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Post by LDCaerdydd on Feb 7, 2018 13:37:38 GMT
Most un-welsh constituency then Monmouth? No. Dispite the derisory performance of the English Democrats, Monmouth still has an affiliation to Cardiff that extends beyond Rugby. No where is Alyn and Deeside would have that. |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Feb 7, 2018 15:04:43 GMT
No. Dispite the derisory performance of the English Democrats, Monmouth still has an affiliation to Cardiff that extends beyond Rugby. No where is Alyn and Deeside would have that. If you are talking about an extended area then Clwyd, Powys, Pembrokeshire, and Monmouthshire all have close ties to England. Cardiff, Newport and their surroundings also have fairly close ties to England in contrast to Swansea and upper parts of the Welsh Valleys (where there are fewer English-born and there is more distance to the border). Naturally, north-west Wales tends to be the most removed from England linguistically (more Welsh-speaking) and geographically (more remote and further away from the border), though there is a significant English-born population in Ceredigion and to a lesser extent elsewhere in the north-west. I originally said this was "probably is the most un-welsh bit of Wales" I later clarified that by 'bit' I meant constituency. I would argue that apart from potentially supporting Wales in the Rugby - there's very little for residents to feel Welsh about. The language is hardly spoken, they're isolated from the Assembly, their local hospital is in England, large chunks of their employment and leisure time is spent in England. This area looks towards places like Chester, Liverpool and to a lesser extent Manchester far more than it does to Cardiff. I've lived in Cardiff sine 2008 and moved here after almost two years of living in Powys (inc a six month stint just over the border on the edge of Oswestry) - yes there are ties to England in both places, but name me a county or constituency that has as more ties to England than Alyn and Deeside. I'm not saying Alyn and Deeside is an anti-Welsh area, but they do look and depend on England out of necessity and choice far more than other areas. Yesterday I mentioned the low turnouts in this Assembly seat and the high turnouts in the coterminous Westminster seat. In the 2011 Powers referendum Flintshire recorded a yes vote of 62% (just below average) on a turn out of 29% (way below average). People everywhere often say they are forgotten about by their political leaders, I think it's clear here that the population of A&D feel far better represented by and see more relevance with Westminister than Cardiff Bay (and I pass no judgment on the areas AMs and MPs to date). |
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Sibboleth
Labour
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Post by Sibboleth on Feb 7, 2018 15:27:00 GMT
It's a border area - the cultural border between Wales and England is broad and porous on both sides. So there are strong English influences in Flintshire (going back a very long way as well - its political status in the Middle Ages for instance was... complicated), but there are also strong Welsh influences in Chester (especially!), Liverpool and so on.
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Post by ccoleman on Feb 7, 2018 15:48:51 GMT
I know this guy from Wrexham who strongly affiliates with NW England over Wales.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2018 16:01:59 GMT
Is the reason that the Tories are less competitive in the assembly because their vote only comes out at a GE
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2018 16:09:16 GMT
Unlike almost every other seat in Wales, Wrexham actually swung to the Conservatives in 2017.
It also swung to the Tories in 2015 while Alyn & Deeside and Delyn saw static Labour holds.
A swing of 3.1% from LAB to CON since 2010.
2015 majority: 1,831 (5.6%)
2017 majority: 1,832 (5.2%)
Yes, the majority was up by 1 vote!
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goose
Conservative & Unionist
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Post by goose on Feb 7, 2018 16:14:36 GMT
Most un-welsh constituency then Monmouth? Having watched the Rugby in an Abergavenny pub on Sunday, I can tell you Monmouth is most definitely Welsh. |
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Post by Adam in Stroud on Feb 7, 2018 17:39:22 GMT
It's a border area - the cultural border between Wales and England is broad and porous on both sides. So there are strong English influences in Flintshire (going back a very long way as well - its political status in the Middle Ages for instance was... complicated), but there are also strong Welsh influences in Chester (especially!), Liverpool and so on. I've always thought there was quite a lot of Welsh (and Irish of course) in the Liverpool accent, and presumed that quite a lot of the population of Victorian Liverpool were drawn there from North Wales. |
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Tom
Unionist
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Post by Tom on Feb 7, 2018 17:42:42 GMT
I wonder what the most 'English' part of Scotland is (to the extent that that is possible)? My suggestion would be the Borders, Edinburgh and bits of Aberdeenshire.
In Northern Ireland, it would have to be North Down: Holywood, Bangor, the area around Stormont etc. Portrush feels very much like an English seaside town too.
