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Post by johnloony on Jun 25, 2023 10:09:40 GMT
When the deposit for parliamentary elections was increased from the previous £150 to £500 in 1986, the original proposal was that it be £1,000 - but it was changed to £500 at the committee stage. Now I think that, whether it was £500 or £1,000, the legislation should have provided for it to be index-linked, so that it would now be about £1,400 or whatever.
Prescription charges go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest 5p. Under this system, the deposit would go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest (say) £20. When I was younger I used to enjoy the long lists of weirdoes, booliaks, eccentrics, hystericalists, moaners, do-gooders, do-badders, long-haired weirdoes, conspiracy theorists, cranks, crackpots, Walter Mittys and deluded weirdoes who infested SOPNs, but now I have evolved to the stage where they are just annoying if there are too many of them.
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Post by greatkingrat on Jun 25, 2023 10:14:26 GMT
Yes, turning random numbers into symbols isn't usually a good sign... You posted this message at 09:42:29. If you turn the 9 upside down you get 6 + 42 + 29 = 77. Coincidence? I think not. |
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graham
Non-Aligned
Posts: 1,345
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Post by graham on Jun 25, 2023 10:20:49 GMT
When the deposit for parliamentary elections was increased from the previous £150 to £500 in 1986, the original proposal was that it be £1,000 - but it was changed to £500 at the committee stage. Now I think that, whether it was £500 or £1,000, the legislation should have provided for it to be index-linked, so that it would now be about £1,400 or whatever. Prescription charges go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest 5p. Under this system, the deposit would go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest (say) £20. When I was younger I used to enjoy the long lists of weirdoes, booliaks, eccentrics, hystericalists, moaners, do-gooders, do-badders, long-haired weirdoes, conspiracy theorists, cranks, crackpots, Walter Mittys and deluded weirdoes who infested SOPNs, but now I have evolved to the stage where they are just annoying if there are too many of them. I don't agree with requiring a deposit on principle. In essence it is undemocratic and does not exist for Local Elections.Far better to require candidates to have - say - 100 nominations from electors living within the constituency. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,925
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Post by The Bishop on Jun 25, 2023 11:05:02 GMT
Ah, for some reason I thought Lammy was the only one. Happy to stand corrected, but I'm sure they'd like to do better. The point is that Lammy is the black black one. Hendrick and Lewis are Half-black-half-white. FWIW most seem to think of Lewis at least as actually black. |
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Post by greenchristian on Jun 25, 2023 12:08:07 GMT
When the deposit for parliamentary elections was increased from the previous £150 to £500 in 1986, the original proposal was that it be £1,000 - but it was changed to £500 at the committee stage. Now I think that, whether it was £500 or £1,000, the legislation should have provided for it to be index-linked, so that it would now be about £1,400 or whatever. Prescription charges go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest 5p. Under this system, the deposit would go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest (say) £20. When I was younger I used to enjoy the long lists of weirdoes, booliaks, eccentrics, hystericalists, moaners, do-gooders, do-badders, long-haired weirdoes, conspiracy theorists, cranks, crackpots, Walter Mittys and deluded weirdoes who infested SOPNs, but now I have evolved to the stage where they are just annoying if there are too many of them. Unless you raise the deposit to extremely high levels (at least £10,000) it will have virtually no effect on the weirdos and crackpots - since they only have to raise a single deposit. Its main effect is to make it more difficult for serious smaller parties (primarily the Greens) to contests significant numbers of seats at a general election. |
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Post by johnloony on Jun 25, 2023 12:19:34 GMT
When the deposit for parliamentary elections was increased from the previous £150 to £500 in 1986, the original proposal was that it be £1,000 - but it was changed to £500 at the committee stage. Now I think that, whether it was £500 or £1,000, the legislation should have provided for it to be index-linked, so that it would now be about £1,400 or whatever. Prescription charges go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest 5p. Under this system, the deposit would go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest (say) £20. When I was younger I used to enjoy the long lists of weirdoes, booliaks, eccentrics, hystericalists, moaners, do-gooders, do-badders, long-haired weirdoes, conspiracy theorists, cranks, crackpots, Walter Mittys and deluded weirdoes who infested SOPNs, but now I have evolved to the stage where they are just annoying if there are too many of them. Unless you raise the deposit to extremely high levels (at least £10,000) it will have virtually no effect on the weirdos and crackpots - since they only have to raise a single deposit. Its main effect is to make it more difficult for serious smaller parties (primarily the Greens) to contests significant numbers of seats at a general election. That is always the difficulty. You could have a bulk discount of a deposit of only £x per candidate instead of £2x or £3x, if a registered party has more than y candidates in a general election. |
