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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Jul 6, 2024 12:57:18 GMT
What are the rules (if any) that govern where MPs sit in the Commons chamber?
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Jul 6, 2024 13:10:16 GMT
To a large extent it's choice, but with certain places reserved by 'custom' which is practically unbreakable and will probably result in a row and an MP being forced to move if they try to break it.
But the point is that politics is a team game, so MPs will want to sit with their team. Parties sit together and try to avoid sitting next to their opponents.
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right
Conservative
Posts: 18,382
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Post by right on Jul 6, 2024 13:13:52 GMT
Corbyn has a potentially interesting decision to take - where to sit in the House of Commons. Since 2020 he's sat on the opposition side's furthest back bench, below the gangway - a traditional spot for Independent MPs, but also next to where some Labour MPs on the left sit. He could return there, probably sitting next to the Independent Gaza motivated MPs. But if he sees himself as an Independent Labour MP, it wouldn't be impossible to choose to sit on the back bench of the government side. That way he would stay next to the left-wing Labour MPs. This archaic nonsense is why I think MPs should have designated desks, preferably assigned on a geographical basis. Why must life be grey and drab?
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peterl
Green
Monarchic Technocratic Localist
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Post by peterl on Jul 6, 2024 14:01:50 GMT
Corbyn has a potentially interesting decision to take - where to sit in the House of Commons. Since 2020 he's sat on the opposition side's furthest back bench, below the gangway - a traditional spot for Independent MPs, but also next to where some Labour MPs on the left sit. He could return there, probably sitting next to the Independent Gaza motivated MPs. But if he sees himself as an Independent Labour MP, it wouldn't be impossible to choose to sit on the back bench of the government side. That way he would stay next to the left-wing Labour MPs. This archaic nonsense is why I think MPs should have designated desks, preferably assigned on a geographical basis. Good idea, then MPs might actually have to talk to people in different parties and might learn to be civil and work together and not just drown each other out and oppose for the sake of opposing.
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Ports
Non-Aligned
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Post by Ports on Jul 6, 2024 14:13:05 GMT
This archaic nonsense is why I think MPs should have designated desks, preferably assigned on a geographical basis. Good idea, then MPs might actually have to talk to people in different parties and might learn to be civil and work together and not just drown each other out and oppose for the sake of opposing. Reminds me of the story about the independent Conservative Bill Casey in Canada, who later ran as a Liberal under Trudeau in 2015 partly on the basis of 'I had to sit near Trudeau when I became an independent and we saw politics more similarly than I thought'. That isn't an argument for desks though unless you randomise the allocations of people.
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Post by norflondon on Jul 6, 2024 19:55:38 GMT
Lab now favourites to win at 4/6. Interesting that in the datasets of the Survation poll Corbyn is ahead comfortably with 18 to 24 year olds and the over 65s but surprisingly way behind amongst 25-34 yr olds. I dont trust this poll and still think Corbyn will win handily. Particularly proud of this Corbyn went to 6/4 after this poll and I waded in having bets all over the place
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Post by batman on Jul 6, 2024 21:35:17 GMT
I never really thought that the official Labour candidate could win this. I did wonder a bit after both sides said it was very close, but still inclined towards a Corbyn win.
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right
Conservative
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Post by right on Jul 6, 2024 22:16:09 GMT
Lab now favourites to win at 4/6. Interesting that in the datasets of the Survation poll Corbyn is ahead comfortably with 18 to 24 year olds and the over 65s but surprisingly way behind amongst 25-34 yr olds. I dont trust this poll and still think Corbyn will win handily. Particularly proud of this Corbyn went to 6/4 after this poll and I waded in having bets all over the place I hate to like this, but you called it
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2024 4:23:30 GMT
Here's where I've seen 29% before in Islington North. Highbury won't be Corbyn's best result though. I *could* see Corbyn matching the Greens' '22 IN vote share but winning in Finsbury Park (where he lives and which has a large Muslim population) instead of Highbury. I'm revising my prediction and I think Labour will win in Highbury, Tufnell Park and probably Hillrise. Mildmay (SE on this map) is tough for Corbyn (it's gentrified) The bits of Highgate in Junction probably help Labour. Tollington, Finsbury Park and Arsenal probably go to Corbyn whoever wins (lots of renters in ex-council flats esp.). Holloway and FP seem heavily Muslim nowadays. Corbyn won by 14%. IMHO, Labour won Arsenal, Highbury, Tufnell Park and Mildmay. Tufnell Park was where I saw the most support for Labour. Highbury has many commuters. Arsenal is gentrifying. Mildmay has impressive housing next to Canonbury station - loads of white collar professionals. Corbyn will have won everywhere else, IMO. Arsenal, Highbury and Mildmay are the southeastern wards while Tufnell Park is the most southwesterly ward on the map. A 4-4 north-south split, I think
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jul 7, 2024 7:02:35 GMT
I'd be surprised if Labour won four of eight wards with a near 15% deficit across the seat. Its true that wards like Finsbury Park and Tollington are particulalry grotty, Highbury more upmarket, but on the whole the wards here are pretty demographically uniform and tend to be fairly politically uniform too. I'm not even sure that Corbyn would have done better amongst more deprived voters than trendy middle class types - I don't know. But except in extremely disparate constituencies like Corby or Kensington, you wouldn't tend to see a party in a relatively distant second place winning in half the constituent wards and I'd not be surprised if Corbyn led in all of them
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andrea
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Post by andrea on Jul 7, 2024 11:34:35 GMT
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Jul 7, 2024 11:57:57 GMT
And it's an independent paper too.
