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Post by Merseymike on Jan 22, 2015 23:31:16 GMT
Well the story of the election is of course only the side show. The Question we need to have answered is does Alexis Tsipras have the bollocks to stand up to Merkel and get what he needs or will he buckle and enslave the expectant Greek people with and eternity of debt repayments. Oh, its all fun isn't it? He apparently seem to be softening his line recently from what I have read. The truth is of course that the first thing he needs to do if he wins on Sunday is to sort out the corruption. Get the rich to pay their taxes and so on. I bet he doesn't manage it though But someone has to try and there is absolutely no possibility of New Democracy doing so. It will take a new broom and he is the only feasible option. I wouldn't be entirely surprised if you are right but I firmly think that it will be in Europe's best interest if genuine reforms in Greece is accompanied by writing off the debt |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 23, 2015 0:19:04 GMT
Well the story of the election is of course only the side show. The Question we need to have answered is does Alexis Tsipras have the bollocks to stand up to Merkel and get what he needs or will he buckle and enslave the expectant Greek people with and eternity of debt repayments. Oh, its all fun isn't it? He apparently seem to be softening his line recently from what I have read. The truth is of course that the first thing he needs to do if he wins on Sunday is to sort out the corruption. Get the rich to pay their taxes and so on. I bet he doesn't manage it though But someone has to try and there is absolutely no possibility of New Democracy doing so. It will take a new broom and he is the only feasible option. I wouldn't be entirely surprised if you are right but I firmly think that it will be in Europe's best interest if genuine reforms in Greece is accompanied by writing off the debt The problem is that Greece repeatedly fails to remember that being helped out of a hole ever involved a hole to start with. |
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Post by Merseymike on Jan 23, 2015 16:27:52 GMT
The problem is that Greece repeatedly fails to remember that being helped out of a hole ever involved a hole to start with. True. They have been living what for them is an unsustainable lifestyle Most ordinary Greeks really haven't, though - but a minority have done very well with things just as they are, and the major two parties have always managed to get just enough to keep things as they are |
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Post by Devonian on Jan 23, 2015 20:18:28 GMT
Public Issue poll published tonight, fieldwork 16-21 Jan (changes from last Public Issue poll 10-15 Jan) SYRIZA 35% (-0.5) ND 30% (-0.5) To Potami 7% (nc) Golden Dawn 6.5% (nc) KKE 6% (-1) PASOK 5.5% (+0.5) Independent Greeks 3.5% (+0.5) Kinima 2.5% (+0.5) LAOS 2% (+1) DIMAR 0.5% (-1) Seat projection from this poll SYRIZA 144 ND 810 To Potomi 19 Golden Dawn 17 KKE 16 PASOK 15 Independent Greeks 9 www.publicissue.gr/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/pol_con_jan_3_2015.pdf |
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Post by Devonian on Jan 23, 2015 20:37:16 GMT
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Post by Devonian on Jan 23, 2015 22:14:31 GMT
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Post by Devonian on Jan 23, 2015 22:30:10 GMT
New Metron Analysis poll, fieldwork 19-23 January SYRIZA 36.5% ND 30% To Potami 7% Golden Dawn 6% ΚΚΕ 5% PASOK 4.5% Independent Greeks 3.5% Kinima 2.5% Other 5% Seat projection SYRIZA to get 149 seats  as you can see from the graphic below this is yet another poll showing an expanding SYRIZA lead  link |
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Post by Devonian on Jan 23, 2015 22:47:15 GMT
New Palmos Analysis poll, fieldwork 21-23 January (changes from 19-22 January) SYRIZA yet again shown as expanding their lead SYRIZA 30.5% (+0.3) ND 20.1% (-0.2) Golden Dawn 6.0% (-0.8) To Potomi 5.1% (nc) KKE 4.8% (+0.5) PASOK 3.2% (-0.2) Independent Greeks 2.7% (+0.5) Kinima 1.4% (-0.3) LAOS 1.1% (-0.2) Other 4.4% (-0.1)  adjusted for DK/refused   seat projection shows the on 150 seats  kinisienergoipolites.blogspot.gr/2015/01/11-150.htmlthey're getting very close to a majority. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 23, 2015 23:35:57 GMT
Tsipras is saying he will demand half of the debt is forgiven, but I'm struggling to see what he'll hit back with if they don't.
