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Post by noorderling on May 17, 2024 13:25:14 GMT
And right on cue, Omtzigt has turned up for a meeting with Plasterk! It worked then...how bizarre. As I wrote earlier, there are other issues. There was a bust up earlier, when Omzigt complained that Plasterk failed to distribute important information to the 4 leaders. The other 3 denied this had happened. Plasterk complained Omzigt had disrespected the role that Plasterk had at that time. The youth wing of NSC takes the position that Plasterk can’t become PM since there’s an investigation into his financial dealings. Such an investigation was precisely why Plasterk’s predecessor as verkenner had to step back.They point out that the party has been extremely strict when selecting its candidates, to minimize the risk of embarrassment Just saw a funny story on x how Plasterk when he was a cabinet minister used to put stickers with his own picture on papers he received from civil servants that he agreed with. It will probably surprise you to learn that he was not popular with the civil service. Today our biggest opinion poll pool (from the TV program EenVandaag) shows that on a number of issues voters of the 4 parties can roughly be evenly divided by people that feel the proposals go too far, are about right or don’t go far enough. On asylum PVV voters are disappointed that no immediate measures are taken. Unexpectedly the highest score for people that are satisfied is the 53% that agree with the decision to keep the long term climate ambitions, 65% feel that cuts in the budget for long term care go too far, the highest not far enough is the 34 % on asylum. 52% of all voters have little or no confidence in Plasterk, only 20% feel he can solve the big problems the country is facing, only 30% see him as a unifying person. |
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Post by noorderling on May 17, 2024 13:25:41 GMT
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Post by noorderling on May 19, 2024 4:48:56 GMT
Plasterk’s appointment seems increasingly unlikely. No white smoke from his discussion with Omzigt on Friday and his legal problems seem to increase.
It tells us a lot about his moral compass that not only did he sell a patent that possibly was not his sole property, he sold this cancer medicine for 32 million Euro so it could be shelved by a drugs company. While the first problem is very much a legal one with probably limited cut through with the kind of people that support this government, the second would be a huge gift to the opposition, something to maul him with every chance they get.
The new problem is very much in the first category: company papers allegedly misleading.
It couldn’t happen to a nicer person. I’ve always disliked the guy, even when he was on my side, so my comment has nothing to do with his betrayal.
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Post by rcronald on May 19, 2024 7:13:07 GMT
Plasterk’s appointment seems increasingly unlikely. No white smoke from his discussion with Omzigt on Friday and his legal problems seem to increase. It tells us a lot about his moral compass that not only did he sell a patent that possibly was not his sole property, he sold this cancer medicine for 32 million Euro so it could be shelved by a drugs company. While the first problem is very much a legal one with probably limited cut through with the kind of people that support this government, the second would be a huge gift to the opposition, something to maul him with every chance they get. The new problem is very much in the first category: company papers allegedly misleading. It couldn’t happen to a nicer person. I’ve always disliked the guy, even when he was on my side, so my comment has nothing to do with his betrayal. Omzigt is such a self righteous twat, no wonder most of the CDA hated him. |
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Post by noorderling on May 19, 2024 10:36:36 GMT
Omzigt achieved a form of sainthood for his dogged pursuit of a scandal. Less obvious for the outside world were his inability to work with others, his vindictiveness and his indecision.
He assembled a talented group of people around him. Partly from the more conservative side of the CDA, but also outside this group. I’m pretty sure several of his mp’s regret they ever embarked on this adventure, never imagining they end up in bed with Wilders. For now they are quiet, but who knows what they will do when they’re asked to support some unsavory measures. We have a tradition of pretty strict party discipline, with the minority falling in line, except on matters of principle or based on a caveat made for a certain subject at the time of the candidature. One of Omzigt’s mp’s is the civil servant who made quiet a stink at the relevant department in the matter of the scandal I mentioned. It’s hard to see her fall in line when she deems some proposal to be illegal.
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Post by noorderling on May 19, 2024 15:36:22 GMT
NOS reports: premiership Plasterk increasingly unlikely. No official reaction yet about the meeting last Friday between Omzigt and Plasterk, but NSC sources claim that Plasterk seems to underestimate the seriousness of the charges.