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andrea
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Post by andrea on Jul 7, 2024 13:55:30 GMT
View from Labour side www.jewishnews.co.uk/inside-islington-north-as-jeremy-corbyn-wins-again/- one week ago they thought they were going to win - in the last voting hours of Thursday, regional officers knew they were going to lose - Nargund was “not the right candidate” - it was difficult to canvass because voters were "unclear about who they were planning to vote for". - pro-Corbyn voters ranged from "he is a good constituency MP" to "he suppers Palenstine" and "because he’s always been our MP.” - some voters thought he was harshly treated by Labour leadership. - local party source says that Corbyn has been basically a local councillor rather than MP and this made it difficult to dislodge: “He’ll be invited to weddings, barbecues , the opening of an envelope by residents, and rather than saying he’s busy with work, he’ll make a point of trying to attend an event, even if it’s in someone’s back garden"
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Post by norflondon on Jul 7, 2024 14:34:04 GMT
In other words a very good MP and person. Claims v little expenses too.
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bsjmcr
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Post by bsjmcr on Jul 7, 2024 14:54:14 GMT
View from Labour side www.jewishnews.co.uk/inside-islington-north-as-jeremy-corbyn-wins-again/- one week ago they thought they were going to win - in the last voting hours of Thursday, regional officers knew they were going to lose - Nargund was “not the right candidate” - it was difficult to canvass because voters were "unclear about who they were planning to vote for". - pro-Corbyn voters ranged from "he is a good constituency MP" to "he suppers Palenstine" and "because he’s always been our MP.” - some voters thought he was harshly treated by Labour leadership. - local party source says that Corbyn has been basically a local councillor rather than MP and this made it difficult to dislodge: “ He’ll be invited to weddings, barbecues , the opening of an envelope by residents, and rather than saying he’s busy with work, he’ll make a point of trying to attend an event, even if it’s in someone’s back garden"That is brilliant even if it seems trivial, contrasts with Starmer’s underwhelming result in Holborn. You can’t imagine him having the same connection with locals. Yes, he’s been busy with the national campaign, but there was a lot of affection for Blair in Sedgefield whether in 1997 or even in 2005 despite a high profile independent challenge.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2024 14:57:56 GMT
I'd be surprised if Labour won four of eight wards with a near 15% deficit across the seat. Its true that wards like Finsbury Park and Tollington are particulalry grotty, Highbury more upmarket, but on the whole the wards here are pretty demographically uniform and tend to be fairly politically uniform too. I'm not even sure that Corbyn would have done better amongst more deprived voters than trendy middle class types - I don't know. But except in extremely disparate constituencies like Corby or Kensington, you wouldn't tend to see a party in a relatively distant second place winning in half the constituent wards and I'd not be surprised if Corbyn led in all of them It's more the margins, Pete. I agree he probably swept the lot, but only a 14% lead. You'd expect that to be biggest in Finsbury Park (Muslims) and Tollington (waifs, strays, and transients). I think I'm being too bullish about Labour in Arsenal - Corbyn probably won there. I'd be surprised if Labour didn't win the other three - Mildmay, Highbury, Tufnell Park. They just feel more well-healed, especially Mildmay and Highbury. I guess we vwon't know unless Islington doles out results by ward.
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
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Post by Sibboleth on Jul 7, 2024 15:03:36 GMT
Unless things have changed considerably in Islington in recent decades (plausible) then 'feels more well heeled' would... er... not indicate weakness for the more 'New' Urban Left type candidate.
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
Posts: 15,765
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Post by Sibboleth on Jul 7, 2024 15:04:46 GMT
That is brilliant even if it seems trivial, contrasts with Starmer’s underwhelming result in Holborn. You can’t imagine him having the same connection with locals. Given that it is a university constituency it would be bloody hard to.
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Post by mattbewilson on Jul 7, 2024 15:24:07 GMT
That is brilliant even if it seems trivial, contrasts with Starmer’s underwhelming result in Holborn. You can’t imagine him having the same connection with locals. Given that it is a university constituency it would be bloody hard to. I think Olivia Blake does a good job
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Post by johnloony on Jul 7, 2024 17:42:50 GMT
View from Labour side www.jewishnews.co.uk/inside-islington-north-as-jeremy-corbyn-wins-again/- one week ago they thought they were going to win - in the last voting hours of Thursday, regional officers knew they were going to lose - Nargund was “not the right candidate” - it was difficult to canvass because voters were "unclear about who they were planning to vote for". - pro-Corbyn voters ranged from "he is a good constituency MP" to "he suppers Palenstine" and "because he’s always been our MP.” - some voters thought he was harshly treated by Labour leadership. - local party source says that Corbyn has been basically a local councillor rather than MP and this made it difficult to dislodge: “He’ll be invited to weddings, barbecues , the opening of an envelope by residents, and rather than saying he’s busy with work, he’ll make a point of trying to attend an event, even if it’s in someone’s back garden" Appear with your wife and the children at their weddings, and funerals, and feasts; Be polite but not friendly to bishops; be kind to all poor parish priests. Say "we", "us" and "ours" when you're speaking, instead of "you fellows" and "I"; Don't ride over seeds, keep your temper, and never you tell them a lie.
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