Welsh Parliament is set to expand

[john07]

May 10, 2024 11:14:15 GMT The Bishop said:

And local byelections in Scotland are de facto conducted by AV.

Unless, presumably, a double vacancy occurred?

[Crimson King]

Jul 12, 2024 14:42:22 GMT LDCaerdydd said:

Jul 12, 2024 14:16:06 GMT nyx said:

So, if the Welsh government were to collapse leading to an election before 2026, under what system would the election be held?

The current system, here's the relevant part of the explanatory note:

There is a convention that changes to electoral law should come into force at least 6 months before the date of the notice of the election at which they first apply. This is to give electoral administrators certainty as to the law governing a forthcoming election and sufficient time to prepare for it, including time to understand and give effect to changes in the law. For this reason, whilst section 25 provides for the changes made by this Act to the size of the Senedd, constituencies, the voting system and disqualification of candidates and Members, together with the related amendments to other enactments (see section 10), to come into force two months after Royal Assent, the effect of section 24 is to delay those changes from taking effect until the first general election held on or after 7 April 2026 (for these purposes, it is the date of the poll for the general election that is relevant). That date is the earliest date the Presiding Officer could, under section 4 of the 2006 Act, propose for the poll for the next scheduled ordinary general election (which, under section 3 of the 2006 Act, is scheduled for 7 May 2026). The result of section 24 is that any general election which may be held before that date [May 2026], would be held under the pre-existing law i.e. the mixed member electoral system provided for in the 2006 Act. Similarly, the Act’s other changes mentioned in section 24(1) and (2) (including, for example, the changes to how vacancies arising between general elections are dealt with) will not take effect in respect of any Senedd returned as a result of a poll which is held before 7 April 2026.

On a separate note I'd imagine now the GE is out of the way we will see an announcement (unlikely to be any public consultation) on the parings this side of Christmas.

will that be subject to a peel?

[stb12]

Jul 12, 2024 15:03:56 GMT john07 said:

May 10, 2024 11:14:15 GMT The Bishop said:

And local byelections in Scotland are de facto conducted by AV.

Unless, presumably, a double vacancy occurred?

Has happened now and then

[Harry Hayfield]

The newly empowered Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru formerly known as the Local Democracy and Boundary Commission for Wales has announced its timetable for the pairing exercise for the new Senedd.

July 19th 2024: Publication of "Da Rules"
September 2024: Inital Recommendations
December 2024: Secondary Recommendations based on consultation responses
March 2025: Final Recommendations based on consultation responses

And believes that the order of council will be done in May 2025, a year before the elections

[Deleted]

If a bigger Senedd, probably costing more money for the taxpayer, is the answer, then what is the question?

[peterl]

Jul 15, 2024 11:24:51 GMT @weld said:

If a bigger Senedd, probably costing more money for the taxpayer, is the answer, then what is the question?

How can we make ourselves seem more important?

[Davıd Boothroyd]

Jul 15, 2024 11:24:51 GMT @weld said:

If a bigger Senedd, probably costing more money for the taxpayer, is the answer, then what is the question?

How can we properly cope with the massive increase in powers and responsibilities that Senedd Cymru has, given that it was created as the 'National Assembly for Wales' and originally intended to be run like a super all-Wales county council, and was never intended to go anywhere near making primarly legislation.

[Harry Hayfield]

Jul 15, 2024 11:24:51 GMT @weld said:

If a bigger Senedd, probably costing more money for the taxpayer, is the answer, then what is the question?

My belief is that the question is "How can the Senedd and the Welsh Government govern Wales effectively, when of the 30 members of the Welsh Labour Party, 19 are involved in government?"

[LDCaerdydd]

Jul 15, 2024 18:29:43 GMT Harry Hayfield said:

Jul 15, 2024 11:24:51 GMT @weld said:

If a bigger Senedd, probably costing more money for the taxpayer, is the answer, then what is the question?

My belief is that the question is "How can the Senedd and the Welsh Government govern Wales effectively, when of the 30 members of the Welsh Labour Party, 19 are involved in government?"

14 Labour members are ministers not 19.
The figure is higher when you include the Deputy Presiding Officer and I assume you’re also including Committee Chairs?

You are correct in highlighting the lack of genuine back backbenchers.

[peterl]

Jul 15, 2024 18:33:51 GMT LDCaerdydd said:

Jul 15, 2024 18:29:43 GMT Harry Hayfield said:

My belief is that the question is "How can the Senedd and the Welsh Government govern Wales effectively, when of the 30 members of the Welsh Labour Party, 19 are involved in government?"

14 Labour members are ministers not 19.
The figure is higher when you include the Deputy Presiding Officer and I assume you’re also including Committee Chairs?

You are correct in highlighting the lack of genuine back backbenchers.

