US election night super thread

[The Bishop]

Well, in a way it is the "first state" now.

[IceAgeComing]

Nice to see them pushing back on some of these things with real numbers - there's always a little bit of fraud in every election but the Trump campaign are claiming 80k dodgy votes while the Georgia authorities are investigating less than 100 - which is about right and the same as past elections.

The latest Trump lawsuit is a real treat: its an attempt to sue the House of Representatives, the Senate, Mike Pence (as President of the Senate) and "The Electoral College" (which as an institution doesn't actually exist) to get an injunction to legally bar Congress from counting the electoral votes. I don't think it takes a genius to understand why a lawsuit demanding that the legislature does not do something that it is constitutionally bound to do is not likely to succeed. They are also suing in Pennsylvania to get an injunction ordering the State Legislature to pick new Electors but the court isn't next set to meet until the 8th January and the votes are counted on the 6th so unless the Court hurries back to hear this case then the ruling will be that the case is pointless at that point in time. Great legal genius strategies and its gotten to the point where its just funny and very pathetic.

[mboy]

A lot of these people signed sworn affidavits; I presume there is some legal consequence to lying in those circumstances?

[The Bishop]

"Only the best people supporting me, the best".

[finsobruce]

Dec 26, 2020 11:26:43 GMT The Bishop said:

"Only the best people supporting me, the best".

Shall we muse about Terpsichore or just delight in the dancing?

[mboy]

Trump puts the boot into the SCOTUS:

[Richard Allen]

Dec 26, 2020 18:26:48 GMT mboy said:

Trump puts the boot into the SCOTUS:

Wait till Trump realises that the most enduring accomplishment of his presidency, i.e the appointment of 229* lifetime federal judges, was not his own political priority but that of Mitch McConnell.

* Technically he appointed 234 but that includes 5 that he later elevated to a higher court.

[john07]

Dec 26, 2020 19:00:49 GMT Richard Allen said:

Dec 26, 2020 18:26:48 GMT mboy said:

Trump puts the boot into the SCOTUS:

Wait till Trump realises that the most enduring accomplishment of his presidency, i.e the appointment of 229* lifetime federal judges, was not his own political priority but that of Mitch McConnell.

* Technically he appointed 234 but that includes 5 that he later elevated to a higher court.

But none of them were batshit crazy enough to back any of Trump’s ‘legal’ challenges.

[cj]

Dec 26, 2020 19:00:49 GMT Richard Allen said:

Dec 26, 2020 18:26:48 GMT mboy said:

Trump puts the boot into the SCOTUS:

Wait till Trump realises that the most enduring accomplishment of his presidency, i.e the appointment of 229* lifetime federal judges, was not his own political priority but that of Mitch McConnell.

* Technically he appointed 234 but that includes 5 that he later elevated to a higher court.

I doubt he ever will but the consequences will be felt in the wider American political scene until the middle of the century, they made good use of 'the insurgent' and without too much of a bill for whimsy's like walls.

AP covered it today Trump’s impact on courts likely to last long beyond his term

[Peter Wilkinson]

Dec 27, 2020 2:08:38 GMT cj said:

Dec 26, 2020 19:00:49 GMT Richard Allen said:

Wait till Trump realises that the most enduring accomplishment of his presidency, i.e the appointment of 229* lifetime federal judges, was not his own political priority but that of Mitch McConnell.

* Technically he appointed 234 but that includes 5 that he later elevated to a higher court.

I doubt he ever will but the consequences will be felt in the wider American political scene until the middle of the century, they made good use of 'the insurgent' and without too much of a bill for whimsy's like walls.

AP covered it today Trump’s impact on courts likely to last long beyond his term

Scarcely unprecedented, of course, except possibly in sheer scale. John Adams notoriously appointed the distinctly partisan Federalist John Marshall as Chief Supreme Court Justice, over two months after he had been defeated in the 1800 presidential election. He also had legislation passed by the lame duck Congress to decrease the number of Supreme Court Justices, so that Jefferson would not be able to nominate to the next vacancy (though the next Congress repealed this a year later). Marshall remained in post, becoming a distinctly awkward obstacle to not just Jefferson but succeeding presidents right through to Andrew Jackson, until he died in 1835 (by which time the Federalist Party was a distant memory).

Jackson had already been able to appoint three replacement Supreme Court justices, and was in the process of appointing a fourth, when Marshall died. He then appointed the very pro-Southern Roger Taney as Marshall's successor, meaning that he had now appointed five out of seven Supreme Court justices - and then, shortly before his presidential term ended, had the Supreme Court increased to nine members, though he only managed to appoint one of the two new justices before he stepped down. Taney remained as Chief Justice until his death in 1864, well into the American Civil War.

