Richard Allen
Banned
Four time loser in VUKPOTY finals
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Post by Richard Allen on Sept 8, 2014 13:09:20 GMT
Surely a decision to become independent is irrevocable - at least in our lifetimes. BT could do worse than hammer home that point, tbh. I saw one of their adverts a while ago that began with 'it's a massive decision, and there'll be no going back', so this does seem to be something that at least the mainstream pro-Union parties admit. I also can't really see any of the main pro-Union parties advocating re-union in the short term after independence either, and even if they did, I'm not sure that the rUK government would be interested. If Scotland votes yes the reaction in the rUK, or to more to the point England, will start off as sadness and very quickly turn to anger and resentment. English politicians will see which way the wind is blowing and will compete to see who can be the most anti-Scottish. This won't be a friendly separation and there will be next to no possibility of reuniting. |
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neilm
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Post by neilm on Sept 8, 2014 13:33:14 GMT
It'll be an explosion of delight from me. I don't know anyone under 40, at least that has mentioned this to me, who wants Scotland to stay. Hence my confusion over polls suggesting 60% plus want the Union to continue.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 14:44:38 GMT
I respectfully disagree. It is a ridiculous situation when the PM of the day effectively "outsources" the campaign to keep his own country together. I recognise the Tories are toxic to some in Scotland, but he seems to have shown little interest in this business throughout. I disagree, I think the Better Together campaign had to be led by a Scot and that Alistair Darling was the ideal candidate. I won't join in the allocation of blame at this stage as I think we'll win. Incidentally I take it those preparing to blame Me Cameron for defeat are equally prepared to give him the credit for a victory.Mmmmmm, naw, don't think they will. |
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Post by slicesofjim on Sept 8, 2014 14:57:05 GMT
It'll be an explosion of delight from me. I don't know anyone under 40, at least that has mentioned this to me, who wants Scotland to stay. Hence my confusion over polls suggesting 60% plus want the Union to continue. Of my non-political friends and acquaintances, I could probably count those that would prefer a Yes vote on the fingers of one hand. Most would regard it to be very sad, myself included. |
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neilm
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Post by neilm on Sept 8, 2014 14:59:20 GMT
Perhaps this is a generational/age gap thing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 15:02:07 GMT
I saw one of their adverts a while ago that began with 'it's a massive decision, and there'll be no going back', so this does seem to be something that at least the mainstream pro-Union parties admit. I also can't really see any of the main pro-Union parties advocating re-union in the short term after independence either, and even if they did, I'm not sure that the rUK government would be interested. If Scotland votes yes the reaction in the rUK, or to more to the point England, will start off as sadness and very quickly turn to anger and resentment. English politicians will see which way the wind is blowing and will compete to see who can be the most anti-Scottish. This won't be a friendly separation and there will be next to no possibility of reuniting. Particularly if there are economic consequences that are felt across the country as a whole. You could end up with a whole series of hokey kokey referenda. I wouldn't vote for a party that tried to reverse a referendum decision. |
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Post by slicesofjim on Sept 8, 2014 15:02:50 GMT
Of my non-political friends and acquaintances, I could probably count those that would prefer a Yes vote on the fingers of one hand. Most would regard it to be very sad, myself included. What about your political acquaintances? I heard that some people on the radical left in England are supporting Scottish Independence in the (almost certainly mistaken) belief that Scotland will be a beacon of progressive left-wing politics that will inspire the English. You are correct, of political acquaintances there is overwhelming support for independence, for the reason you state. Frankly, they are living in a fantasy world. Nothing good for the left (in general, and not just the far-left) will come out of independence. |
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Post by slicesofjim on Sept 8, 2014 15:04:54 GMT
Perhaps this is a generational/age gap thing. Certainly over the population of the UK as a whole, not so much for the unrepresentative sample of me and people I know. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 16:22:25 GMT
Perhaps this is a generational/age gap thing. Of course, the age gap thing is significant in Scotland as well. If the result is a very narrow No, then it's quite likely that Yes would have 'won' amongst people under 70. Such a result would not be without slightly delicate implications. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 16:50:55 GMT
my twitter feed is exploding with expectant yessers...
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
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Post by Sibboleth on Sept 8, 2014 17:16:00 GMT
According to pb.com, TNS have done a poll and they are releasing it late tonight, a day early. They use a mixture of face to face and phone polling. Ewen McAskill of the Guardian is ramping up this poll on Twitter. I saw that. Phrased in a very odd way though. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 17:33:42 GMT
OK. TNS is possibly the strangest poll of the night:
YES 38. NO 39. DK 23. (!) 50/50 toss up then. I think the No side may actually take a bit of heart from that.
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Sibboleth
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Post by Sibboleth on Sept 8, 2014 17:35:27 GMT
If those are the actual figures, loooooooooooooooooool
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 17:37:58 GMT
Confirmed on my twitter. 25% of the voyes have been cast. How is GOTV operation on both sides in terms of effectiveness. Anybody know? If poll this is the case then a lot of people are not going to make up their minds until the last minute.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2014 19:08:50 GMT
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Post by No Offence Alan on Sept 8, 2014 21:44:06 GMT
OK. TNS is possibly the strangest poll of the night: YES 38. NO 39. DK 23. (!) 50/50 toss up then. I think the No side may actually take a bit of heart from that. The previous TNS poll (late July) was NO 45 YES 32 DK 23. |
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Post by Devonian on Sept 9, 2014 7:17:55 GMT
Ipsos MORI poll due out on 17th
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neilm
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Post by neilm on Sept 9, 2014 13:05:09 GMT
Confirmed on my twitter. 25% of the voyes have been cast. How is GOTV operation on both sides in terms of effectiveness. Anybody know? If poll this is the case then a lot of people are not going to make up their minds until the last minute. So there's already been a 25% turnout. All to play for then. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 4:16:46 GMT
Twitter on fire about Survation. Apparently sensational so a big swing and a lead of 5% for yes then?
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Post by Devonian on Sept 10, 2014 6:59:08 GMT
This is what Survation have said so far
Survation @survation · 18h
On Sept 10th @davieclegg pol editor of @daily_record will release #indyref headline figs at 10.30pm.Tables will then be tweeted by us HERE
Survation @survation 6h
Our #indyref figs for @daily_record are VERY interesting @davieclegg will tweet headline numbers first - follow @survation for full info
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