The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
|
Post by The Bishop on Apr 21, 2017 9:55:17 GMT
I don't see how anyone can argue otherwise now. Unless this country were to adopt the Swedish, Norwegian or (heaven forfend) American system, then the concept of fixed terms would always be incompatible with it. It seems that the foolishness of politicians makes it pointless! It was actually cleverly designed so that the opposition could stop an election merely by abstaining. I am still in shock that Corbyn was so keen to vote with May on this when by abstaining he could have made her look so weak and foolish.. Corbyn and Watson are both on record previously as saying that they wanted an early election. LibDems and SNP also mostly voted for it btw. |
|
|
|
Post by carlton43 on Apr 21, 2017 11:02:10 GMT
All that bluster and nonsense and there it is settled.....done......no by-election just as all sensible people expected. Also, all that bluster and nonsense over the FTPA............for what? As Richard had been at some pains to explain any PM could call an election whenever and usually it would just be a simple two-thirds vote to pass it with most of the opposition voting for it because they wanted one or were fearful of looking scared and incompetent. Many of you get obsessed with utter trivia and irrelevant detail, whilst the grown-ups solve it and move on. That is why a number of you are so spectacularly unsuccessful in your lives. Pay attention to the IMPORTANT and only the important. Oh! Why do I bother? Your self congratulatory tirade was going so well Carlton until you equated the idiotic Labour Party with "any opposition". An opposition leader with the slightest political instinct would have forced this issue into a confidence vote and May would have entered the election looking out of control of events. Can you see that though? Yes. That was a bit self-congratulatory, but most of us are from time to time. It was mostly irritation at the faux drama and pig ignorance demonstrated on this Forum by so many. We have had acres of print on the hindrance of the FTPA and yet it has been proved to be barely a minor pothole in the road to an election. It always was and so few bothered to look at the actual wording of the act. Then the by-election being impacted by the calling of a GE. So what? It is such very small beer. Calls for the PM to have altered the date to suit a poxy nearly irrelevant by election! She has legislation at stake, meetings with important people, foreign visits, EU matters.................And your concerns are about one domestic bloody by-election, either because it might get cancelled or might be held with someone elected only for days an then all happens again in that one small insignificant place. It is the woeful sense of proportion demonstrated by so many of you and the lack of seeing the important in a perpetual fog of personal trivia. |
|
peterl
Green
Congratulations President Trump
Posts: 8,473 
|
Post by peterl on Apr 21, 2017 11:41:09 GMT
Unless someone has died, can we please change it from "countermanded". Its just inaccurate. Cancelled or superseded would be much better.
|
|
|
|
Post by andrew111 on Apr 21, 2017 12:31:03 GMT
It seems that the foolishness of politicians makes it pointless! It was actually cleverly designed so that the opposition could stop an election merely by abstaining. I am still in shock that Corbyn was so keen to vote with May on this when by abstaining he could have made her look so weak and foolish.. Corbyn and Watson are both on record previously as saying that they wanted an early election. LibDems and SNP also mostly voted for it btw. Yes, of course they are. My point is they could have achieved an early election while making May look weak and stupid! Would that not have been a good plan?? |
|
|
|
Post by andrew111 on Apr 21, 2017 12:36:24 GMT
Your self congratulatory tirade was going so well Carlton until you equated the idiotic Labour Party with "any opposition". An opposition leader with the slightest political instinct would have forced this issue into a confidence vote and May would have entered the election looking out of control of events. Can you see that though? Yes. That was a bit self-congratulatory, but most of us are from time to time. It was mostly irritation at the faux drama and pig ignorance demonstrated on this Forum by so many. We have had acres of print on the hindrance of the FTPA and yet it has been proved to be barely a minor pothole in the road to an election. It always was and so few bothered to look at the actual wording of the act. Then the by-election being impacted by the calling of a GE. So what? It is such very small beer. Calls for the PM to have altered the date to suit a poxy nearly irrelevant by election! She has legislation at stake, meetings with important people, foreign visits, EU matters.................And your concerns are about one domestic bloody by-election, either because it might get cancelled or might be held with someone elected only for days an then all happens again in that one small insignificant place. It is the woeful sense of proportion demonstrated by so many of you and the lack of seeing the important in a perpetual fog of personal trivia. We are on a Manchester Gorton thread here! Surely we can discuss an issue that clearly has set a new (minor, I admit) constitutional precedent? I mean most of you come on here mainly to have a competition guessing local by-election results! Very weighty! |
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
|
Post by The Bishop on Apr 21, 2017 12:44:49 GMT
It would have meant a delay of a few weeks - they would in the meantime have been accused of "running scared" of the voters whilst the Tory MPs and captive media would have swallowed whatever bull***t excuse May came up with for no-confidencing her own government. There has also been the argument that Labour's best (only?) chance for this election is to get people thinking about policy, rather than (yet more) process. To get back on topic, one of the conspiracy theories about is that Labour "colluded" in this so they could avoid a by-election in Gorton  |
|
|
|
Post by johnloony on Apr 21, 2017 13:12:10 GMT
Has the Supersedeas Thingy actually been done yet?
