Leicester East

[neilm]

Oct 28, 2021 12:23:11 GMT timmullen1 said:

Oct 28, 2021 11:24:24 GMT right said:

Not according to the NEC

labourlist.org/2021/10/revealed-labours-selection-process-for-old-bexley-and-sidcup-by-election/

I suppose the obvious problem with the Rule change is in a constituency that’s not Labour held, but more competitive, and Labour aren’t in control of calling the by-election; an unscrupulous defending Party might be minded to trigger the date before Labour have a candidate in-situ.

An unscrupulous attacking party might do the same. If I was a Tory whip I'd be minded to call this as soon as a vacancy arose. Obviously that would open up a tit-for-tat, though.

[mattbewilson]

Oct 28, 2021 12:23:11 GMT timmullen1 said:

Oct 28, 2021 11:24:24 GMT right said:

Not according to the NEC

labourlist.org/2021/10/revealed-labours-selection-process-for-old-bexley-and-sidcup-by-election/

I suppose the obvious problem with the Rule change is in a constituency that’s not Labour held, but more competitive, and Labour aren’t in control of calling the by-election; an unscrupulous defending Party might be minded to trigger the date before Labour have a candidate in-situ.

The new process does seem more drawn out, specifying that the five Executive Committee members will be appointed by the Executive Committee, so that’s probably a week minimum - given the seven day notice period stipulated in order to hold an EC meeting. Some ECs might also be hard pressed to find five delegates - our EC is only nine strong, and prior to 2019’s election, six applied for selection, thereby disqualifying themselves from the shortlisting panel.

as I understood it the panel of 5 was only a majority appointed by EC not all 5.

I also understood the process in this by election isn't the new process, the NEC is to clarify the rule change at a future meeting

[timmullen1]

Oct 28, 2021 21:46:14 GMT mattbewilson said:

Oct 28, 2021 12:23:11 GMT timmullen1 said:

I suppose the obvious problem with the Rule change is in a constituency that’s not Labour held, but more competitive, and Labour aren’t in control of calling the by-election; an unscrupulous defending Party might be minded to trigger the date before Labour have a candidate in-situ.

The new process does seem more drawn out, specifying that the five Executive Committee members will be appointed by the Executive Committee, so that’s probably a week minimum - given the seven day notice period stipulated in order to hold an EC meeting. Some ECs might also be hard pressed to find five delegates - our EC is only nine strong, and prior to 2019’s election, six applied for selection, thereby disqualifying themselves from the shortlisting panel.

as I understood it the panel of 5 was only a majority appointed by EC not all 5.

I also understood the process in this by election isn't the new process, the NEC is to clarify the rule change at a future meeting

Sorry, my bad recollection, it is a majority, but I’d misremembered it as 5-4 CLP not 3-2. The fact it’s not the new process was the original point made by right

[mattbewilson]

Oct 28, 2021 21:51:12 GMT timmullen1 said:

Oct 28, 2021 21:46:14 GMT mattbewilson said:

as I understood it the panel of 5 was only a majority appointed by EC not all 5.

I also understood the process in this by election isn't the new process, the NEC is to clarify the rule change at a future meeting

Sorry, my bad recollection, it is a majority, but I’d misremembered it as 5-4 CLP not 3-2. The fact it’s not the new process was the original point made by right

what i mean is the process for selecting the candidate for this by election is a new process but it isn't the new process. As I understood it a statement from the nec was issued which explained that for the upcoming by election there would a different process in the spirit of the rule change but not maj sought for and there would be further clarify at the next nec

[timmullen1]

Oct 28, 2021 23:12:09 GMT mattbewilson said:

Oct 28, 2021 21:51:12 GMT timmullen1 said:

Sorry, my bad recollection, it is a majority, but I’d misremembered it as 5-4 CLP not 3-2. The fact it’s not the new process was the original point made by right

what i mean is the process for selecting the candidate for this by election is a new process but it isn't the new process. As I understood it a statement from the nec was issued which explained that for the upcoming by election there would a different process in the spirit of the rule change but not maj sought for and there would be further clarify at the next nec

Not according to the Labour List report quoted earlier.

[mattbewilson]

Oct 28, 2021 23:13:43 GMT timmullen1 said:

Oct 28, 2021 23:12:09 GMT mattbewilson said:

what i mean is the process for selecting the candidate for this by election is a new process but it isn't the new process. As I understood it a statement from the nec was issued which explained that for the upcoming by election there would a different process in the spirit of the rule change but not maj sought for and there would be further clarify at the next nec

Not according to the Labour List report quoted earlier.

Labour List says the panel is a mix of nec, region and clp. I understood it that previously shortlisting for a by election was a panel of 3 from the nec

[timmullen1]

Oct 29, 2021 9:02:01 GMT mattbewilson said:

Oct 28, 2021 23:13:43 GMT timmullen1 said:

Not according to the Labour List report quoted earlier.

