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Post by philvn on Feb 11, 2024 10:53:37 GMT
Do you think Galloway really has a strong chance of winning? What percentage of the population is Muslim here (something like 20% I'm guessing)? We wouldn't expect him to poll strongly outside of the Muslim community would we? I know Bradford West is something like 60% Muslim, and he hasn't come very close since that win in 2012 (I know he did well in Batley and Spen but ultimately wasn't super close to winning). The existing Rochdale constituency is 30.5% Muslim according to the 2021 census. Batley & Spen is 23.1% Muslim, and Bradford West 58.7%. I'm surprised it's that high. If he can get the majority of the Muslim vote plus a bit of the rest he does have a serious chance then. |
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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Feb 11, 2024 11:00:45 GMT
Let's be blunt shall we, in this byelection it is either him or Galloway. I fully realise that a few outright Tory nihilists would happily see the latter win, but even responsible people on the right must realise what a disaster that would be - and how big a boost it would be to the very worst AS conspiracy theories. I fully accept that some Labour people will not want to campaign for Ali after this, and that is entirely their right. Though unless any more similarly damning stuff turns up, I don't expect the party to formally disown him given the alternative. Bluntly, the one thing, and I mean one thing, I'll say for Galloway is that at least he's honest about what his obsessions are. Your candidate is just as bad, but he lies about it. I don't believe this Damascene conversion malarky about how he's so sorry for what he said. He still believes it, and we all know he does. What I don't get is why you rushed this and picked such a sorry excuse for a candidate. Sir Tony's funeral hasn't even happened yet. Waiting a little bit until his family had buried him would have been the better course. It would have been respectful to his family and allowed you to have really looked into prospective candidates. |
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Post by uthacalthing on Feb 11, 2024 11:15:18 GMT
His views are mainstream within his faith.
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YL
Non-Aligned
Either Labour leaning or Lib Dem leaning but not sure which
Posts: 4,915
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Post by YL on Feb 11, 2024 11:38:59 GMT
The existing Rochdale constituency is 30.5% Muslim according to the 2021 census. Batley & Spen is 23.1% Muslim, and Bradford West 58.7%. can i ask your source, that's significantly more than when i checked the census data I used the custom area profile tool, entering the constituency name in the "Find your area" box and choosing the current constituency. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,988
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 11, 2024 11:51:30 GMT
Do we know if Ali is "just as bad", though? Has he been regularly saying this stuff like GG does, or is this out of character.
Tbh if Galloway was not standing, I suspect the party would have cut him loose already.
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Post by uthacalthing on Feb 11, 2024 11:56:29 GMT
Do we know if Ali is "just as bad", though? Has he been regularly saying this stuff like GG does, or is this out of character......... Oh come off it Tbh if Galloway was not standing, I suspect the party would have cut him loose already............... Indeed |
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Post by michaelarden on Feb 11, 2024 11:58:04 GMT
Let's be blunt shall we, in this byelection it is either him or Galloway. I fully realise that a few outright Tory nihilists would happily see the latter win, but even responsible people on the right must realise what a disaster that would be - and how big a boost it would be to the very worst AS conspiracy theories. I fully accept that some Labour people will not want to campaign for Ali after this, and that is entirely their right. Though unless any more similarly damning stuff turns up, I don't expect the party to formally disown him given the alternative. If the party stands behind one antisemitic conspiracy theorist just because one of his opponents is another antisemitic conspiracy theorist, that's a pretty bad look for Starmer's Labour. I'm personally hoping the Lib Dems might be able to pull it off– if Labour disowns Ali and stops campaigning, giving the Lib Dems a free run at it, it'd be difficult but a win on 30% or so with a split opposition shouldn't be impossible. According to someone on the ground the Lib Dems are leafleting for Galloway. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,988
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 11, 2024 12:01:02 GMT
His views are mainstream within his faith. AS conspiracy theories are depressingly prevalent amongst Muslims, yes ("Jews were told not to come in to work on Sept 11th" is one that I have personally heard from otherwise seemingly rational and mainstream people) and the Naz Shah experience illustrates this very clearly. That is not the same as saying it is integral to their faith, though. Any more than it is to Christianity even though a majority of them were anti-Jew for centuries. |
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Post by philvn on Feb 11, 2024 12:24:58 GMT
His views are mainstream within his faith. AS conspiracy theories are depressingly prevalent amongst Muslims, yes ("Jews were told not to come in to work on Sept 11th" is one that I have personally heard from otherwise seemingly rational and mainstream people) and the Naz Shah experience illustrates this very clearly. That is not the same as saying it is integral to their faith, though. Any more than it is to Christianity even though a majority of them were anti-Jew for centuries. Also, he's never confirmed he's a Muslim! I think he denied that he converted some years ago. |
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Post by batman on Feb 11, 2024 12:27:37 GMT
We’re talking about Azhar Ali here not George Galloway
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Post by mrsir on Feb 11, 2024 12:36:34 GMT
It’s so daft that everyone will pretend a 50 year old Pakistani Muslim living in Rochdale having antisemitic views is shocking.
