The Vale of Glamorgan is still the name of both a local authority and a constituency, so there's a bit of a clue there.
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Jul 28, 2024 21:30:24 GMT
The Vale of Glamorgan is still the name of both a local authority and a constituency, so there's a bit of a clue there. Yes but only for a very small part of what was Glamorgan. Very little connection from Glamorganshire to Swansea/Neath today ditto Pontypridd/Aberdare etc while we’re at it. Further up this thread many months ago I stated that I hoped the 2030 review would start with a blank piece of paper and not the pre 1974 boundaries which some people are so wedded to. |
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Foggy
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Post by Foggy on Jul 28, 2024 22:41:32 GMT
Further up this thread many months ago I stated that I hoped the 2030 review would start with a blank piece of paper and not the pre-1974 boundaries which some people are so wedded to. Well, guilty as charged.  The real problem with the 2030 Review as things stand is that it'll be indirectly wedded to the 2023 Westminster boundaries. The current quick Review requires awkward pairings of those, then any subsequent Review as things stand is meant to take into account existing boundaries as a positive criterion. If you want the law changed so that the 2030 Review is allowed to start from scratch, then lobby your Senedd member about it. |
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🏴☠️ Neath West 🏴☠️
Conservative & Unionist
Party hats roasting on an open fire...
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Post by 🏴☠️ Neath West 🏴☠️ on Jul 29, 2024 8:58:56 GMT
Further up this thread many months ago I stated that I hoped the 2030 review would start with a blank piece of paper and not the pre-1974 boundaries which some people are so wedded to. Well, guilty as charged. The real problem with the 2030 Review as things stand is that it'll be indirectly wedded to the 2023 Westminster boundaries. The current quick Review requires awkward pairings of those, then any subsequent Review as things stand is meant to take into account existing boundaries as a positive criterion. If you want the law changed so that the 2030 Review is allowed to start from scratch, then lobby your Senedd member about it. The best way to force starting from scratch would be to amend 16 6-seaters to 24 4-seaters from the 2030 review onwards. It would result in a much less unwieldy map. |
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Post by Penddu on Jul 29, 2024 10:02:31 GMT
Hmm don't agree with you re people's lack of affinity with Glamorgan. Everyone I know (in Glamorgan) associates with it - but without getting hung up on its borders.
It is not about 1974 counties or even 13th century ones or 5th century kingdoms. And next to nothing to do with a cricket team.
It is a natural geographical area which accurately describes where people are from - although it is less clear in the Rhymney valley.
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Post by Penddu on Jul 29, 2024 10:05:45 GMT
Well, guilty as charged. The real problem with the 2030 Review as things stand is that it'll be indirectly wedded to the 2023 Westminster boundaries. The current quick Review requires awkward pairings of those, then any subsequent Review as things stand is meant to take into account existing boundaries as a positive criterion. If you want the law changed so that the 2030 Review is allowed to start from scratch, then lobby your Senedd member about it. The best way to force starting from scratch would be to amend 16 6-seaters to 24 4-seaters from the 2030 review onwards. It would result in a much less unwieldy map. While I think that 6 member seats are better for proportional democracy, I agree that in rural areas smaller 4 or 5 member seats may be better to improve locality. But only in rural areas. |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Jul 29, 2024 10:23:28 GMT
Hmm don't agree with you re people's lack of affinity with Glamorgan. Everyone I know (in Glamorgan) associates with it - but without getting hung up on its borders. We clearly operate in very differnet circles.  Yes, agreed and I'm all for that. Coast to the South Mountains to the North etc (Although East and West are less obvious, especially as you say in the East). Although today any kind of large area/organisation in South Wales should focus on Economic growth and transport and IMO can't not include Newport and the Gwent Valleys etc I'm going to have to politely disagree. Almost no one bar political/historical geeks under the age of 40 who live in Swansea, Neath or Port Talbot in 2024 will have any emotional or cultural ties to the word Glamorgan. Cricket, I'll give you that, but even to most people my age (39) in Cardiff, Glamorgan is meaningless. |
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Post by Penddu on Jul 29, 2024 10:34:04 GMT
Maybe because I am older (63) as are most of my acquaintances...