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Post by Devonian on Jan 24, 2015 9:14:16 GMT
Getting a very consistant pattern from these polls now, two more polls showing SYRIZA extending their lead Poll from Interview, fieldwork 22-23 Jan (changes from last Interview poll 14-15 Jan) SYRIZA 30.1% (+0.1) ND 24.6% (-3.5) Golden Dawn 5.5% (+0.6) To Potami 5.0% (nc) KKE 3.9% (-0.1) PASOK 3.9% (+0.4) Independent Greeks 2.2% (+0.4) Kinima 1.6% (-0.4) DIMAR 0.8% (+0.1) Other 4.7% (-0.5) Refused 5.2% (nc) Undecided 12.5% (+2.9) www.capital.gr/News.asp?id=2209766Marc poll, fieldwork 19-21 January (changes since last poll 5-8 Jan) SYRIZA 32.2% (+2.6) ND 26.0% (-0.4) To Potami 6.3% (+0.7) Golden Dawn 6.1% (+0.6) KKE 4.4% (-0.6) PASOK 4.0% (+0.2) Independent Greeks 3.1% (+0.4) Kinima 2.2% (-0.4) LAOS 1.2% (-0.1) DIMAR 1.0% (-0.2) Other 2.5% (-1.2) Refused 1.9% (-0.4) Undecided 9.1% (-1.4) www.alphatv.gr/news/politics/provadisma-62-toy-syriza-enanti-tis-nd-deihnei-dimoskopisi-tis-marc-gia-ton-alpha |
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Post by Devonian on Jan 24, 2015 12:04:08 GMT
Public Issue poll published tonight, fieldwork 21-23 Jan (changes from last Public Issue poll 16-21 Jan) SYRIZA 35% (nc) ND 29% (-1) To Potami 7.5% (+0.5) Golden Dawn 6.5% (nc) KKE 6% (nc) PASOK 5% (-0.5) Independent Greeks 3.5% (nc) Kinima 2.5% (nc) LAOS 2% (nc) DIMAR 0.5% (nc) Seat projection from this poll SYRIZA 145 ND 78 To Potomi 20 Golden Dawn 18 KKE 16 PASOK 14 Independent Greeks 9 www.publicissue.gr/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/pol_con_jan_4_2015.pdfThere have also been polls from GPO, MRB, Kapa Research and Alco and they all show SYRIZA extending their lead. |
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Post by Devonian on Jan 24, 2015 12:37:06 GMT
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neilm
Non-Aligned
Posts: 25,023
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Post by neilm on Jan 24, 2015 17:50:38 GMT
Tsipras is saying he will demand half of the debt is forgiven, but I'm struggling to see what he'll hit back with if they don't. They may believe that the Eurozone fear their departure and they may be right. There is no mechanism for leaving the Euro but they may have to create one for Greece. Why show your prisoners where the exit is if they believe there isn't one? The mechanism to leave is just to say "we're not in it anymore, toodles" and then just go. Obviously this isn't hugely practical but it's a possibility. The chance of it happening must have occurred to people. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 24, 2015 18:53:19 GMT
The problem I have with Syriza is that, despite not being corrupt like ND and Pasok (well, they've not had the chance), they are pandering to the electorate in the same way that the Celtic and Rangers of Greek politics did: telling them that the State can be endlessly munificent, forget where the money might actually come from. Sadly, they are looking like a better option because nobody is standing up and saying that Greece needs two things: weaning itself off the teat of an unsustainable State apparatus, and for everyone to pay their taxes. Syriza are, to their credit, able to articulate the latter.
The country with the most useful ethnically Greek politicians at the moment is probably Australia.
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Post by chorleyboy on Jan 24, 2015 20:32:15 GMT
The problem I have with Syriza is they seem to want to spend what they have not got (Liverpool 1980s anyone?). The implications, both for Greece and the EU could be serious if they were to be elected.
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Post by Devonian on Jan 25, 2015 10:06:01 GMT
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Richard Allen
Banned
Four time loser in VUKPOTY finals
Posts: 19,052
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Post by Richard Allen on Jan 25, 2015 12:12:02 GMT
I do wonder if the opinion polls have been overstating SYRIZA and that fear will drive some people back to the NDs. Of course if SYRIZA don't win after every opinion poll said they would there would be a widespread belief that the election had been rigged.
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,952
Member is Online
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Post by The Bishop on Jan 25, 2015 12:19:22 GMT
There is that view, but it is counterbalanced by the possibility ND's startling lurch to the right has itself scared quite a few voters.......
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jan 25, 2015 13:19:07 GMT
The leader of Independent Greeks has made a not-very-crpytic remark about "the theories of two extremes are over". Whatever could he mean by that...
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Jan 25, 2015 13:37:55 GMT
The leader of Independent Greeks has made a not-very-crpytic remark about "the theories of two extremes are over". Whatever could he mean by that... "I fancy a ride in a ministerial BMW" I think. |
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