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Post by gwynthegriff on Sept 13, 2016 21:25:03 GMT
But there are two Rhonddas, so would it be Cymoedd Rhondda/Rhondda Valleys? (Some of us remember a councillor whose description was "Independent Fighter For The Fach"!  ) Just call it Ystradyfodwg. Only if they let Dimblebore discuss the seat on election night. |
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Post by minionofmidas on Sept 13, 2016 21:43:50 GMT
And coming back to my whinge about names....why Vale of Glamorgan and Bridgend. Why not simply Bridgend which is the main population centre by far? And why Vale of Glamorgan East...why not simply Vale of Glamorgan....or better still Barry? Barry & Penarth. |
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Post by minionofmidas on Sept 13, 2016 21:45:42 GMT
Personally I'd rather see the Scottish Islands lose their protection and have them merged with somewhere else to make more equitable constituencies. My point being that if the Scottish Islands are eligible for preservation, why not Anglesey? I'd rather see them treated like any mainland ward to be honest. Anglesey has a bridge. Scilly doesn't, though. I think Scilly should have its own MP. |
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Post by minionofmidas on Sept 13, 2016 21:48:29 GMT
Am I alone in reading this as "Llanelli and Colour"? It refers to the former district of Lliw Valley ...but is pretty meaningless today...Loughor/Lwchwr would be more meaningful But mostly not in the seat. Although that wouldn't have stopped the English commission. |
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Post by minionofmidas on Sept 13, 2016 21:52:18 GMT
I am pretty certain that it isn't majority Welsh speaking, no. That said, it's blatantly gerryrigged to be as Welsh speaking as possible. |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,144 
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Post by Foggy on Sept 13, 2016 22:41:27 GMT
Disappointed that the name 'Alyn and Deeside' survives, but I can't argue with its boundaries. 'Eryri' is a good suggestion for the large seat to the south-west of it.
Ceredigion now contains parts of Carmarthenshire and Montgomeryshire, as well as Pembrokeshire. It might as well be called either Cardiganshire or simply 'Aberystwyth'.
Nomenclature get a bit messy in the south. This is a chance to rename Blaenau Gwent to 'Ebbw Vale'. We get Pontypridd and [the] Cynon Valley, but not 'Llantrisant and the Rhondda' or 'Swansea West and the Gower'. Rhymney somehow remains in a constituency name, as does the meaningless Torfaen.
Cardiff South and East sounds wrong. The shape of the seat would look fine were it not for the (sadly necessary) addition of Pontprennau/Old St Mellons ward. Vale of Glamorgan East could just as straightforwardly be 'Vale of Glamorgan', 'Rhoose and Sully' or 'Barry'. The seat to the west of it can then be called Bridgend, or 'Bridgend and Llantwit' if you absolutely must acknowledge the part in another local authority.
'Maesteg' seems more recognisable than Ogmore. The Port Talbot area is probably the only one where the boundaries themselves become questionable, however.
My instinct would've been to look north to Ammanford for the extra electors Llanelli needed, but what they've come up with is a lot neater. It doesn't require the 'and Lliw' part of the name, though.
If north Carmarthenshire can be named simply 'Caerfyrddin', then south Pembrokeshire can just be called 'Pembrokeshire'.
I walked across the Menai Bridge just last week. Despite this easy transport link with the mainland, I am more convinced than ever that Anglesey should be a protected constituency.
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Post by pembspolitic on Sept 13, 2016 22:50:57 GMT
Ceredigion now contains parts of Carmarthenshire and Montgomeryshire, as well as Pembrokeshire. It might as well be called either Cardiganshire or simply 'Aberystwyth'. Aberystwyth - that's a joke right? |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,144
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Post by Foggy on Sept 13, 2016 23:03:06 GMT
Ceredigion now contains parts of Carmarthenshire and Montgomeryshire, as well as Pembrokeshire. It might as well be called either Cardiganshire or simply 'Aberystwyth'. Aberystwyth - that's a joke right? Well, the football club and university are both jokes, yes... but is it not the most significant settlement in the constituency? |
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Post by pembspolitic on Sept 13, 2016 23:13:34 GMT
Aberystwyth - that's a joke right? Well, the football club and university are both jokes, yes... but is it not the most significant settlement in the constituency? Yes, but by that logic the Gwynedd seat would be called 'Dinbych' and the Pembrokeshire seat 'Milford Haven' - calling a seat by it's largest settlement makes no sense in this instance. Aberystwyth makes up less than 10% of the constituency's population. Also Cardiganshire as a name for the county hasn't been used for 20 years. Once Llanidloes is removed, i would like it to be called 'Ceredigion & Preseli' (or along those lines). |
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
Posts: 16,058
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Post by Sibboleth on Sept 13, 2016 23:22:34 GMT
Cardigan Bay is the obvious name.