Labour List says the panel is a mix of nec, region and clp. I understood it that previously shortlisting for a by election was a panel of 3 from the nec

Not always; it’s sometimes a make it up as you go along I think; Stoke Central was, to my recollection, the CLP Chair (who was later expelled from the Party for protesting too loudly), Chair of the Regional Board, NEC member (IIRC Keith Vaz), rep from a trade union affiliated to the CLP (Unison at a guess as they had a Constituency Plan Agreement) and a member of the Local Campaign Forum.

[mattbewilson]

Oct 29, 2021 11:19:42 GMT timmullen1 said:

Oct 29, 2021 9:02:01 GMT mattbewilson said:

Labour List says the panel is a mix of nec, region and clp. I understood it that previously shortlisting for a by election was a panel of 3 from the nec

Not always; it’s sometimes a make it up as you go along I think; Stoke Central was, to my recollection, the CLP Chair (who was later expelled from the Party for protesting too loudly), Chair of the Regional Board, NEC member (IIRC Keith Vaz), rep from a trade union affiliated to the CLP (Unison at a guess as they had a Constituency Plan Agreement) and a member of the Local Campaign Forum.

i think make it up as you go along is fairly accurate

[mrhell]

[Wisconsin]

Is 10 weeks suspended sufficient to trigger the Act?

[YL]

Nov 4, 2021 15:48:37 GMT Wisconsin said:

Is 10 weeks suspended sufficient to trigger the Act?

Yes (but not until potential appeals have been dealt with).

[Davıd Boothroyd]

She has indicated an appeal against sentence, which means the recall petition procedure will not start until the appeal has been decided.

[cogload]

Nov 4, 2021 15:51:58 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

She has indicated an appeal against sentence, which means the recall petition procedure will not start until the appeal has been decided.

That was flagged up the minute the trial ended.

[elinorhelyn]

Claudia Webbe has been expelled from the Labour Party

[Davıd Boothroyd]

NB that "has been" - it happened when she was convicted.

[elinorhelyn]

Nov 4, 2021 17:00:24 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

NB that "has been" - it happened when she was convicted.

No she had the whip removed, she was no longer a Labour MP but still a Labour member, now she is no longer a Labour member.

[greenhert]

Nov 4, 2021 15:51:58 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

She has indicated an appeal against sentence, which means the recall petition procedure will not start until the appeal has been decided.

I doubt her appeal will succeed. And when will it be decided by the Crown Court (given that she is appealing a judgement from the Magistrates' Court)?

[timmullen1]

Nov 4, 2021 18:28:41 GMT greenhert said:

Nov 4, 2021 15:51:58 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

She has indicated an appeal against sentence, which means the recall petition procedure will not start until the appeal has been decided.

I doubt her appeal will succeed. And when will it be decided by the Crown Court (given that she is appealing a judgement from the Magistrates' Court)?

I don’t know if this is a standard timeline, but Onasanya was found guilty in the January and lost her appeal in March, so factoring in a court shutdown over Christmas/New Year, we may be looking at March/April.

[peterl]

Nov 4, 2021 19:24:22 GMT timmullen1 said:

Nov 4, 2021 18:28:41 GMT greenhert said:

I doubt her appeal will succeed. And when will it be decided by the Crown Court (given that she is appealing a judgement from the Magistrates' Court)?

I don’t know if this is a standard timeline, but Onasanya was found guilty in the January and lost her appeal in March, so factoring in a court shutdown over Christmas/New Year, we may be looking at March/April.

However, Onasanya was convicted at the Crown Court and thus appealed to the Court of Appeal, Webbe was convicted before the Magistrates Court and will appeal to the Crown Court. Webbe's appeal might well be heard more rapidly, as it requires I believe it is a judge and two magistrates to hear it, as opposed to a panel of three appeal court judges.

[southernliberal]

Nov 4, 2021 19:24:22 GMT timmullen1 said:

Nov 4, 2021 18:28:41 GMT greenhert said:

I doubt her appeal will succeed. And when will it be decided by the Crown Court (given that she is appealing a judgement from the Magistrates' Court)?

I don’t know if this is a standard timeline, but Onasanya was found guilty in the January and lost her appeal in March, so factoring in a court shutdown over Christmas/New Year, we may be looking at March/April.

Would add that there's a much worse court backlog now as a result of COVID so probably best to be slightly pessimistic when it comes to timelines, so we are probably actually now looking at a very similar timeline to Onasanya except for probably an extra month or two to get the appeal processed: 

Result of appeal known - March 2022
If appeal is denied, a recall petition opens - March 2022
Recall petition closes - May 2022
If recall petition hits 10%, by-election called for June 2022