iain
Lib Dem
Posts: 10,819
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Post by iain on Feb 27, 2017 23:25:43 GMT
You really can't see any difference between Macron & Le Pen?! I imagine Merseymike finds Macron too economically right wing to vote for. I'm sure he views Le Pen as worse but refuses to vote for somebody with views too different to his own. Ridiculous. I can understand voting for a candidate you don't think will win, but not voting for Macron over Le Pen (I assume) when there is such clear difference between them is pathetic.
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jamie
Top Poster
Posts: 6,892
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Post by jamie on Feb 27, 2017 23:31:22 GMT
Ridiculous. I can understand voting for a candidate you don't think will win, but not voting for Macron over Le Pen (I assume) when there is such clear difference between them is pathetic. I agree to a large extent. I think under any preferential/rounds system you can differentiate between candidates and should do so. However, some people aren't willing to vote for people they strongly disagree with under any circumstance (see Northern Ireland cross community voting, or lack of).
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Post by Merseymike on Feb 28, 2017 0:11:06 GMT
Makes sense for centrists to join a centrist party - given France doesn't have one this is a logical development. Wonder if any centrists from the right bloc will join him? I would spoil my ballot in person with a choice between any of the current front runners. You really can't see any difference between Macron & Le Pen?! Of course I can see the difference. That doesn't make me want to vote positively for either of them
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Post by Merseymike on Feb 28, 2017 0:12:01 GMT
You really can't see any difference between Macron & Le Pen?! I imagine Merseymike finds Macron too economically right wing to vote for. I'm sure he views Le Pen as worse but refuses to vote for somebody with views too different to his own. Exactly
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Khunanup
Lib Dem
Portsmouth Liberal Democrats
Posts: 11,565
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Post by Khunanup on Feb 28, 2017 11:37:41 GMT
I imagine Merseymike finds Macron too economically right wing to vote for. I'm sure he views Le Pen as worse but refuses to vote for somebody with views too different to his own. Exactly Useful Idiot.
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Tony Otim
Green
Suffering from Brexistential Despair
Posts: 11,371
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Post by Tony Otim on Feb 28, 2017 13:35:45 GMT
Now jadot has withdrawn, i would probably vote for macron in the first round. Not sure i would be exactly enthusiastic, but faced with the alternnatives...
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2017 13:40:58 GMT
Now Jadot has withdrawn, i would probably vote for Macron in the first round. Not sure I would be exactly enthusiastic, but faced with the alternnatives... Why not a self proclaimed eco-socialist like Hamon? He would be a lot closer to Jadot than Macron is.
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Post by Merseymike on Feb 28, 2017 14:11:57 GMT
Why should I vote for either of two candidates who I fundamentally disagree with - Macron for his liberal economics, LePen for her social views?
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mboy
Liberal
Listen. Think. Speak.
Posts: 22,458
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Post by mboy on Feb 28, 2017 14:17:20 GMT
I think the fact that Macron is basically a French Blair, who was a Labour PM, makes it surprising that a Labour activist wouldnt be able to choose between a prot-fascist and a clone of a former Labour PM.
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Khunanup
Lib Dem
Portsmouth Liberal Democrats
Posts: 11,565
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Post by Khunanup on Feb 28, 2017 14:29:03 GMT
Now Jadot has withdrawn, i would probably vote for Macron in the first round. Not sure I would be exactly enthusiastic, but faced with the alternnatives... Why not a self proclaimed eco-socialist like Hamon? He would be a lot closer to Jadot than Macron is. 'Cause Tony's no socialist...
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Khunanup
Lib Dem
Portsmouth Liberal Democrats
Posts: 11,565
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Post by Khunanup on Feb 28, 2017 14:30:37 GMT
Why should I vote for either of two candidates who I fundamentally disagree with - Macron for his liberal economics, LePen for her social views? As I say, Useful Idiot.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2017 14:37:30 GMT
52% of French farmers plan to abstain according to new Cevipof poll, Marine Le Pen leads among those who plan to vote. Its traditionally a strong Gaullist segment, but not anymore. Le Pen 35% François Fillon 20% Emmanuel Macron 20% Benoît Hamon 18% Jean-Luc Mélenchon 2% Others 5% (incl. Jadot)
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Post by slicesofjim on Feb 28, 2017 14:42:35 GMT
I think the fact that Macron is basically a French Blair, who was a Labour PM, makes it surprising that a Labour activist wouldnt be able to choose between a prot-fascist and a clone of a former Labour PM. Not surprising if you consider the sort of politics and policies that Macron espouses to generate the conditions in which movements like the FN flourish. To acknowledge a difference or distinction between them is not to suggest that either one is acceptable.
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Post by Merseymike on Feb 28, 2017 14:46:20 GMT
Why should I vote for either of two candidates who I fundamentally disagree with - Macron for his liberal economics, LePen for her social views? As I say, Useful Idiot. If you're happy to vote negatively, your choice.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2017 14:47:47 GMT
Why not a self proclaimed eco-socialist like Hamon? He would be a lot closer to Jadot than Macron is. 'Cause Tony's no socialist... The French Greens are basically an affiliate of PS, so no reason to vote for Jadot if you can't support someone like Hamon, who is among the most Green PS politicians. (and PS obviously isn't a Socialist party in the "lets overthrow of capitalism" sense)
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Post by slicesofjim on Feb 28, 2017 14:48:37 GMT
If you're happy to vote negatively, your choice. That's an interesting idea actually, everyone has one vote, but they can choose to exercise it positively or negatively, either adding one to the total of one candidate, or subtracting one from the total of another candidate.
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Post by Merseymike on Feb 28, 2017 14:48:54 GMT
I think the fact that Macron is basically a French Blair, who was a Labour PM, makes it surprising that a Labour activist wouldnt be able to choose between a prot-fascist and a clone of a former Labour PM. I wouldn't be voting Labour if we had our own 'clone of a former 'Labour' PM' either! You forget that I left the Labour party in 2003 because of Blair's policies. I then voted Labour in 2005 which I really regretted and vowed that I would never vote for someone purely to keep someone else out again. I'm sure I wouldn't want to vote for either Macron or LePen.
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Post by slicesofjim on Feb 28, 2017 14:49:18 GMT
'Cause Tony's no socialist... The French Greens are basically an affiliate of PS, so no reason to vote for Jadot if you can't support someone like Hamon, who is among the most Green PS politicians. (and PS obviously isn't a Socialist party in the "lets overthrow of capitalism" sense) But then neither is Melenchon and his crew.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2017 14:51:39 GMT
The French Greens are basically an affiliate of PS, so no reason to vote for Jadot if you can't support someone like Hamon, who is among the most Green PS politicians. (and PS obviously isn't a Socialist party in the "lets overthrow of capitalism" sense) But then neither is Melenchon and his crew. He isn't relevant in this context (or most other for that matter).
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Post by carlton43 on Feb 28, 2017 14:54:55 GMT
Why should I vote for either of two candidates who I fundamentally disagree with - Macron for his liberal economics, LePen for her social views? But in the event of not liking candidates surely it is normal and even necessary to opt for plan B in order to at least prevent the candidate you not only 'don't like' but feel to be a danger to the state and civil society? For instance, if Trump had been a populist red neck Democrat might you not have voted for say a Kaysich Republican as an antidote to a loud mouth wall builder and Muslim excluder and Hispanic deporter? Are you so wedded to purity that an unpalatable second best is not worth it and putting up with something worse is preferable because it preserves personal integrity and not being under taint of involvement?
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