J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,620
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Post by J.G.Harston on Aug 20, 2021 18:41:28 GMT
Polling districts rarely sensibly split a ward, they are purely for the administrative convenience of getting to this year's polling station. But, at any one point, they are the only sub-ward datum available above "house". Census enumeration districts and end postcodes, while geographically static over long periods, cross ward boundaries, so aren't suitable as *sub*ward units, as their purpose is completely different. I've never come across an example of a postcode that crosses a ward boundary. I'd be interested to know where this actually happens. Prior to 2016: 110 Northfield Court, S10 1QR: Ward: Crookes 62 Northfield Court, S10 1QR: Ward: Walkley Currently: 110 Northfield Court, S10 1QR: Constituency: Hallam 62 Northfield Court, S10 1QR: Constituency: Central loads of others just in Walkley itself.
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Post by gwynthegriff on Aug 20, 2021 19:21:47 GMT
I've never come across an example of a postcode that crosses a ward boundary. I'd be interested to know where this actually happens. You are kidding, right? There are multiple lowest-level postcodes in Three Rivers that cross not only ward boundaries but also County divisions, and indeed the district boundary (especially but not only with Watford) and in a couple of cases the County and Regional boundary with London (Hillingdon) and one (WD3 5PJ if you want to check) with SE Region (Bucks). I know our boundaries are a muddle but I can't believe Three Rivers is that unusual? There are certainly postcodes that cross Borough/County/Regional boundaries here where Cheshire abuts Staffordshire. Not checked whether there are occupied properties involved but I suspect there are.
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Post by Wisconsin on Aug 21, 2021 0:13:54 GMT
In my experience, the LGBCE really don’t like it when people suggest following postcode boundaries for a ward boundary.
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Aug 21, 2021 8:45:30 GMT
In my experience, the LGBCE really don’t like it when people suggest following postcode boundaries for a ward boundary. One of the apparent rules for postcodes is that both sides of the street must be in the same postcode sector. People in charge of setting electoral boundaries regard running boundaries down the middle of streets to be the best way of dividing urban areas, and a good way of doing rural areas too. Those two facts together would make them unwilling to go with a postcode alignment.
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Post by Wisconsin on Aug 21, 2021 11:36:59 GMT
No, it’s more than that. They recently had an allergic reaction when I mentioned, in passing, that the ward pattern I suggested happened to reflect a change in postcode. They treated it like they treat arguments based on house prices.
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Post by mattb on Aug 21, 2021 13:15:36 GMT
One of the apparent rules for postcodes is that both sides of the street must be in the same postcode sector. Not the case in my street, and rarely the case on main roads either.
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Post by Peter Wilkinson on Aug 21, 2021 14:01:58 GMT
You are kidding, right? There are multiple lowest-level postcodes in Three Rivers that cross not only ward boundaries but also County divisions, and indeed the district boundary (especially but not only with Watford) and in a couple of cases the County and Regional boundary with London (Hillingdon) and one (WD3 5PJ if you want to check) with SE Region (Bucks). I know our boundaries are a muddle but I can't believe Three Rivers is that unusual? There are certainly postcodes that cross Borough/County/Regional boundaries here where Cheshire abuts Staffordshire. Not checked whether there are occupied properties involved but I suspect there are. I'm fairly certain that I have come across cases (admittedly a few years back, before I retired)) where postcodes cross the Cheshire/Wales boundary (or it may have been Shropshire/Wales).
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Post by gwynthegriff on Aug 21, 2021 17:33:48 GMT
In my experience, the LGBCE really don’t like it when people suggest following postcode boundaries for a ward boundary. One of the apparent rules for postcodes is that both sides of the street must be in the same postcode sector. People in charge of setting electoral boundaries regard running boundaries down the middle of streets to be the best way of dividing urban areas, and a good way of doing rural areas too. Those two facts together would make them unwilling to go with a postcode alignment. If that is the case then Llanymynech would have postcodes that were in both Wales and England.
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Post by gwynthegriff on Aug 21, 2021 17:38:16 GMT
In my experience, the LGBCE really don’t like it when people suggest following postcode boundaries for a ward boundary. One of the apparent rules for postcodes is that both sides of the street must be in the same postcode sector. Not the case. For example, Badger Avenue, Crewe - one side CW1 3JG/JQ/JN/LJ t'other side CW1 3JW/LP/LW. Other examples are available.
