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Post by Antiochian on Dec 22, 2016 11:44:46 GMT
The Labourites can chuckle at Balls but frankly Strictly has made him a supernova (out of a black hole) and he would waltz in (pardon the pun) in Copeland. So is that a prediction? Celebrities will win everything in 2017. That is quite possible, and such an utterly depressing thought that i think I'll just go out now and dig a big hole in my garden to hide in. We had the Chief Apprentice win in 2016... and maybe Balls doing a paso doble in Copeland with Beppo Grillo at some point offering the last laugh.. so yes... |
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Post by justin124 on Dec 22, 2016 12:15:27 GMT
I may have missed it, but has anyone yet pointed out that this seat will effectively be abolished for 2020? Ditto Liverpool Walton for the other likely by-election this term.... Only if the Boundary changes are approved! |
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Post by justin124 on Dec 22, 2016 12:19:15 GMT
Hello, My first time to post but am a long time reader. I read today that Ed Balls or Tony Blair are considering putting themselves forward for this seat. www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/21/corbyn-critic-jamie-reed-quits-labour-mp-byelection-copelandI may sit in a strange position politically in that I'm from a working class family who have voted Labour their whole lives. But since Corbyn and Brexit I'm one of these who have been leaning towards UKIP. But I've also been really impressed with the ethos of Theresa May as vicars daughter and her pitch to improve life for working class people. It was at this point that I realised that May is offering the same hope that Blair offered in 96/97 & I started to re-evaluate my thoughts towards him. Yes he had to sell his soul, but he did a lot of good and he is a politician better than the current shambles in the labour party. I was wondering if people think the paper might be right and that this could be the time and place for Blair to make his return. I'd welcome him back if so with open arms. On a different note, will this seat have any traction for a progressive alliance? But the guy was downright evil ! You would really welcome back a war criminal more guilty of 'Planning for War' than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg - with the possible exception of Ribbentrop? |
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Post by carlton43 on Dec 22, 2016 12:33:10 GMT
Hello, My first time to post but am a long time reader. I read today that Ed Balls or Tony Blair are considering putting themselves forward for this seat. www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/21/corbyn-critic-jamie-reed-quits-labour-mp-byelection-copelandI may sit in a strange position politically in that I'm from a working class family who have voted Labour their whole lives. But since Corbyn and Brexit I'm one of these who have been leaning towards UKIP. But I've also been really impressed with the ethos of Theresa May as vicars daughter and her pitch to improve life for working class people. It was at this point that I realised that May is offering the same hope that Blair offered in 96/97 & I started to re-evaluate my thoughts towards him. Yes he had to sell his soul, but he did a lot of good and he is a politician better than the current shambles in the labour party. I was wondering if people think the paper might be right and that this could be the time and place for Blair to make his return. I'd welcome him back if so with open arms. On a different note, will this seat have any traction for a progressive alliance? But the guy was downright evil ! You would really welcome back a war criminal more guilty of 'Planning for War' than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg - with the possible exception of Ribbentrop? I just have to quote this in order to point at it and laugh at the stupidity of the poster. "...was downright evil". "...a war criminal". "...more guilty .....than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremburg". "...with the possible exception of Ribbentrop". Could this be re-worded to make it sillier or stupider? Right down to getting the least unpleasant of all the senior Nazis in place as the 'worst' one. What an amazing post! In a rich year I award it the 'Supreme Palme de Merde'. |
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Post by justin124 on Dec 22, 2016 12:40:52 GMT
But the guy was downright evil ! You would really welcome back a war criminal more guilty of 'Planning for War' than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg - with the possible exception of Ribbentrop? I just have to quote this in order to point at it and laugh at the stupidity of the poster. "...was downright evil". "...a war criminal". "...more guilty .....than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremburg". "...with the possible exception of Ribbentrop". Could this be re-worded to make it sillier or stupider? Right down to getting the least unpleasant of all the senior Nazis in place as the 'worst' one. What an amazing post! In a rich year I award it the 'Supreme Palme de Merde'. That is just plain ignorant. Of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg only Ribbentrop had any involvement in the decision to launch a war, Goering certainly did not want a war and made some effort to avoid it. Who else of the defendants would you suggest was involved? |
