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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 23, 2017 17:12:09 GMT
I went to Flensburg a while back. Can't say it felt very Danish. The surrounding villages did though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2017 17:36:26 GMT
Completely irrelevant (not sure why you posted it). The sentence following the bolded one says "descendents of people who were Germanized during the 19th century" and your map describes the linguistic situation in 1905. Come on! You think, that Danish fell from 100% to below 10% within 1 century? It is not something I "think". The language change in the area has been studied extensively. By 1800 Danish dialects were spoken to the Schlei-Trene line (much further south than your map), with the exception of the west coast, where Frisian was dominant south of the current border except for the Eiderstedt peninsula in the SW (where Low German took over in mid-18th century) and a small Danish speaking belt in the north. The language change in the Angel peninsula happened 1800-1840, the language change in the central moorlands later and far more gradually (poorer areas lacking the socially dominant element of large farmers that led the switch in Angel). Outside the towns the linguistic border had by then been stable in the east from the mid 14th century and from the early 13th century in the center. Besides language and identity isn't things that correlate neatly in such a region (Flensborg spoke overwhelmingly Low German, but had a Danish majority in elections until the mid-1880s when industrialization and a naval base caused large scale immigration). |
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Jan 23, 2017 17:58:03 GMT
Come on! You think, that Danish fell from 100% to below 10% within 1 century? It is not something I "think". The language change in the area has been studied extensively. By 1800 Danish dialects were spoken to the Schlei-Trene line (much further south than your map), with the exception of the west coast, where Frisian was dominant south of the current border except for the Eiderstedt peninsula in the SW (where Low German took over in mid-18th century) and a small Danish speaking belt in the north. The language change in the Angel peninsula happened 1800-1840, the language change in the central moorlands later and far more gradually (poorer areas lacking the socially dominant element of large farmers that led the switch in Angel). Outside the towns the linguistic border had by then been stable in the east from the mid 14th century and from the early 13th century in the center. Besides language and identity isn't things that correlate neatly in such a region (Flensborg spoke overwhelmingly Low German, but had a Danish majority in elections until the mid-1880s when industrialization and a naval base caused large scale immigration). I have only read so far, that german nationalists from the pro-german (counter)government in Kiel (among them the not unimportant historian J.G.DROYSEN) pleased already 1848 the PaulsKirche to intervene. Can You give me any links/literature (if possible in german), please?
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Post by Adam in Stroud on Jan 23, 2017 18:09:17 GMT
My goodness, the Schleswig Holstein question.
Prince Albert would be pleased
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Foggy
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Post by Foggy on Jan 24, 2017 0:03:17 GMT
Any chance that the poll can be amended to include an 'Other' option? They've had some issues but the PiratenPartei is still fighting and active in most places across Germany. They are still in two state parliaments, the same number as the FW (who are not included in the poll). By September they will almost certainly be in none of them, unlike the FW. Their only claim to being included would then be that they have an MEP, but if that becomes a criterion for inclusion, then the forum pollster would have to give the same level credence to the likes of the NPD, Familienpartei and Die PARTEI. |
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Post by lennon on Jan 24, 2017 4:33:28 GMT
Any chance that the poll can be amended to include an 'Other' option? They've had some issues but the PiratenPartei is still fighting and active in most places across Germany. They are still in two state parliaments, the same number as the FW (who are not included in the poll). By September they will almost certainly be in none of them, unlike the FW. Their only claim to being included would then be that they have an MEP, but if that becomes a criterion for inclusion, then the forum pollster would have to give the same level credence to the likes of the NPD, Familienpartei and Die PARTEI. Which is why I asked for an 'Other' option, not a specific Piratenpartei option. It was meant to be a minor comment requesting forum polls are inclusive where possible. |
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Sibboleth
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Post by Sibboleth on Jan 24, 2017 21:19:56 GMT
Sigmar Gabriel has surprised literally everyone by demonstrating some serious self-awareness and announcing that he won't be the SPD's candidate for Chancellor.