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Aug 21, 2021 18:17:18 GMT
Postcode sector. Not full postcode.
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Post by islington on Aug 21, 2021 18:21:35 GMT
One of the apparent rules for postcodes is that both sides of the street must be in the same postcode sector. People in charge of setting electoral boundaries regard running boundaries down the middle of streets to be the best way of dividing urban areas, and a good way of doing rural areas too. Those two facts together would make them unwilling to go with a postcode alignment. If that is the case then Llanymynech would have postcodes that were in both Wales and England. Just to add as a matter of historical interest that from 1868 to 1918 the Chester constituency crossed the England-Wales border.
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YL
Non-Aligned
Either Labour leaning or Lib Dem leaning but not sure which
Posts: 4,286
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Post by YL on Aug 21, 2021 18:34:48 GMT
Aren't there buildings in Llanymynech which are partly in England and partly in Wales? It used to be said that there was a pub there with a bar in each, though I think said pub has closed.
If your front door is in Montgomeryshire and your back door in North Shropshire, who is your MP, and do you get to vote in Welsh elections?
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Post by gwynthegriff on Aug 21, 2021 18:43:56 GMT
Aren't there buildings in Llanymynech which are partly in England and partly in Wales? It used to be said that there was a pub there with a bar in each, though I think said pub has closed. If your front door is in Montgomeryshire and your back door in North Shropshire, who is your MP, and do you get to vote in Welsh elections? I'm aware that the border runs down the centre of the main road; by no means unlikely that some properties have been built across the border. I think the usual arrangement is that an assessment is made of which is the more appropriate designation. We had a few such cases on the Crewe & Nantwich/ Eddisbury boundary and that was the approach adopted.
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Post by gwynthegriff on Aug 21, 2021 18:45:42 GMT
Postcode sector. Not full postcode. Message received and understood. (Goes off to burrow in the Postal Address Book to check)
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,620
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Post by J.G.Harston on Aug 21, 2021 22:22:40 GMT
Aren't there buildings in Llanymynech which are partly in England and partly in Wales? It used to be said that there was a pub there with a bar in each, though I think said pub has closed. If your front door is in Montgomeryshire and your back door in North Shropshire, who is your MP, and do you get to vote in Welsh elections? I'm aware that the border runs down the centre of the main road; by no means unlikely that some properties have been built across the border. I think the usual arrangement is that an assessment is made of which is the more appropriate designation. We had a few such cases on the Crewe & Nantwich/ Eddisbury boundary and that was the approach adopted. From memory, for local authority area it was based on the largest ratable area of the property. For subdivisions within an authority (eg wards) it was were the front door was. Certainly with Schools Admissions there have been cases of people moving the front gate to be on the right side of a distance boundary.
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,620
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Post by J.G.Harston on Aug 21, 2021 22:30:29 GMT
Aren't there buildings in Llanymynech which are partly in England and partly in Wales? It used to be said that there was a pub there with a bar in each, though I think said pub has closed. If your front door is in Montgomeryshire and your back door in North Shropshire, who is your MP, and do you get to vote in Welsh elections? I'm aware that the border runs down the centre of the main road; by no means unlikely that some properties have been built across the border. I think the usual arrangement is that an assessment is made of which is the more appropriate designation. We had a few such cases on the Crewe & Nantwich/ Eddisbury boundary and that was the approach adopted. Go to OldMaps and zoom into Llanymynech and you can see the border runs along where the edge of the road used to be, with several buildings straddling the boundary, including (on the 1973 map) two pubs.
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Post by falmouth on Sept 5, 2021 23:35:41 GMT
No, it’s more than that. They recently had an allergic reaction when I mentioned, in passing, that the ward pattern I suggested happened to reflect a change in postcode. They treated it like they treat arguments based on house prices. Sounds fair enough.
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Post by manchesterman on Feb 18, 2022 19:05:13 GMT
An interesting take
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European Lefty
Labour
Can be bribed with salted liquorice
Posts: 5,517
Member is Online
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Post by European Lefty on Feb 18, 2022 20:27:48 GMT
Presumably they swallowed up the Kipper vote
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clyde1998
SNP
Green (E&W) member; SNP supporter
Posts: 1,765
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Post by clyde1998 on Feb 18, 2022 21:50:58 GMT
An interesting take Starmer Out! Allowing the Conservatives to win three constituencies.
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