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The Bishop
Labour
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Post by The Bishop on Dec 22, 2016 12:45:59 GMT
The Labourites can chuckle at Balls but frankly Strictly has made him a supernova (out of a black hole) and he would waltz in (pardon the pun) in Copeland. You are as wrong about this as you are about almost everything else. Its quite endearing, really  |
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Post by carlton43 on Dec 22, 2016 12:50:20 GMT
The Labourites can chuckle at Balls but frankly Strictly has made him a supernova (out of a black hole) and he would waltz in (pardon the pun) in Copeland. You do know what supernova means I suppose? The public can be swayed a bit by minor celebrity but are not as shallow as you suppose in total. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2016 13:07:44 GMT
I just have to quote this in order to point at it and laugh at the stupidity of the poster. "...was downright evil". "...a war criminal". "...more guilty .....than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremburg". "...with the possible exception of Ribbentrop". Could this be re-worded to make it sillier or stupider? Right down to getting the least unpleasant of all the senior Nazis in place as the 'worst' one. What an amazing post! In a rich year I award it the 'Supreme Palme de Merde'. That is just plain ignorant. Of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg only Ribbentrop had any involvement in the decision to launch a war, Goering certainly did not want a war and made some effort to avoid it. Who else of the defendants would you suggest was involved? Goering only wanted to avoid a war with Great Britain, hecertainly had no problem with invading countries. Alfred Jodl was the general at the centre of planning the invasion of Poland, Holland, Belgium and Norway - he gave the orders for the invasions. Wilhelm Keitel was, from 1938, the effective War Minister in Hitler's cabinet, and was intricately involved in the invasion and dismemberment of Czechoslovakia (he was, for a brief time, military governor of the Sudetenland). Your premise is totally wrong, Ribbentrop was not the only one involved in the decision to go to war. |
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Post by Adam in Stroud on Dec 22, 2016 13:27:25 GMT
Goering only wanted to avoid a war with Great Britain, hecertainly had no problem with invading countries. I can't help imagining the scene at Berchtesgaden. Hitler: It's not fair, Hermann never wants me to invade anyone. Goering: No, no, Adolf, I don't have any problem with invasions, just not Britain. How about Russia? Would you like to invade Russia? |
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Post by justin124 on Dec 22, 2016 13:57:59 GMT
That is just plain ignorant. Of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg only Ribbentrop had any involvement in the decision to launch a war, Goering certainly did not want a war and made some effort to avoid it. Who else of the defendants would you suggest was involved? Goering only wanted to avoid a war with Great Britain, hecertainly had no problem with invading countries. Alfred Jodl was the general at the centre of planning the invasion of Poland, Holland, Belgium and Norway - he gave the orders for the invasions. Wilhelm Keitel was, from 1938, the effective War Minister in Hitler's cabinet, and was intricately involved in the invasion and dismemberment of Czechoslovakia (he was, for a brief time, military governor of the Sudetenland). Your premise is totally wrong, Ribbentrop was not the only one involved in the decision to go to war. Keitel and Jodl were professional soldiers who had no say whatsoever in the political decision to invade other countries. The General Staffs of all states act as directed by their political leaders but in no sense can they be said to 'will' the decision to invade. The same could be said of the British and American Staff officers involved in planning the attack on Iraq . They drew up the plans as ordered - but the decision to invade did not belong to them. The conviction of Jodl is now widely seen as a miscarriage of justice. Moreover, he was not involved in the plans to invade Poland in that he was not recalled from Austria to Berlin to work as Chief of Staff Operations until the last week of August 1939. By that time the die was cast. |
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Dec 22, 2016 13:58:32 GMT
The Labourites can chuckle at Balls but frankly Strictly has made him a supernova (out of a black hole) and he would waltz in (pardon the pun) in Copeland. You are as wrong about this as you are about almost everything else. Its quite endearing, really Senior Labour activist denies that Labour can win crucial by-election.  |
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Jack
Reform Party