Abraham Lincoln had already appointed four Supreme Court justices before Taney died, including one to a new tenth place on the Supreme Court. To replace Taney, Lincoln appointed the Republican Salmon P. Chase. Following Lincoln's death, Congress reduced the number of Supreme Court justices from ten to seven, the reductions to occur as justices died or resigned, in a successful manoeuvre to prevent Andrew Johnson appointing any Supreme Court justices. After Ulysses S. Grant became president in place of Johnson in 1869, the size of the Supreme Court was raised back to nine, where it has remained ever since.

Chase died after only nine years as Chief Justice, meaning that the next appointment was made by Grant. However, Grant ran into considerable difficulties with the appointment, with several potential Chief Justices turning down the post and others running into difficulties with approval from Congress. The eventual appointee was Morrison Waite, a Republican but, unlike the previous three Chief Justices, primarily a lawyer than a politician - as has usually (but not always) been the case since then. Having said that, though, McConnell and Trump have not been unusual in taking appointee's political leanings into account when making judicial appointments - though most presidents have been somewhat less single-minded in doing so.

[Richard Allen]

Stock up on popcorn by 6th Jan. Josh Hawley will unofficially launch his 2024 presidential campaign by objecting to the certification of electoral votes.

[edgbaston]

Dec 30, 2020 15:58:01 GMT Richard Allen said:

Stock up on popcorn by 6th Jan. Josh Hawley will unofficially launch his 2024 presidential campaign by objecting to the certification of electoral votes.

Does an objection go to a senate vote?

[timmullen1]

Dec 30, 2020 16:01:07 GMT edgbaston said:

Dec 30, 2020 15:58:01 GMT Richard Allen said:

Stock up on popcorn by 6th Jan. Josh Hawley will unofficially launch his 2024 presidential campaign by objecting to the certification of electoral votes.

Does an objection go to a senate vote?

Both Chambers, I think an identical Joint Resolution, and one report said debate is limited to 30 minutes on each JR.

[john07]

Dec 30, 2020 16:13:11 GMT timmullen1 said:

Dec 30, 2020 16:01:07 GMT edgbaston said:

Does an objection go to a senate vote?

Both Chambers, I think an identical Joint Resolution, and one report said debate is limited to 30 minutes on each JR.

I assumed it was a joint session presided over by the Vice President.

[Davıd Boothroyd]

The opening and tallying is in a joint session. If a challenge is made to a state's certificate, and is supported by a member of the House and a Senator, the joint session is suspended and each chamber has to decide separately on whether to uphold the challenge.

[edgbaston]

Dec 30, 2020 16:13:11 GMT timmullen1 said:

Dec 30, 2020 16:01:07 GMT edgbaston said:

Does an objection go to a senate vote?

Both Chambers, I think an identical Joint Resolution, and one report said debate is limited to 30 minutes on each JR.

Nice way to find out who’s a member of the Republican Party and who’s a member of the Trump party in definitive terms

[timmullen1]

CNN says a two hour debate, however hold the popcorn; Hawley’s justification is that Congress hasn’t done anything to secure America’s voting systems or address the allegations of fraud, which sounds distinctly similar to what McConnell was saying yesterday he was tagging on to the stimulus Bill passed by the House on Monday. So if McConnell does bring that amendment to a vote today or tomorrow does Hawley then say his concerns have been met?

[ricmk]

Dec 30, 2020 16:24:11 GMT edgbaston said:

Dec 30, 2020 16:13:11 GMT timmullen1 said:

Both Chambers, I think an identical Joint Resolution, and one report said debate is limited to 30 minutes on each JR.

Nice way to find out who’s a member of the Republican Party and who’s a member of the Trump party in definitive terms

One of those "helpful" motions that splits your own side, unites the opposition, and forces people on your side to take a public position when they just wanted to keep their heads down.
Bravo Josh Hawley!

[Richard Allen]

Dec 30, 2020 17:23:45 GMT ricmk said:

Dec 30, 2020 16:24:11 GMT edgbaston said:

Nice way to find out who’s a member of the Republican Party and who’s a member of the Trump party in definitive terms

One of those "helpful" motions that splits your own side, unites the opposition, and forces people on your side to take a public position when they just wanted to keep their heads down.
Bravo Josh Hawley!

Hawley's name is now dirt with every Republican Senator running for re-election in 2022 and his chances of getting more favourable committee assignments are now practically zero. He isn't dumb so this is a price he is obviously willing to pay.

[Deleted]

Dec 30, 2020 17:32:28 GMT Richard Allen said:

Dec 30, 2020 17:23:45 GMT ricmk said:

One of those "helpful" motions that splits your own side, unites the opposition, and forces people on your side to take a public position when they just wanted to keep their heads down.
Bravo Josh Hawley!

Hawley's name is now dirt with every Republican Senator running for re-election in 2022 and his chances of getting more favourable committee assignments are now practically zero. He isn't dumb so this is a price he is obviously willing to pay.

Presumably he's flipped the coin, & decided that if Trumpistas take more control over the GOP he will be on the 'right' side in the future. Otherwise, he's f****d .....