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
Posts: 16,058
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Post by Sibboleth on Sept 14, 2016 0:01:50 GMT
Fyck it, let's have a go at the lot. Not bothering with Welsh versions; in most cases the translations are obvious anyway.
1. Menai
2. The trouble with the Eryri suggestion is that not many people live in that part of the seat. But then no name is really suitable: what a Godawful mess of a constituency. Gwynedd might work as a very desperate cop out but there are now obvious issues with that name. You could probably come up with all kinds of versions from the many districts in the seat, or we could just cheat and be all Australian and call it Lloyd George.
3. Costa Geriatrica. The official 'Colwyn & Conwy' works I suppose but actually it could easily be just Conwy, though that would risk confusion with the old seat of that name. Oh, how about Great Orme?
4. Flint
5. Deeside
6. Wrexham
7. Let us name this horror after its disuniting feature: Berwyn.
8. Similar issues to 2. Might as well just call it Powys.
9. Monmouth
10. Newport
11. Pontypool because its a nice name and a historic constituency. More accurate would be Pontypool & Cwmbran o/c.
12. Ebbw Vale & Abertillery
13. Merthyr Tydfil, which after all is still one of the largest towns in Wales.
14. Caerphilly
15. Pontypridd & Aberdare (or the other way round, whatever floats your boat)
16. Rhondda
17. Cardiff West
18. Cardiff North
19. Cardiff South East
20. Barry
21. Bridgend
22. Ogmore (or Aberavon-Ogmore; the name should be preserved but the idiotic boundaries here make it tricky)
23. Neath (or Aberavon-Neath; ibid)
24. Swansea East (or just Swansea, see 25)
25. The trouble here is that 'Gower' refers to a much larger area than often assumed. So 'Swansea West & Gower' is not ideal and Swansea West & Gower West is ugly. Gower South?
26. Llanelli or (see above) Llanelli & Gower North?
27. Carmarthen
28. Pembroke
29. Cardigan Bay
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Post by afleitch on Sept 14, 2016 8:00:01 GMT
Scilly doesn't, though. I think Scilly should have its own MP. I think it should too  If a system can't make exceptions for scattered island seats then it's a bad system. |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Sept 14, 2016 8:33:29 GMT
What about Lundy? The puffins deserve their own MP.
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Post by lennon on Sept 14, 2016 8:37:17 GMT
I'm sure somewhere in the Pitchfork / Fantasy thread we suggested a bunch of "islands" that could be grouped together to remove Scilly from Cornwall (and thus avoid a 'Devonwall' seat) - Southern Isles - Lundy, Scilly, Brownsea, Hayling, Sheppey... or something. ;-)
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Post by Arthur Figgis on Sept 14, 2016 8:51:25 GMT
What about Lundy? The puffins deserve their own MP. Don't forget Rockall. |
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carlton43
Reform Party
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Post by carlton43 on Sept 14, 2016 9:38:37 GMT
You do know how ... challenging ... it is to travel from Stornoway to Kirkwall? Flight SYY-GLA GLA-EDI via taxi fly EDI-KOI - a mere 9 hours or so Or Ferry/Bus to Inverness and fly INV-KOI - can be as little as 6 hours, but its a tight connection at INV Why is there this absurd concern about travel and routes and corridors in constituencies? These are about voting and a possible/probable community of interest within a patch. The electors are concerned with having a vote as part of a group of locals. They don't expect to know these locals, to like these locals or be frequently needing to call on each other. Most of them will have but a sketchy idea of the map of the constituency and care less about it. I have lived in a number of constituencies where the average constituent has only been to bits of it in an entire lifetime. Why would anyone wish to go from Stornoway to Kirkwall in the normal course of daily existence? No one. Perhaps the MP might during a campaign? Perhaps once in a life for a wedding or a big sale or a house move? The infrequency is the reason for the lack of transport availability. Yet there will be an abstract closeness, understanding and identity of interest between the townspeople of those two townships that it far far closer than it is between Worksop and Retford in Bassetlaw. Those communities are close and well connected by road and rail. They cordially loath each other. They have little identity of interest and class and political differences. Some of you get a touch of the vapours at the thought of the excited electors finding that on the redrawing of boundaries will result that a small minority making a given journey regularly from one part of the constituency to another will now pass through a small parcel of land in ANOTHER CONSTITUENCY!! The shock of this is enormous and causes a run on slots in the NHS mental counselling services!! What is the matter with you all? The electors are totally unaware of all this nonsense. They really do not care at all about any of it. What the electors find odd is that next door at No 17 is in a different constituency. Or that the other side of Acacia avenue is in a different constituency. It doesn't bother them much but they would never draw a line down the 'middle' of the street: they would always think in terms of a whole road and draw the line down the back of the gardens of one side of that road. They notice the primary school/railway station/arcade of shops they use not being in the constituency. They see it all with quite different eyes to most of you. And I have asked all these questions in a large survey conducted in the 70s that was no doubt binned because it did not conform to the witless nonsense many of you peddle in this forum. |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Sept 14, 2016 10:23:20 GMT
