Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
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Post by Foggy on Oct 17, 2020 20:20:52 GMT
Money well spent, for anyone who might have been tempted  27 in decimal odds is "26-1" in fractional odds, I believe. Also know any good websites with constituency maps and the like?? I was able to find a few streams this morning, but can I echo this query. Do any Kiwi news sites bother with a decent map service? That perhaps we should do the same. They had results out far more quickly. Final certified results won't be known for weeks, as not above. Our system has some issues that need sorting out with under-resourcing and the electoral process being described across dozens of different statutes (some going back over a century), but it's still the most efficient one of all. If anything, other countries such as France, Germany, Canada, the USA, Australia and New Zealand need to adopt British-style election nights at once. All candidates gathered together on a raised platform, standing with rosettes on, to hear a definitive result within (usually well within) 24 hours of polls closing. That's what democracy is meant to look like. That said, it would be very welcome if local authorities and/or the Electoral Commission were empowered to compile results by polling district on the night, and then to compelled to release them weeks or months later, once things have calmed down and only saddos like us would notice. That way, notionals following a boundary review wouldn't just be guesswork. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2020 20:44:01 GMT
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Georg Ebner
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Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
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Post by Georg Ebner on Oct 17, 2020 20:56:06 GMT
Money well spent, for anyone who might have been tempted 27 in decimal odds is "26-1" in fractional odds, I believe. Also know any good websites with constituency maps and the like?? I was able to find a few streams this morning, but can I echo this query. Do any Kiwi news sites bother with a decent map service? That perhaps we should do the same. They had results out far more quickly. Final certified results won't be known for weeks, as not above. Our system has some issues that need sorting out with under-resourcing and the electoral process being described across dozens of different statutes (some going back over a century), but it's still the most efficient one of all. If anything, other countries such as France, Germany, Canada, the USA, Australia and New Zealand need to adopt British-style election nights at once. All candidates gathered together on a raised platform, standing with rosettes on, to hear a definitive result within (usually well within) 24 hours of polls closing. That's what democracy is meant to look like. That said, it would be very welcome if local authorities and/or the Electoral Commission were empowered to compile results by polling district on the night, and then to compelled to release them weeks or months later, once things have calmed down and only saddos like us would notice. That way, notionals following a boundary review wouldn't just be guesswork. The British system is lovely - i don't want to miss it! -, but the contrary of "the most efficient one of all"! The "normal" procedure - counting of few hundred votes in each PollingStation - is easily done within 1 hour. |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,135
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Post by Foggy on Oct 17, 2020 21:05:26 GMT
27 in decimal odds is "26-1" in fractional odds, I believe. I was able to find a few streams this morning, but can I echo this query. Do any Kiwi news sites bother with a decent map service? Final certified results won't be known for weeks, as not above. Our system has some issues that need sorting out with under-resourcing and the electoral process being described across dozens of different statutes (some going back over a century), but it's still the most efficient one of all. If anything, other countries such as France, Germany, Canada, the USA, Australia and New Zealand need to adopt British-style election nights at once. All candidates gathered together on a raised platform, standing with rosettes on, to hear a definitive result within (usually well within) 24 hours of polls closing. That's what democracy is meant to look like. That said, it would be very welcome if local authorities and/or the Electoral Commission were empowered to compile results by polling district on the night, and then to compelled to release them weeks or months later, once things have calmed down and only saddos like us would notice. That way, notionals following a boundary review wouldn't just be guesswork. The British system is lovely - i don't want to miss it! -, but the contrary of "the most efficient one of all"! The "normal" procedure - counting of few hundred votes in each PollingStation - is easily done within 1 hour. It is efficient – results in each constituency might take 4 or 5 hours to arrive on average but once declared, are almost always official as something must have gone very blatantly wrong for them to be overturned. It balances that efficiency with a need for spectacle and raw human reaction that makes election night what it is. Sadly the present Austrian electoral system, although it does technically have constituencies, wouldn't really be compatible with those kinds of public declarations. But this thread is about New Zealand so I don't want to get too sidetracked. |
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Post by bjornhattan on Oct 17, 2020 21:08:04 GMT
Indeed. It would be good to have uhurasmazda 's thoughts on the election once he has recovered from the celebrations.
EDIT: his thoughts on this year's election of course, not 2017. Perhaps a kindly admin could move this post to the newer thread?  I've moved the three posts across. |
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Post by finsobruce on Oct 17, 2020 21:11:23 GMT
Indeed. It would be good to have uhurasmazda 's thoughts on the election once he has recovered from the celebrations.
EDIT: his thoughts on this year's election of course, not 2017. Perhaps a kindly admin could move this post to the newer thread? I've moved the three posts across. Thank you kindly, your modness. |
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Post by Arthur Figgis on Oct 17, 2020 21:17:05 GMT
Obviously this election was always going to be a shit show but I am pleased to see the ACT make a breakthrough and even more pleased to see NZ First appropriately punished for their treachery. You can’t really accuse NZ First of betraying their principles- they had none to betray. But I’m equally delighted to see them burn, and ACT prosper. |
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Post by andrewp on Oct 17, 2020 21:25:01 GMT
BBC call it a landslide. We’ve had this discussion before but is 49% of the vote and an 8 seat overall majority ( albeit in a country and system that doesn’t normally deliver an overall majority ‘ a landslide’?