|
|
|
|
Post by yellowperil on Apr 21, 2017 13:20:23 GMT
To get back on topic, one of the conspiracy theories about is that Labour "colluded" in this so they could avoid a by-election in Gorton The further refinement of that (highly plausible?) conspiracy theory is that May called the GE because she didn't want Labour to lose Gorton as that might have finished Corbyn and set Labour on course for recovery in time for 2020! That should add to the collection of exceptionally silly posts. |
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
|
Post by The Bishop on Apr 21, 2017 13:25:56 GMT
Well, even your party's own spin a few days ago had Gorton as Lab 50%/LibDem 30%  But as we all know, by-elections are funny things. We genuinely thought it was absolutely neck and neck in Copeland on the morning of polling day, but knew the game was likely up by the evening as the pro-Tory areas turned out in force. OTOH we were pretty jittery about Stoke Central until the votes were counted. |
|
|
|
Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Apr 21, 2017 13:31:40 GMT
Has the Supersedeas Thingy actually been done yet? The House of Commons resolution passed yesterday about 1 PM. I presume the Clerk of the Crown will do as invited. |
|
Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,135
|
Post by Foggy on Apr 21, 2017 17:46:33 GMT
Your self congratulatory tirade was going so well Carlton until you equated the idiotic Labour Party with "any opposition". An opposition leader with the slightest political instinct would have forced this issue into a confidence vote and May would have entered the election looking out of control of events. Can you see that though? Yes, abstaining effectively has the same effect as voting against the motion because of the way the Act is worded, so equally whipping MPs to abstain would have the effect on Tory propaganda of being able to claim that Labour are "running scared" of an election. It would only have delayed an election for a few weeks at most anyway. LibDems and SNP also mostly voted for it btw. The two suspended SNP MPs voted against and the rest abstained. Only Clegg abstained among the Lib Dems. I suggest people look at the list of abstentions, which is much longer than the Noes, since those members were effectively opposing an early election as well. |
|
|
|
Post by greatkingrat on Apr 21, 2017 19:38:26 GMT
Unless someone has died, can we please change it from "countermanded". Its just inaccurate. Cancelled or superseded would be much better. Countermanded means cancelled. The term is not exclusive to elections where a candidate died, it can be used whenever an election is cancelled / postponed. |
|
|
|
Post by jimboo2017 on Apr 21, 2017 21:46:32 GMT
Foggy the two who voted against are not SNP but former/suspended SNP and would not be considered for the selection process
|
|
Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,135
|
Post by Foggy on Apr 21, 2017 22:05:14 GMT
Foggy the two who voted against are not SNP but former/suspended SNP and would not be considered for the selection process Thanks jimboo. Yeah, I missed out a word. Unfortunately I am very much aware that there are more than two SNP MPs at the moment. |
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
|
Post by The Bishop on Apr 21, 2017 22:31:22 GMT
You have just been out-pedanted, you mean? |
|
Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,135
|
Post by Foggy on Apr 21, 2017 22:53:44 GMT
You have just been out-pedanted, you mean? No. I wasn't concentrating and missed out a word. That's not the same as being wilfully non-specific, which allows someone else to come in and be even more pedantic than I am. |
|
|
|
Post by jimboo2017 on Apr 21, 2017 23:21:18 GMT
You have just been out-pedanted, you mean? No. I wasn't concentrating and missed out a word. That's not the same as being wilfully non-specific, which allows someone else to come in and be even more pedantic than I am. FFS that's the first time I have been called a Pedant, leave me with this hollow victory, think I have just insulted someone elsewhere, back to face the music. |
|
|
|
Post by yellowperil on Apr 22, 2017 7:51:42 GMT
Just think- 73 pages, nearly 1500 posts, over 40,000 views -all for an election that didn't happen. What an enormous waste of everyone's time- and that's just on this forum.
|
|
|
|
Post by froome on Apr 22, 2017 8:03:20 GMT
Just think- 73 pages, nearly 1500 posts, over 40,000 views -all for an election that didn't happen. What an enormous waste of everyone's time- and that's just on this forum. I'm sure we can get it up to 100 pages if we start to rake up Manchester's old railway lines. |
|
|
|
Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 22, 2017 8:20:52 GMT
Just think- 73 pages, nearly 1500 posts, over 40,000 views -all for an election that didn't happen. What an enormous waste of everyone's time- and that's just on this forum. I'm sure we can get it up to 100 pages if we start to rake up Manchester's old railway lines. Levenshulme South, Hyde Road, Longsight for starters? |
|