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Sibboleth
Labour
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Post by Sibboleth on Feb 7, 2018 17:55:29 GMT
and presumed that quite a lot of the population of Victorian Liverpool were drawn there from North Wales. This would be correct. Actually Liverpool at the time was sometimes referred to as the capital of North Wales. |
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Sibboleth
Labour
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Post by Sibboleth on Feb 7, 2018 18:09:04 GMT
I think there's more Irish than Welsh in the Liverpool accent personally - it's a sort of cross between rest-of-Lancs & Ireland. However, some of the vowels (like saying wairkers instead of workers) have origins that it's less easy to identify. It's more extreme in the Liverpudlian accent, but harsh vowels not entirely unlike those are found in some accents along the coast of North Wales - around Caernarfon, say. |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Feb 7, 2018 19:33:03 GMT
and presumed that quite a lot of the population of Victorian Liverpool were drawn there from North Wales. This would be correct. Actually Liverpool at the time was sometimes referred to as the capital of North Wales.And I'm sure there are plenty out there who would gladly offload it onto us...  |
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Foggy
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Post by Foggy on Feb 8, 2018 0:48:04 GMT
This would be correct. Actually Liverpool at the time was sometimes referred to as the capital of North Wales.And I'm sure there are plenty out there who would gladly offload it onto us... Not only that, the senior men's Welsh football team has of course been known to play 'home' matches at Anfield too! |
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Post by Merseymike on Feb 8, 2018 8:43:50 GMT
I think there's more Irish than Welsh in the Liverpool accent personally - it's a sort of cross between rest-of-Lancs & Ireland. However, some of the vowels (like saying wairkers instead of workers) have origins that it's less easy to identify. The "ckkkkkk" sound in the Scouse accent is from Wales though it's actually become much stronger in Liverpool over the past 50 years. |
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cefin
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Post by cefin on Feb 8, 2018 10:49:18 GMT
And I'm sure there are plenty out there who would gladly offload it onto us... Not only that, the senior men's Welsh football team has of course been known to play 'home' matches at Anfield too! Only because the ludicrous parasitic senile members of the Welsh FA wanted to maximise takings from a capacity crowd in a larger ground in order to fund their free trips abroad on 'official business' With 4 quite tidy grounds in Wales now they don't have to any more. |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
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Post by Chris from Brum on Feb 8, 2018 11:29:19 GMT
With 4 quite tidy grounds in Wales now they don't have to any more. The Cardiff City ground, the Liberty and the Millennium I can name straightaway. Do you really count the Racecourse in Wrexham? |
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Post by gwynthegriff on Feb 8, 2018 12:49:31 GMT
I think there's more Irish than Welsh in the Liverpool accent personally - it's a sort of cross between rest-of-Lancs & Ireland. However, some of the vowels (like saying wairkers instead of workers) have origins that it's less easy to identify. The "ckkkkkk" sound in the Scouse accent is from Wales though it's actually become much stronger in Liverpool over the past 50 years. Can you give us an example of this "ckkkkkk" sound? Curiously, Scouse is probably the British accent I find most difficult to understand which would be surprising if it has strong Welsh influences. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 13:07:44 GMT
I wonder what the most 'English' part of Scotland is (to the extent that that is possible)? My suggestion would be the Borders, Edinburgh and bits of Aberdeenshire. In Northern Ireland, it would have to be North Down: Holywood, Bangor, the area around Stormont etc. Portrush feels very much like an English seaside town too. Definitely Dumfriesshire imo, they even sound English😉😂 |
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cefin
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Post by cefin on Feb 8, 2018 13:31:11 GMT
With 4 quite tidy grounds in Wales now they don't have to any more. The Cardiff City ground, the Liberty and the Millennium I can name straightaway. Do you really count the Racecourse in Wrexham? Quite right, my miscounting. Make that 3 more tidy grounds than when the FAW gave away home advantage to the violent marauding hooligan Scottish mob that continually lobbed empty whisky bottles before charging at the Welsh supporters in the supposed home Kop end. Just before the eternal cheat Joe Jordan made his only ever memorable contribution to football in the Anfield penalty box. |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
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Post by Chris from Brum on Feb 8, 2018 13:35:33 GMT
It's a shame that all those grounds are in South Wales, given that North Wales is far more football-centric. The majority of Welsh Premier League clubs are from there, aren't they? But AIUI the Racecourse Ground is a bit of a wreck these days.
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