Maybe cutting the number of ministers would be a better solution. The Scottish Parliament has the same number and more responsibilities to cover, so Wales should be able to make do with say 10.

[LDCaerdydd]

Jul 15, 2024 18:42:36 GMT peterl said:

Jul 15, 2024 18:33:51 GMT LDCaerdydd said:

You are correct in highlighting the lack of genuine back backbenchers.

Maybe cutting the number of ministers would be a better solution. The Scottish Parliament has the same number and more responsibilities to cover, so Wales should be able to make do with say 10.

Scottish Government has:
11 Cabinet Ministers
14 Deputy Ministers

Wales has 11 Cabinet and 3 Deputies.

[ilerda]

Jul 15, 2024 15:47:37 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

Jul 15, 2024 11:24:51 GMT @weld said:

If a bigger Senedd, probably costing more money for the taxpayer, is the answer, then what is the question?

How can we properly cope with the massive increase in powers and responsibilities that Senedd Cymru has, given that it was created as the 'National Assembly for Wales' and originally intended to be run like a super all-Wales county council, and was never intended to go anywhere near making primarly legislation.

I’d be more sympathetic if they didn’t spend their time on secondary issues like blanket 20mph speed limits and banning free drink refills. There seems to be a concerted effort to avoid the serious work of national government in favour of acting like a supercharged local authority. 

[nyx]

I'm of the opinion that expanding the Senedd makes sense, but the electoral system does not.

I'd have gone for 96 single-member constituencies elected by AV, thus ensuring that even rural communities get genuinely local representation. Party-list seats twice the size of Westminster constituencies aren't the way to be representative.

[Davıd Boothroyd]

Jul 15, 2024 21:58:35 GMT ilerda said:

Jul 15, 2024 15:47:37 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

How can we properly cope with the massive increase in powers and responsibilities that Senedd Cymru has, given that it was created as the 'National Assembly for Wales' and originally intended to be run like a super all-Wales county council, and was never intended to go anywhere near making primarly legislation.

I’d be more sympathetic if they didn’t spend their time on secondary issues like blanket 20mph speed limits and banning free drink refills. There seems to be a concerted effort to avoid the serious work of national government in favour of acting like a supercharged local authority. 

If that's the argument, I think it should be turned round. If you think the legislation coming from the Senedd is bad, that may be because it was never properly examined. One of the arguments for expansion of the Senedd is that it will mean more backbench and opposition MSs more time to scrutinise proposed legislation.

[Foggy]

Jul 15, 2024 22:54:50 GMT nyx said:

I'm of the opinion that expanding the Senedd makes sense, but the electoral system does not.

I'd have gone for 96 single-member constituencies elected by AV, thus ensuring that even rural communities get genuinely local representation. Party-list seats twice the size of Westminster constituencies aren't the way to be representative.

If you're going down that route you might as well go for a lower figure than 96, and make it odd while you're at it. The reason we've ended up with such a big increase is (other than kicking things into the long grass - gradual increases since 1999 might've been easier to swallow) a combination of timescales and the particular system demanded by Plaid in order to get the bill through with the required two-thirds majority. 

As for mundane things like yesterday's drinks refills announcement: the party of inertia and the status quo are desperately trying to find things to fill a five-year legislative programme. Fortunately this will be going back down to four years from 2026. 

[Deleted]

If a Welsh Parliament is the answer, what's the question? We don't need it. The Welsh NHS is a basket case, isn't it? It's just a more humdrum version of the Midlands. 

[greatkingrat]

Jul 15, 2024 23:14:44 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

Jul 15, 2024 21:58:35 GMT ilerda said:

I’d be more sympathetic if they didn’t spend their time on secondary issues like blanket 20mph speed limits and banning free drink refills. There seems to be a concerted effort to avoid the serious work of national government in favour of acting like a supercharged local authority. 

If that's the argument, I think it should be turned round. If you think the legislation coming from the Senedd is bad, that may be because it was never properly examined. One of the arguments for expansion of the Senedd is that it will mean more backbench and opposition MSs more time to scrutinise proposed legislation.

Although even with 650 MPs, scrutiny of Westminster legislation isn't exactly great!

[LDCaerdydd]

Jul 16, 2024 9:06:04 GMT @weld said:

We don't need it.

Sent from Highbury.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2024 9:50:15 GMT LDCaerdydd said:

Jul 16, 2024 9:06:04 GMT @weld said:

We don't need it.

Sent from Highbury.

Libellous comment. I live in Highgate lol 

[East Anglian Lefty]

It doesn't particularly matter where in the N postcode area the poorly thought-through reckons are coming from. Parties have stood on a policy of abolishing Wales's devolved institutions and have uniformly done poorly. The Welsh electorate reckon that the Welsh Parliament is required, it makes very little difference that weld has his own uninformed opinions.