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Foggy
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Post by Foggy on Jan 25, 2017 1:22:47 GMT
They are still in two state parliaments, the same number as the FW (who are not included in the poll). By September they will almost certainly be in none of them, unlike the FW. Their only claim to being included would then be that they have an MEP, but if that becomes a criterion for inclusion, then the forum pollster would have to give the same level credence to the likes of the NPD, Familienpartei and Die PARTEI. Which is why I asked for an 'Other' option, not a specific Piratenpartei option. It was meant to be a minor comment requesting forum polls are inclusive where possible. Ah, right. Fair enough. I was focusing more on the first part of your earlier post which seemed to suggest that 'still fighting' in parts of the country would be a sufficient criterion for inclusion. An 'Other' option would seem reasonable to me. Perhaps the poll will be reset during the official campaign period in late summer? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 6:36:32 GMT
Gabriel has stood down from leading the SPD. Schultz to front up to Merkel.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 8:55:34 GMT
Gabriel has stood down from leading the SPD. Schultz to front up to Merkel. Old news. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 9:48:24 GMT
Really? Well I didnt read it on this thread so therefore posted it.
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Jan 29, 2017 23:45:57 GMT
Schulz held a first speech in SPD's HeadQuarters, which can be found at youtube.
The PartyOfficials are very excited at the moment, but i expect them to end with him rather at 15% than 25%:
Schulz is totally proEU&MultiCulti, the speaking of this Gallo-phile is slightly conceited, making it funny, when he tried to appear as "the small, normal mayor from the province".
Compared to Merkel he is certainly "charismatic", but initially Steinbrück's ToughTalk seemed to succeed against her, too.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 30, 2017 0:04:49 GMT
I know the SPD are short of talent these days, but Schulz? Is that the best that the party of Brandt and Schmitt has?
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Jan 30, 2017 1:49:24 GMT
I know the SPD are short of talent these days, but Schulz? Is that the best that the party of Brandt and Schmitt has? What wrote their brightest (though unsympathic) member Sarrazin: "Deutschland schafft sich ab" ("Germany abolishes itself"). Imaginable, that with this vane bonvivant the solid PostWarOrder of CDU, FDP and SPD will end. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 30, 2017 7:48:09 GMT
I know the SPD are short of talent these days, but Schulz? Is that the best that the party of Brandt and Schmitt has? What wrote their brightest (though unsympathic) member Sarrazin: "Deutschland schafft sich ab" ("Germany abolishes itself"). Imaginable, that with this vane bonvivant the solid PostWarOrder of CDU, FDP and SPD will end. It's becoming clear that a right-of-Union Bundestag presence is about to form for the first time since the Fifties. Merkel et al have effectively overseen the delayed triumph of Die Republikaner. |
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Jan 30, 2017 14:48:49 GMT
What wrote their brightest (though unsympathic) member Sarrazin: "Deutschland schafft sich ab" ("Germany abolishes itself"). Imaginable, that with this vane bonvivant the solid PostWarOrder of CDU, FDP and SPD will end. It's becoming clear that a right-of-Union Bundestag presence is about to form for the first time since the Fifties. Merkel et al have effectively overseen the delayed triumph of Die Republikaner. Indeed, and only a total war within AfD itself could hold them below 5%. |
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Jan 30, 2017 14:51:10 GMT
Between, DW/Foggy/..., have You watched Schulz? What do You say?
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Jan 30, 2017 14:56:50 GMT
I watched Schulz. Michael Elphick was good but Ian Richardson was outstanding.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 30, 2017 15:05:57 GMT
Between, DW/Foggy/..., have You watched Schulz? What do You say? I think he is the ultimate example of the smug wing of the SPD. Only Niels Arren coming close. I can't see how he will win, and I'd be shocked if he doesn't strengthen the resolve of potential SPD to AfD switchers. I note that he has taken a matter of hours to call the AfD Nazis and insinuate that the CSU are a tool of Orban. |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Jan 30, 2017 15:06:30 GMT
Looking at the poll, gotta love how little support there is for the two big parties amongst participating forum denziens.  |
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