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Post by John Chanin on Jun 25, 2023 13:16:39 GMT
Unless you raise the deposit to extremely high levels (at least £10,000) it will have virtually no effect on the weirdos and crackpots - since they only have to raise a single deposit. Its main effect is to make it more difficult for serious smaller parties (primarily the Greens) to contests significant numbers of seats at a general election. That is always the difficulty. You could have a bulk discount of a deposit of only £x per candidate instead of £2x or £3x, if a registered party has more than y candidates in a general election. Buy one get one free! |
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Post by minionofmidas on Jun 25, 2023 14:06:03 GMT
When the deposit for parliamentary elections was increased from the previous £150 to £500 in 1986, the original proposal was that it be £1,000 - but it was changed to £500 at the committee stage. Now I think that, whether it was £500 or £1,000, the legislation should have provided for it to be index-linked, so that it would now be about £1,400 or whatever. Prescription charges go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest 5p. Under this system, the deposit would go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest (say) £20. When I was younger I used to enjoy the long lists of weirdoes, booliaks, eccentrics, hystericalists, moaners, do-gooders, do-badders, long-haired weirdoes, conspiracy theorists, cranks, crackpots, Walter Mittys and deluded weirdoes who infested SOPNs, but now I have evolved to the stage where they are just annoying if there are too many of them. Unless you raise the deposit to extremely high levels (at least £10,000) it will have virtually no effect on the weirdos and crackpots - since they only have to raise a single deposit. Its main effect is to make it more difficult for serious smaller parties (primarily the Greens) to contests significant numbers of seats at a general election. 10,000£ per party to contest the GE, run as many candidates as you can find. |
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YL
Non-Aligned
Either Labour leaning or Lib Dem leaning but not sure which
Posts: 4,913
Member is Online
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Post by YL on Jun 25, 2023 15:18:37 GMT
I don't think changes should be made to ballot access for Westminster elections in general because of concerns about the odd circus by-election.
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Tony Otim
Green
Suffering from Brexistential Despair
Posts: 11,902
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Post by Tony Otim on Jun 25, 2023 15:37:54 GMT
Unless you raise the deposit to extremely high levels (at least £10,000) it will have virtually no effect on the weirdos and crackpots - since they only have to raise a single deposit. Its main effect is to make it more difficult for serious smaller parties (primarily the Greens) to contests significant numbers of seats at a general election. 10,000£ per party to contest the GE, run as many candidates as you can find. And what's then the criteria for saving your deposit? |
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carlton43
Reform Party
Posts: 50,907 
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Post by carlton43 on Jun 25, 2023 15:53:35 GMT
10,000£ per party to contest the GE, run as many candidates as you can find. And what's then the criteria for saving your deposit? I have run this idea before :- A) £5000 Deposit (Index-linked) B) Deposit cash or a Bond. Major parties would obviously prefer a Bond. C) Have a 10% of Valid Votes Cast as the Margin for Saving a Deposit. No one or no party needs to find the cash up front. The Bond price will be reasonable for a person or party seen to be highly likely to gain 10% of the poll. It is a deterrent for foolish and vain candidature. If you cannot get 10% what was the point of standing other than making an abstract point or vanity and why should that be subsidized? The parties will have to think about the costs of standing many hopeless (in votes terms) candidates. |
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Post by minionofmidas on Jun 25, 2023 16:20:38 GMT
10,000£ per party to contest the GE, run as many candidates as you can find. And what's then the criteria for saving your deposit? None, it's a fee. Need to figure out what to do about by-elections, though. I guess counting them with the next GE works. (I'm not supporting this, though I do think deposits are stupid. Choice of filing fee or not wholly trivial number of signatures, no exceptions for anybody, would be my preference.) |
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Post by president1 on Jun 29, 2023 17:56:05 GMT
Possibly the person of that name who stood in Belmore ward of Hillingdon for the Tories in 2022? Someone of this name was also Mayor's Escort to Tory Teji Barnes in her year as Mayor of Hillingdon, 2020-21. It is indeed the same person-Cameron Swaran Bell. I can only presume he resigned from the Conservatives after Boris Johnson resigned as PM and decided to stand as a "Borisite Conservative" in protest against the parliamentary inquiry which would have resulted in a 90-day suspension for Boris Johnson had he not resigned his seat. Teji Barnes is the mother of Cameron Bell and stood for the conservatives in the neighbouring ward of Charville, which she lost. Cameron also stood for the conservatives in 2018 in the Barnhill ward.