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Post by johnloony on Feb 11, 2024 12:38:48 GMT
It’s so daft that everyone will pretend a 50 year old Pakistani Muslim living in Rochdale having antisemitic views is shocking. Of course it’s shocking. “Shocking” is not the same thing as “surprising”. |
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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Feb 11, 2024 12:41:39 GMT
Do we know if Ali is "just as bad", though? Has he been regularly saying this stuff like GG does, or is this out of character. Tbh if Galloway was not standing, I suspect the party would have cut him loose already. He said it in a room full of Labour people. Therefore, it's public, and not like being recorded in your living room after one too many. Given that context, you know better than to ask that. As for Galloway, would it be worse? For Labour, as I alluded to in my post on it, having Ali and his ilk torpedo the "we've changed" narrative is surely worse for Labour? |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Feb 11, 2024 13:12:17 GMT
My recollection is that Egyptian intelligence were briefing odd the record in the aftermath of October 7th that Israeli intelligence had been failing to take their calls about rumours in Gaza. Whether those briefings were accurate is a question we can't answer, but I'm pretty certain it was being reported by mainstream news outlets.
Ali went beyond this in claiming that Netanyahu was aware of the details of the attack beforehand and allowed it to happen, and that's definitely conspiratorial. But it's the kind of conspiratorial that goes from taking true or plausibly true things and drawing excessive inferences from them, rather than the full leap into blood libel we've seen from other quarters. It indicates poor judgement, but if we're lucky it doesn't indicate deep-seated and unshiftable bigotry.
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r34t
Non-Aligned
Posts: 1,188
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Post by r34t on Feb 11, 2024 14:11:25 GMT
I’m currently at a Labour conference, news here is that he has been sacked as Labour Candidate, can’t take him off the ballot but he won’t be the GE candidate & if he wins he won’t get the Labour whip
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Post by mattbewilson on Feb 11, 2024 14:34:57 GMT
I’m currently at a Labour conference, news here is that he has been sacked as Labour Candidate, can’t take him off the ballot but he won’t be the GE candidate & if he wins he won’t get the Labour whip how come you not in the red room? |
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r34t
Non-Aligned
Posts: 1,188
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Post by r34t on Feb 11, 2024 14:42:42 GMT
I’m currently at a Labour conference, news here is that he has been sacked as Labour Candidate, can’t take him off the ballot but he won’t be the GE candidate & if he wins he won’t get the Labour whip how come you not in the red room? I’m serving tea 😀 |
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Post by manchesterman on Feb 11, 2024 14:50:25 GMT
My friend is refusing to campaign further in this in the light of the comments. Labour can disown him (Ali, not my friend of course!) in advance, or if he does scrape in the Whips would need to have very sharp words with him demanding a retraction, an apology & an undertaking that he will not say rubbish like this in future. I now wish both he & Galloway could lose, but that's not a realistic hope well they could always vote for the Green candidate instead...oops |
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Post by doktorb🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️ on Feb 11, 2024 14:52:50 GMT
I’m currently at a Labour conference, news here is that he has been sacked as Labour Candidate, can’t take him off the ballot but he won’t be the GE candidate & if he wins he won’t get the Labour whip Back when the media could cover local byelections this would be all over the TV and radio. |
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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Feb 11, 2024 15:00:54 GMT
Labour battling through. I do understand it, but at the same time it kind of annoys me. We have to listen to them talk about how they've changed, and Sir Keir condemn alleged bigotry in that self-righteous way he does like over the PM's trans comment, yet here we have this.
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