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Post by Jack on Dec 22, 2016 13:59:33 GMT
Well, that's one way to guarantee losing the seat. |
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Post by justin124 on Dec 22, 2016 13:59:33 GMT
Goering only wanted to avoid a war with Great Britain, hecertainly had no problem with invading countries. I can't help imagining the scene at Berchtesgaden. Hitler: It's not fair, Hermann never wants me to invade anyone. Goering: No, no, Adolf, I don't have any problem with invasions, just not Britain. How about Russia? Would you like to invade Russia? Goering was also strongly opposed to the attack on USSR in 1941. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2016 14:04:17 GMT
I can't help imagining the scene at Berchtesgaden. Hitler: It's not fair, Hermann never wants me to invade anyone. Goering: No, no, Adolf, I don't have any problem with invasions, just not Britain. How about Russia? Would you like to invade Russia? Goering was also strongly opposed to the attack on USSR in 1941. Goering was always at heart a "Wilhelmine imperialist", who wanted to restore Germany's pre-1914 frontiers and achieve no more than a position of relative dominance in central and eastern Europe. Unfortunately, he was psychologically dominated by Hitler, and his own position within the Nazi hierarchy was steadily eroded by his failure to deliver on his promises. |
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Post by markgoodair on Dec 22, 2016 14:48:32 GMT
Goering was also strongly opposed to the attack on USSR in 1941. Goering was always at heart a "Wilhelmine imperialist", who wanted to restore Germany's pre-1914 frontiers and achieve no more than a position of relative dominance in central and eastern Europe. Unfortunately, he was psychologically dominated by Hitler, and his own position within the Nazi hierarchy was steadily eroded by his failure to deliver on his promises. I'm sure his drug addiction didn't exactly help either. |
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Post by carlton43 on Dec 22, 2016 14:49:56 GMT
I just have to quote this in order to point at it and laugh at the stupidity of the poster. "...was downright evil". "...a war criminal". "...more guilty .....than any of the Nazis tried at Nuremburg". "...with the possible exception of Ribbentrop". Could this be re-worded to make it sillier or stupider? Right down to getting the least unpleasant of all the senior Nazis in place as the 'worst' one. What an amazing post! In a rich year I award it the 'Supreme Palme de Merde'. That is just plain ignorant. Of the Nazis tried at Nuremberg only Ribbentrop had any involvement in the decision to launch a war, Goering certainly did not want a war and made some effort to avoid it. Who else of the defendants would you suggest was involved? Yes. That is my besetting sin. I know it. Ignorance. Dreadful thing...Ignorance. I grieve over it these long winter evenings in patient study of improving works. Doesn't seem to help! Still get it all wrong and see these chappies like von Ribbentrop and politician fellow Chamberlain I think it was? Do you know, I believe it was actually our chap that declared the war? Whereas von Ribbentrop (a charming man and family friend on my Mother's side......Stayed with them in Staffs quite often) was every inch the diplomat and tried to talk that Hitler fellow out of it. Frightful bounder Hitler you know. He was rude and pushy, injecting drug taker and even a vegetarian! Need I say more? Wouldn't be at all surprised if the war wasn't a bit of his fault really? He was just the sort you know. Lower class oik and only a corporal in the first show. |
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Post by tonygreaves on Dec 22, 2016 14:59:12 GMT
An absolute bounder...
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Copeland
Dec 22, 2016 14:59:26 GMT
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Dec 22, 2016 14:59:26 GMT
I would argue that Jodl should not have been hanged. And, revolting though he was, it strikes me that the odious Streicher should not have been hanged.
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Post by carlton43 on Dec 22, 2016 15:01:38 GMT
Absolute Shower the lot of them. Damn good job they were swiftly defeated. Who knows what they might have got up to. |
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Copeland
Dec 22, 2016 15:04:30 GMT
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Dec 22, 2016 15:04:30 GMT
Goering was always at heart a "Wilhelmine imperialist", who wanted to restore Germany's pre-1914 frontiers and achieve no more than a position of relative dominance in central and eastern Europe. Unfortunately, he was psychologically dominated by Hitler, and his own position within the Nazi hierarchy was steadily eroded by his failure to deliver on his promises. I'm sure his drug addiction didn't exactly help either. I remember a documentary that said that, of the defendants at Nuremberg, Goering was the most intelligent and eloquent under interrogation, once he was off the drugs. Even above Rosenberg and Speer. Whereas the likes of Ley were lunatics and jumped-up opportunists. |
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