carlton43
Reform Party
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Post by carlton43 on Sept 13, 2016 11:39:41 GMT
Also worth pointing out that while the Scottish islands and IoW can only be reached by ferry/plane/energetic swim Ynys Mon has two road links and a railway line connecting it to the rest of Wales. And potentially a third bridge in five years time: www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-37037170 Also the widest part of the Menai is a touch over 1,000 meters, the narrowest part of the Solent is around 4,000 meters. There really is absolutely no justification for giving Ynys Mon protected status. Or anywhere. |
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Post by greatkingrat on Sept 13, 2016 11:41:08 GMT
They've recommended Welsh language names for the following: "Ynys Môn ac Arfon" "Gogledd Clywd a Gwynedd" "De Clwyd a Gogledd Sir Faldwyn" "Llanelli a Lliw" "Caerfyrddin" "Ceredigion a Gogledd Sir Benfro" "Torfaen" and "Blaenau Gwent" are recommended as billingual I thought they were recommending the Englsih language Llanelli and Lliw.... ? The BCW have been a bit inconsistent, using "Llanelli a Lliw" as the main name on the contents page, but using "Llanelli and Lliw" as the main name in the detailed proposals. I suspect they changed their minds at some point and forgot to change all the references. |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Sept 13, 2016 11:42:37 GMT
There really is absolutely no justification for giving Ynys Mon protected status. I would say the same for the Scottish Islands. Whilst not accessible via road like Anglesey is, their small populations lead to some serious malapportionment, making things unfair on everyone else. Maybe if substantially more people lived there then maybe, but as things stand now it's unacceptable. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
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Post by The Bishop on Sept 13, 2016 11:45:30 GMT
You could combine O&S and Western Isles into a single "Scottish Islands" seat - which might be an interesting multi-party fight in a less SNP-dominated climate too  |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Sept 13, 2016 11:48:08 GMT
Personally I'd rather see the Scottish Islands lose their protection and have them merged with somewhere else to make more equitable constituencies. My point being that if the Scottish Islands are eligible for preservation, why not Anglesey? I'd rather see them treated like any mainland ward to be honest. Anglesey has a bridge. And? Which mainland ports do the ferries going to & from the Western Isles dock at? My first instinct would be to group them with the nearest mainland communities that conduct trade with them. The Orkneys and Shetlands are a bit trickier, but I'd try to group them with the nearest mainland communities too. However the islands get grouped, allowing such gross malapportionment to stand is unacceptable. |
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Post by afleitch on Sept 13, 2016 11:55:15 GMT
And? Which mainland ports do the ferries going to & from the Western Isles dock at? My first instinct would be to group them with the nearest mainland communities that conduct trade with them. The Orkneys and Shetlands are a bit trickier, but I'd try to group them with the nearest mainland communities too. However the islands get grouped, allowing such gross malapportionment to stand is unacceptable. How long do you think it takes to traverse the Western Isles? |
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carlton43
Reform Party
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Post by carlton43 on Sept 13, 2016 11:58:30 GMT
Shetlands paired with an Aberdeen seat? Orkneys paired with Caithness and Sutherland? Western Isles paired with Ross, Skye and Lochaber.
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Sept 13, 2016 12:00:50 GMT
And? Which mainland ports do the ferries going to & from the Western Isles dock at? My first instinct would be to group them with the nearest mainland communities that conduct trade with them. The Orkneys and Shetlands are a bit trickier, but I'd try to group them with the nearest mainland communities too. However the islands get grouped, allowing such gross malapportionment to stand is unacceptable. How long do you think it takes to traverse the Western Isles? Your point being? Yes, I am aware that they are not a geographically small entity, but the matter at hand is less "how long will it take to get between towns in this constituency?", and more "does each constituency have (roughly) an equal amount of electors?". |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2016 12:09:29 GMT
They've recommended Welsh language names for the following: "Ynys Môn ac Arfon" "Gogledd Clywd a Gwynedd" "De Clwyd a Gogledd Sir Faldwyn" "Llanelli a Lliw" "Caerfyrddin" "Ceredigion a Gogledd Sir Benfro" "Torfaen" and "Blaenau Gwent" are recommended as billingual I thought they were recommending the Englsih language Llanelli and Lliw.... ? Looks like they've used both in different documents |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2016 12:15:24 GMT
You could combine O&S and Western Isles into a single "Scottish Islands" seat - which might be an interesting multi-party fight in a less SNP-dominated climate too 'Aberdeen Central & Shetland' would make more sense really... |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Sept 13, 2016 12:46:25 GMT