The best alternative would be Remkes; I saw some clips from the interview he gave today that were critical of some part of the program and anyhow he seems to enjoy his retirement. No alternative names mentioned. Yet.
Part of the problem is that Wilders has a very small network, due to 1) the fact he’s been under protection from a death threat for 20 years now, but also 2) how he organized his party. He is still the only member and his parliamentary colleagues have very little or no influence on the party line. This tends to discourage the kind of people that would be suitable for this role from joining.
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Post by noorderling on May 19, 2024 15:50:08 GMT
Wilders is not looking for someone who could build up a rival position of strength.20 years ago Rita Verdonk was the queen of the right, as Immigration Secretary. She nearly defeated Rutte for the leadership of the VVD, but was never able to accept that. Even more so after in the 2006 Parliamentary elections,she got more votes from number 2 on the list than Rutte as number one. She saw that as a sign that she should be appointed leader, made some unwelcome statements and in the end was expelled from the VVD. To appoint her as PM would spell all kinds of trouble for Wilders.So he will never do that. He’s looking for someone who will see this as a last hurrah to make way for Wilders to become PM after the next election.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on May 19, 2024 16:49:49 GMT
Valérie Hayer, cardboard cutout Macronist and Renew's lead candidate for the European election, has attacked the VVD and announced that the topic "will be dealt with" on 10th June.
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Post by rcronald on May 19, 2024 16:51:35 GMT
Valérie Hayer, cardboard cutout Macronist and Renew's lead candidate for the European election, has attacked the VVD and announced that the topic "will be dealt with" on 10th June. I suspect that expelling all of the right leaning parties in Renew is likely to end very badly for Renew rather than the right leaning parties… |
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jamie
Top Poster
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Post by jamie on May 19, 2024 17:22:21 GMT
Valérie Hayer, cardboard cutout Macronist and Renew's lead candidate for the European election, has attacked the VVD and announced that the topic "will be dealt with" on 10th June. I suspect that expelling all of the right leaning parties in Renew is likely to end very badly for Renew rather than the right leaning parties… the Macronistas are going to expel themselves? |
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Post by rcronald on May 19, 2024 17:42:13 GMT
I suspect that expelling all of the right leaning parties in Renew is likely to end very badly for Renew rather than the right leaning parties… the Macronistas are going to expel themselves? I forgot which CDU/CSU German politician said that any opposition to the party’s right should be illegitimate or something like that, but the Macronists are probably going to be the most right leaning people in a potential new alliance without the right leaning renew parties. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on May 19, 2024 18:09:48 GMT
the Macronistas are going to expel themselves? I forgot which CDU/CSU German politician said that any opposition to the party’s right should be illegitimate or something like that, but the Macronists are probably going to be the most right leaning people in a potential new alliance without the right leaning renew parties. Franz Josef Strauss. He wasn't saying it should be illegitimate, he was saying that the Union should dominate the right, and that parties emerging to the right should be a sign that they were not doing their job. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on May 19, 2024 18:10:28 GMT
I suspect that expelling all of the right leaning parties in Renew is likely to end very badly for Renew rather than the right leaning parties… the Macronistas are going to expel themselves? It would be funny to see the VVD ask the Manuites why their party has issued more suspensions of Schengen than any other. |
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Post by noorderling on May 20, 2024 11:17:05 GMT
Plasterk has withdrawn his candidacy. I’m not answering my phone for the next few days.
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Post by noorderling on May 24, 2024 13:04:20 GMT
After a 10 hour debate on Wednesday Richard van Zwol, a CDA insider, has been charged with forming a government in the next 5 weeks. First finding the personnel, and then writing a more detailed program of government. Yesterday the four party leaders and Van Zwol discussed who should be the PM. Afterwards they all kept their mouths shut and there have been no leaks so far. So no clarity what so ever who’s it going to be. And as long that remains hidden, no serious politician will commit to joining, certainly not the non-partisan candidates that they want to fill up to 50% of the posts. Van Zwol has clearly indicated that he’s not a candidate for PM nor for a ministry.