But just to be clear - I am not suggesting that any new constituencies or local government should be based on historic boundaries (which are all artificial). They should be ideally be based on population and economic units (eg capital city region) and natural boundaries (mountains, estuaries etc).
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,599
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Post by cibwr on Aug 26, 2024 13:34:47 GMT
I have just read the report of the Local Government Commission archive.org/details/op1265355-1001/page/n4/mode/1up from the early 1960s, there they try to talk about natural units with reference to geographical features, watersheds, mountain ranges, transport links and in some cases history, going back before the conquest even. Its an interesting historical document. I know it's about local government but still relevant in this discussion. |
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
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Post by J.G.Harston on Aug 26, 2024 15:59:51 GMT
I have just read the report of the Local Government Commission archive.org/details/op1265355-1001/page/n4/mode/1up from the early 1960s, there they try to talk about natural units with reference to geographical features, watersheds, mountain ranges, transport links and in some cases history, going back before the conquest even. Its an interesting historical document. I know it's about local government but still relevant in this discussion. Ooo, wonderful. I shall add it to my collection with copy of the Redcliffe-Maud report. Do you have a link to the maps? |
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Post by doktorb🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️ on Aug 29, 2024 7:19:49 GMT
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,599
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Post by cibwr on Aug 29, 2024 7:24:30 GMT
I have just read the report of the Local Government Commission archive.org/details/op1265355-1001/page/n4/mode/1up from the early 1960s, there they try to talk about natural units with reference to geographical features, watersheds, mountain ranges, transport links and in some cases history, going back before the conquest even. Its an interesting historical document. I know it's about local government but still relevant in this discussion. Ooo, wonderful. I shall add it to my collection with copy of the Redcliffe-Maud report. Do you have a link to the maps? Unfortunately no - there are some in the document but the annexes with the maps are missing - I did find a copy in Cardiff Library some years ago but it didn't include the maps. Its a fascinating look at the capability of the counties and their workforce. One of the more comprehensive looks at local government that I have seen. |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Sept 2, 2024 9:32:53 GMT
Drumroll please
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Harry Hayfield
Green
Cavalier Gentleman (as in 17th century Cavalier)
Posts: 2,922
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Post by Harry Hayfield on Sept 2, 2024 15:10:46 GMT
Yikes, I thought it was going to be published at 9.00am on the morning of the 3rd |
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Post by doktorb🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️ on Sept 2, 2024 15:17:47 GMT
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Post by Penddu on Sept 2, 2024 15:22:15 GMT
Popcorn time....
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nyx
Non-Aligned
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Post by nyx on Sept 2, 2024 15:22:18 GMT
Think my final prediction is
Monmouthshire+Torfaen
Newport East+West
Blaenau Gwent+Merthyr
Caerphilly+Pontypridd
Cardiff E+N
Cardiff S+W
Vale+Bridgend
Rhondda+Aberafan
Neath+Brecon
Swansea W+Gower
Llanelli+Carmarthen
Pembrokeshire+Ceredigion
Montgomeryshire+Wrexham
Clwyd East+Alyn and Deeside
Clwyd North+Aberconwy
Ynys Mon+Meirionydd
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Post by Penddu on Sept 2, 2024 15:28:32 GMT
Two big decisions to make:
Ynys Môn with Dwyfor Meirionydd or Bangor Aberconwy.
All remaining North Wales seats then follow easily.
Brecon, Radnorshire & Cwmtawe with either Monmouthshire (my preference), Ceredigion, Caerfyrddin or Swansea East & Neath (my least favourite).
Everything else in South and West Wales then follows relatively easily.
I will not be able to sleep tonight in anticipation...
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