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Post by finsobruce on Oct 17, 2020 21:26:57 GMT
Talking about illicktions whatever they are, sounds kinky I knew she'd win you over eventually. |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Oct 17, 2020 21:27:09 GMT
If someone got 49% of the vote in a UK election we'd call it a landslide. As I said above, biggest share of the vote for 69 years (and in a multi-party world, not the first past the post system). But if nothing else, a 24% lead makes it a landslide.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2020 21:34:42 GMT
National won the list vote in just four electorates - namely Epsom, Tāmaki, Waikato (by 38 votes) and Taranaki-King Country. They also finished third or worse in the list vote in all the Māori electorates and 7 general electorates - those being Ikaroa-Rāwhiti, Te Tai Hauāuru, Tamaki Makaurau, Rongotai, Dunedin, Wellington Central and Mount Albert
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timmullen1
Labour
Closing account as BossMan declines to respond to messages seeking support.
Posts: 11,823
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Post by timmullen1 on Oct 17, 2020 21:38:37 GMT
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jamie
Top Poster
Posts: 7,054
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Post by jamie on Oct 17, 2020 21:52:36 GMT
Has anybody seen any vote flow statistics? Would be interesting to see how the result came amount eg; who switched to Labour, where did all the ACT voters come from etc.
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Post by manchesterman on Oct 17, 2020 21:53:46 GMT
BBC call it a landslide. We’ve had this discussion before but is 49% of the vote and an 8 seat overall majority ( albeit in a country and system that doesn’t normally deliver an overall majority ‘ a landslide’? I know what you mean - it is a bit of hyperbole, however the term landslide refers to a large movement of something [earth in the literal case] from one place to another place. So a swing of about 14-15% from one major party to another would certainly be called a landslide in a Uk election. Even Blair 97 didnt manage that!
Conversely if a party increased its vote share from say 49% to 54% you would hardly describe that as a landslide, for the same reason
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iain
Lib Dem
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Post by iain on Oct 17, 2020 22:32:55 GMT
National won the list vote in just four electorates - namely Epsom, Tāmaki, Waikato (by 38 votes) and Taranaki-King Country. They also finished third or worse in the list vote in all the Māori electorates and 7 general electorates - those being Ikaroa-Rāwhiti, Te Tai Hauāuru, Tamaki Makaurau, Rongotai, Dunedin, Wellington Central and Mount Albert That is quite hilariously bad. |
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Post by Andrew_S on Oct 17, 2020 22:39:00 GMT
National won the list vote in just four electorates - namely Epsom, Tāmaki, Waikato (by 38 votes) and Taranaki-King Country. They also finished third or worse in the list vote in all the Māori electorates and 7 general electorates - those being Ikaroa-Rāwhiti, Te Tai Hauāuru, Tamaki Makaurau, Rongotai, Dunedin, Wellington Central and Mount Albert That is quite hilariously bad. Let's not forget they only polled 20% at the 2002 election. 27% this time seems good compared to that. |
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Post by timrollpickering on Oct 17, 2020 22:40:55 GMT
I know what you mean - it is a bit of hyperbole, however the term landslide refers to a large movement of something [earth in the literal case] from one place to another place. However "landslide" isn't used terribly consistently. It got used a lot for the 2001 election when less than 30 seats changed hands (and about a quarter of those that did were in Northern Ireland) and the swingometer didn't move much at all. Conversely it doesn't seem to get used much in elections where a big government majority is almost or entirely wiped out but the opposition gets a small majority at most if not even that. |
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Post by Andrew_S on Oct 17, 2020 22:44:35 GMT
Smith remains a member though, grabbing the last list place for National. Of course he does haha. IMO whenever this system is in operation it would be better if people could only stand for one type of seat and not have two bites of the cherry to get elected. IIRC that was the case in Wales to begin with when the Welsh Assembly was first established. |
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Post by No Offence Alan on Oct 17, 2020 23:02:52 GMT
IMO whenever this system is in operation it would be better if people could only stand for one type of seat and not have two bites of the cherry to get elected. IIRC that was the case in Wales to begin with when the Welsh Assembly was first established. I don't think it was ever a rule, though some parties may have adopted it. It makes no sense, though. You could have candidates on a party's list deliberately undermining constituency campaigns to improve their chances. |
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Post by timrollpickering on Oct 17, 2020 23:55:25 GMT
IMO whenever this system is in operation it would be better if people could only stand for one type of seat and not have two bites of the cherry to get elected. IIRC that was the case in Wales to begin with when the Welsh Assembly was first established. It was restored later on. I get the impression in New Zealand it's actually regarded as desirable for list MPs to have also stood for constituencies as a way to root them further. |
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