The proposal for "Colwyn & Conwy" should be held up as an example of how not to draw a constituency. For one thing it places Conwy and Llandudno with Abergele, whilst I can see the sense in putting Conwy and Llandudno in with Colwyn Bay (they do pretty much form one big contigious conurbation with each other), I believe Abergele would do better grouped with either Rhyl & Prestatyn, or some Denbigh centred constituency (to be honest, I never felt that Abergele even belonged in the same local authority, but's another matter entirely). Also, what's with the placement of Caerhun?!?! So many things wrong, so little time to list the faults... Dreck, utter dreck... And that's the nice assessment.  Lord Twaddleford, I do really think your evident personal dislike for Abergele and objection to it being in the same seat as Llandudno, Conwy and Colwyn Bay is truly bizarre. You've repeated it several times and I wouldn't want other readers of this blog to start believing you on this point. Abergele is perfectly acceptable as part of a seat containing settlements to the West. They are barely 10 miles away and share very similar demographics. Pensarn might be slightly different but certainly Gele and Pentre Mawr wards are a perfectly respectable and good fit. As someone who grew up in Llandudno, I had loads of friends and relations who lived in Abergele, as did many people I knew. The local school (Emrys ap Iwan) would often compete with schools our end over schools to the East and many teenagers attend college in Rhos on sea. Lots of people would go to the market in Abergele (indeed it was traditionally the main market town for north Denbighshire, though the market was a bit more 'popular' and less farmery when I knew it). It has been in the same county as Llandudno and Conwy for 20 years and in the same as the now Colwyn Bay area for over 500. While Rhyl maybe the main port of call for Abergele folk for some services, to say as you are that Abergele is fundamentally different from Colwyn Bay, Llandudno and Conwy is putting your own prejudices above reality. You know what, maybe you're right, maybe I do have a chip on my shoulder with regards to Abergele*, but as someone who has also lived in the area for most of their life, I still have never felt that it belongs in the same seat as any of the settlements west of Colwyn Bay/Rhos on Sea. Maybe you can argue some link with Llandudno, but for Conwy or any of the settlements in the Conwy Valley (down or up river), I'm still not fully convinced. The statement you are referring to was aside, nothing more. I never said that they were "fundamentally" different, nor did I intend to imply such, especially in the case of Colwyn Bay. Also, what was giving you the impression that I think Colwyn Bay and Abergele don't belong together? What I was saying there was whilst I think Conwy & Llandudno and Colwyn Bay do fit with each other, and that I think Conwy & Llandudno do not fit with Abergele, at no point did I explicity say or even imply that Colwyn Bay and Abergele do not fit. Anyway... Like I mentioned, I too have lived in the North Wales area for a long time, most of my life, and whilst I have felt a sensation of familiarity with Conwy, Llandudno and the Bay, like they belong together, I never got that with Abergele. Maybe I could be convinced otherwise in time**, but for now I still believe the town on the Gele estuary has more commonality with the likes of Denbigh and Rhyl than it does with Conwy. *And getting stuck in the traffic jams on the high street whilst either riding the bus or driving probably hasn't done much for my view of the place...  **Perhaps if I visited the town more I'd see. Thing is I've never really had any reason to stop there in the past. |
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Post by greatkingrat on Sept 13, 2016 13:10:31 GMT
But that is true of most constituencies, if you take a town at one end, and a town at the other end they probably won't have much in common with each other. Similarly, wherever you draw the boundaries there will always be some nearby towns that end up in separate seats.
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Post by Penddu on Sept 13, 2016 13:35:16 GMT
Am I alone in reading this as "Llanelli and Colour"? It refers to the former district of Lliw Valley ...but is pretty meaningless today...Loughor/Lwchwr would be more meaningful |
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Post by Penddu on Sept 13, 2016 13:42:39 GMT
And coming back to my whinge about names....why Vale of Glamorgan and Bridgend. Why not simply Bridgend which is the main population centre by far?
And why Vale of Glamorgan East...why not simply Vale of Glamorgan....or better still Barry?
Why Cynon Valley and Pontypridd.., should be Pontypridd and Cynon Valley....and why not just drop Valley as in Rhondda....or Lliw...so Pontypridd & Cynon
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Post by Penddu on Sept 13, 2016 14:20:29 GMT
No cwm or dyffryn with Rhondda or Rhymney but with Cynon...just inconsistent...
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Post by gwynthegriff on Sept 13, 2016 15:44:23 GMT
You could combine O&S and Western Isles into a single "Scottish Islands" seat - which might be an interesting multi-party fight in a less SNP-dominated climate too You do know how ... challenging ... it is to travel from Stornoway to Kirkwall? |
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Post by gwynthegriff on Sept 13, 2016 18:03:23 GMT
No cwm or dyffryn with Rhondda or Rhymney but with Cynon...just inconsistent... But there are two Rhonddas, so would it be Cymoedd Rhondda/Rhondda Valleys? (Some of us remember a councillor whose description was "Independent Fighter For The Fach"! ) |
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
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Post by Sibboleth on Sept 13, 2016 18:15:04 GMT
Kind of questionable to use Welsh as the primary name in constituencies that are exclusively Anglophone actually.
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Post by iainbhx on Sept 13, 2016 19:58:10 GMT
You could combine O&S and Western Isles into a single "Scottish Islands" seat - which might be an interesting multi-party fight in a less SNP-dominated climate too You do know how ... challenging ... it is to travel from Stornoway to Kirkwall? Flight SYY-GLA GLA-EDI via taxi fly EDI-KOI - a mere 9 hours or so Or Ferry/Bus to Inverness and fly INV-KOI - can be as little as 6 hours, but its a tight connection at INV |
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Post by Andrew_S on Sept 13, 2016 20:24:48 GMT
The UKPR notionals show the LDs in first place in Ceredigion with 27% of the vote.
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