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Post by heslingtonian on Jun 29, 2023 19:27:43 GMT
It is indeed the same person-Cameron Swaran Bell. I can only presume he resigned from the Conservatives after Boris Johnson resigned as PM and decided to stand as a "Borisite Conservative" in protest against the parliamentary inquiry which would have resulted in a 90-day suspension for Boris Johnson had he not resigned his seat. Teji Barnes is the mother of Cameron Bell and stood for the conservatives in the neighbouring ward of Charville, which she lost. Cameron also stood for the conservatives in 2018 in the Barnhill ward.
The videos on his election campaign website are excruciating to watch. Like someone standing in a students union election. |
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Post by greenhert on Jun 29, 2023 19:55:02 GMT
When the deposit for parliamentary elections was increased from the previous £150 to £500 in 1986, the original proposal was that it be £1,000 - but it was changed to £500 at the committee stage. Now I think that, whether it was £500 or £1,000, the legislation should have provided for it to be index-linked, so that it would now be about £1,400 or whatever. Prescription charges go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest 5p. Under this system, the deposit would go up with inflation, rounded to the nearest (say) £20. When I was younger I used to enjoy the long lists of weirdoes, booliaks, eccentrics, hystericalists, moaners, do-gooders, do-badders, long-haired weirdoes, conspiracy theorists, cranks, crackpots, Walter Mittys and deluded weirdoes who infested SOPNs, but now I have evolved to the stage where they are just annoying if there are too many of them. Unless you raise the deposit to extremely high levels (at least £10,000) it will have virtually no effect on the weirdos and crackpots - since they only have to raise a single deposit. Its main effect is to make it more difficult for serious smaller parties (primarily the Greens) to contests significant numbers of seats at a general election. And that is the real reason the deposit was raised in 1985-the claims about deterring frivolous candidates like Screaming Lord Sutch were bogus. The signature requirement has remained at 10 signatures since 1918 (I believe). |
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Post by greenhert on Jun 29, 2023 19:56:28 GMT
Teji Barnes is the mother of Cameron Bell and stood for the conservatives in the neighbouring ward of Charville, which she lost. Cameron also stood for the conservatives in 2018 in the Barnhill ward.
The videos on his election campaign website are excruciating to watch. Like someone standing in a students union election. The BBC have also found an equally immature pose of Mr Bell: www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-66000978 |
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Post by president1 on Jun 29, 2023 21:01:16 GMT
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,732
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Post by Chris from Brum on Jun 29, 2023 21:12:29 GMT
Yeah, but where's the fun in that? |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2023 9:20:05 GMT
U&SR is a notable seat because a part of me thinks Labour should have won here in the 1972 by-election and GE1997 (the Tories did very well in the 97 by-election while they nearly lost the Beckenham by-election).
The Tories in Hillingdon are competent, IMO. Hillingdon hasn't trended like Barnet despite the blatant reason for Labour's resurgence there.
The Ultra-Low Emissions Zone expand from the North and South Circulars to the Greater London boundary next month. I'm sure CCHQ has wasted no time with the 'Khan's cash grab' attack, but will it work?
Looking ahead to 2024, I wonder if the Tories can capitalise on voter fatigue (Khan seeking an unprecedented third term in City Hall) and ULEZ. I know it's generally popular, but there must be pockets where that's not the case that is more than Twitter fulmination.
Plus, you have the fact that in late July, much of the student population of this seat (about 17% according to the 2021 census) won't be here.
If Labour does win this, I could see a repeat of 1997, where the Tories take it back with a three-figure majority. I also think the Tories aren't out of the running in the Ealing & Hillingdon GLA seat that Bailey carried, IIRC.
None of this should come over as partisan, and I say it as someone who voted for Khan and broadly supports the purpose of ULEZ (I'm somewhat biased in that regard as a non-driver).
Either way, a helluva week for the London Tories, with their mayoral selection fiasco concluding on the 18th of July and this fight on the 20th.
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,925
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Post by The Bishop on Jul 2, 2023 9:24:05 GMT
Labour's failure to win Uxbridge in 1997 was largely self-inflicted (and there are claims to that effect about 1972 also, though it was before even my time)
At the very least, this will be a key test of how much ULEZ is some magic bullet for Tory election prospects.
(my suspicion is, not as much as some of them think - but we will see)
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