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Post by noorderling on May 28, 2024 11:53:45 GMT
The candidate for PM seems to have emerged: the current permanent secretary for the justice and security department, and among other things a former head of the secret service, head of the anti-terrorism unit and of the Asylum- and Immigration service. Also a former PvdA member, who seems to have left the party some time ago. He is 67, so probably no ambitions for a career in politics after this job has ended.
Press conference this afternoon.
The name vaguely rings a bell, but probably would not recognize him if he dropped dead before my feet.
ADDED: the right wing nutters are not happy, so at least we have that.
ADDED 2; it’s not hard to see why they want him: he has an abundance of experience with leading large organizations, functioning in a complicated environment and under massive public scrutiny. He obviously knows his way around The Hague. It’s harder to see what motivated him to say Yes.
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Khunanup
Lib Dem
Portsmouth Liberal Democrats
Posts: 12,005
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Post by Khunanup on May 28, 2024 12:21:30 GMT
Valérie Hayer, cardboard cutout Macronist and Renew's lead candidate for the European election, has attacked the VVD and announced that the topic "will be dealt with" on 10th June. I suspect that expelling all of the right leaning parties in Renew is likely to end very badly for Renew rather than the right leaning parties… Well, it would need ALDE Party to expell them first and that's highly unlikely to happen. As the Macronists are the hangers on in the Renew grouping, they're effectively irrelevant (and with their likely significant drop in the Euros, even more so). |
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Post by noorderling on May 28, 2024 13:12:47 GMT
I’ve had this conversation before, but I’ve never quite saw what’s particularly liberal about VVD. They’ve always been more of a Conservative party. Even Cameron campaigned for them in 2012 (at the expense of the ChristenUnie who at the time were members of the same grouping in the European Parliament as the Tories.)
This term our parliament has a disticintly unliberal majority, that flexed its muscles by throwing out a proposal for a new trans law, before all stages in parliament were completed. The VVD’s new partners are reactionary in their outlook; I’m curious how the VVD will cope with this, and if they will finally show some backbone.
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Post by rcronald on May 28, 2024 15:05:59 GMT
I’ve had this conversation before, but I’ve never quite saw what’s particularly liberal about VVD. They’ve always been more of a Conservative party. Even Cameron campaigned for them in 2012 (at the expense of the ChristenUnie who at the time were members of the same grouping in the European Parliament as the Tories.) This term our parliament has a disticintly unliberal majority, that flexed its muscles by throwing out a proposal for a new trans law, before all stages in parliament were completed. The VVD’s new partners are reactionary in their outlook; I’m curious how the VVD will cope with this, and if they will finally show some backbone. There are 3 types of liberal parties in Renew (and in Europe in general): Conservative liberals-Socially indifferent, economically liberal (VVD) Classical Liberal-Socially Liberal, economically liberal (most of the liberal parties in Europe) Social Liberal-Socially liberal, economically indifferent (D66) Edit: Of course Renew also has parties that really have no relation to liberalism and shouldn’t be a part of the group: FF,ANO and more… |
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Post by finsobruce on May 28, 2024 15:40:39 GMT
I’ve had this conversation before, but I’ve never quite saw what’s particularly liberal about VVD. They’ve always been more of a Conservative party. Even Cameron campaigned for them in 2012 (at the expense of the ChristenUnie who at the time were members of the same grouping in the European Parliament as the Tories.) This term our parliament has a disticintly unliberal majority, that flexed its muscles by throwing out a proposal for a new trans law, before all stages in parliament were completed. The VVD’s new partners are reactionary in their outlook; I’m curious how the VVD will cope with this, and if they will finally show some backbone. There are 3 types of liberal parties in Renew (and in Europe in general): Conservative liberals-Socially indifferent, economically liberal (VVD) Classical Liberal-Socially Liberal, economically liberal (most of the liberal parties in Europe) Social Liberal-Socially liberal, economically indifferent (D66) Edit: Of course Renew also has parties that really have no relation to liberalism and shouldn’t be a part of the group: FF,ANO and more… Are you the conservative liberal, socially indifferent, economically liberal Liberals?
F**k off ! We're the Socially Liberal, socially liberal, economically indifferent Liberals!
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