What about Lundy? The puffins deserve their own MP. Don't forget Puffin Island, or is that one being grouped with Ynys Mon? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 10:43:26 GMT
Flight SYY-GLA GLA-EDI via taxi fly EDI-KOI - a mere 9 hours or so Or Ferry/Bus to Inverness and fly INV-KOI - can be as little as 6 hours, but its a tight connection at INV Why is there this absurd concern about travel and routes and corridors in constituencies? These are about voting and a possible/probable community of interest within a patch. The electors are concerned with having a vote as part of a group of locals. They don't expect to know these locals, to like these locals or be frequently needing to call on each other. Most of them will have but a sketchy idea of the map of the constituency and care less about it. I have lived in a number of constituencies where the average constituent has only been to bits of it in an entire lifetime. Why would anyone wish to go from Stornoway to Kirkwall in the normal course of daily existence? No one. Perhaps the MP might during a campaign? Perhaps once in a life for a wedding or a big sale or a house move? The infrequency is the reason for the lack of transport availability. Yet there will be an abstract closeness, understanding and identity of interest between the townspeople of those two townships that it far far closer than it is between Worksop and Retford in Bassetlaw. Those communities are close and well connected by road and rail. They cordially loath each other. They have little identity of interest and class and political differences. Irrespective of this, it just doesn't make much sense to put the Western Isles in a constituency with Orkney and Shetland. If the aim is to create similarly sized constituencies with no protected status, the sensible thing would be to put the Western Isles in a seat with Wester Ross, Skye and Lochaber, and Orkney in a seat with Caithness and Sutherland. Shetland is a bit of an outlier, but it would go best in this latter seat too. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 39,067
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Post by The Bishop on Sept 14, 2016 11:10:13 GMT
In case anybody hasn't guessed, my "proposal" wasn't *entirely* serious (though as previously said, it could be an interesting one electorally) |
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YL
Non-Aligned
Either Labour leaning or Lib Dem leaning but not sure which
Posts: 4,917
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Post by YL on Sept 14, 2016 11:22:18 GMT
Why is there this absurd concern about travel and routes and corridors in constituencies? These are about voting and a possible/probable community of interest within a patch. The electors are concerned with having a vote as part of a group of locals. They don't expect to know these locals, to like these locals or be frequently needing to call on each other. Most of them will have but a sketchy idea of the map of the constituency and care less about it. I have lived in a number of constituencies where the average constituent has only been to bits of it in an entire lifetime. Why would anyone wish to go from Stornoway to Kirkwall in the normal course of daily existence? No one. Perhaps the MP might during a campaign? Perhaps once in a life for a wedding or a big sale or a house move? The infrequency is the reason for the lack of transport availability. Yet there will be an abstract closeness, understanding and identity of interest between the townspeople of those two townships that it far far closer than it is between Worksop and Retford in Bassetlaw. Those communities are close and well connected by road and rail. They cordially loath each other. They have little identity of interest and class and political differences. Irrespective of this, it just doesn't make much sense to put the Western Isles in a constituency with Orkney and Shetland. If the aim is to create similarly sized constituencies with no protected status, the sensible thing would be to put the Western Isles in a seat with Wester Ross, Skye and Lochaber, and Orkney in a seat with Caithness and Sunderland. Shetland is a bit of an outlier, but it would go best in this latter seat too. A new ferry route? |
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If a system can't make exceptions for scattered island seats then it's a bad system.
