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Post by Merseymike on Jan 24, 2021 23:33:05 GMT
Let them. I doubt whether those who exhibit the most hysteria would be likely to vote in person anyway Yet more reason not to vote for these parties, though. I think you are missing J.G.Harston's point No, I agree with it. But any party which bows to this guidance deserves contempt. As that's exactly what I think about every party on offer at the moment that's easy enough to think.
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Post by hullenedge on Jan 25, 2021 9:56:25 GMT
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Post by carlton43 on Jan 25, 2021 10:29:17 GMT
Anything can be a vector for contagion. The post. The fliers and junk mail. Amazon and John Lewis deliveres. Each and every item from the shops and supermarkets. We have relatives here in the city who mask up and glove up for every delivery to their home and insist it is left outside the door and only collect when the deliverer has withdrawn. Then unbox on the external landing to their flat whilst masked and gloved. All contents are meticulously wiped down and deposited in quarantine, in a cupboard for 5-days. Then wiped down again and put away in general storage or brought into use. All wipes, masks and gloves are used once only and disposed of in sealed bags and then to black bin waste. They have not left their flat at all for months! This is the super cautious state some people have been redced to. They are in their 30s! Their siblings are all much the same and genuinely scared stiff all of the time.
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Post by listener on Jan 25, 2021 11:48:14 GMT
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,579
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Post by The Bishop on Jan 25, 2021 13:11:46 GMT
Strikes somewhat of special pleading I'm afraid. If the US can carry out their election in arguably worse circumstances, why can't we?
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Post by markgoodair on Jan 25, 2021 14:10:31 GMT
Strikes somewhat of special pleading I'm afraid. If the US can carry out their election in arguably worse circumstances, why can't we? Just explain how we are meant to go out and get the necessary signatures for the nomination papers considering the current restrictions on meeting people?
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European Lefty
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Member is Online
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Post by European Lefty on Jan 25, 2021 14:28:07 GMT
Strikes somewhat of special pleading I'm afraid. If the US can carry out their election in arguably worse circumstances, why can't we? Because most people in the UK care about COVID death rates whereas most Yanks obviously don't.
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Post by edgbaston on Jan 25, 2021 14:34:11 GMT
Strikes somewhat of special pleading I'm afraid. If the US can carry out their election in arguably worse circumstances, why can't we? Because most people in the UK care about COVID death rates whereas most Yanks obviously don't. Its much more to do with them having a constitutionally mandated timeline I think.
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ilerda
Conservative
Posts: 1,028
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Post by ilerda on Jan 25, 2021 14:51:38 GMT
Strikes somewhat of special pleading I'm afraid. If the US can carry out their election in arguably worse circumstances, why can't we? Just explain how we are meant to go out and get the necessary signatures for the nomination papers considering the current restrictions on meeting people? The Government is apparently reviewing large parts of the election process to see how it can be done safely. This explicitly includes the nomination process, and I would expect it to be suspended or at very least reduced for this year's elections if they do go ahead.
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Jan 25, 2021 15:22:41 GMT
I think there are two linked but distinct problems here. The first is the challenge of modifying election procedures to minimise face-to-face contact. This is complex but doable. In practice I would expect it to unfold in a somewhat farcical way, because it doesn't seem like the government has thought thoroughly enough about the challenges involved nor allowed sufficient time for workarounds to be fully implemented, but in theory it's quite manageable.
The second, much less surmountable, challenge is to parties' campaign efforts. I think we can safely assume doorstep canvassing is not going to happen, because even if the guidance allows it it would almost certainly be counterproductive. Telephone canvassing may have its place, but it's no substitute. Leafletting should be reasonably unproblematic once lockdown is over, although even then it'll probably annoy people more than usual. This is probably likely to have the effect of nationalising the contest more than would usually be the case.
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Post by tonygreaves on Jan 25, 2021 16:57:47 GMT
Just explain how we are meant to go out and get the necessary signatures for the nomination papers considering the current restrictions on meeting people? The Government is apparently reviewing large parts of the election process to see how it can be done safely. This explicitly includes the nomination process, and I would expect it to be suspended or at very least reduced for this year's elections if they do go ahead. I think that is an exaggerated view of what they are doing. Any useful work is being done by the EC. The government are flitting around in circles stuck between the pleas of councils to postpone to September and the Conservative Party that sees a good opportunity to sweep the board.
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Post by independentukip on Jan 25, 2021 17:58:44 GMT
Strikes somewhat of special pleading I'm afraid. If the US can carry out their election in arguably worse circumstances, why can't we? Just explain how we are meant to go out and get the necessary signatures for the nomination papers considering the current restrictions on meeting people? How are your Scottish colleagues getting around that? 3 by-elections in process there at the moment. Still if you all leave it between UKIP, Scottish Libertarians and Reform UK I don't mind.
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Post by hugh01 on Jan 25, 2021 18:08:54 GMT
what happens if a Royal Mail sorting office has a case and everyone has to self isolate for 10 days. That is going to have a real time delay for stuff like registration forms, postal and proxy application forms, postal votes - they could well arrive too late to be counted. There are some areas where delays have resulted in the red pillar boxes that arent designated as an NHS priority box being emptied for days. How can elections be ran with so much uncertainty ? Even if the councils manage to staff them and get halls and community centres there is so much of the process out of their control. Another question is if weddings are limited to less than 10 people at the moment and the police dispurse mass gatherings like raves and weddings. Isn't the count just a mass gathering ? How can it be legal to hold an election count, it is not a work place as everyone there aren't employed by the council. If libraries and civic buildings are closed or only open by appointment I can't see how on one day it can be a free for all.
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Post by No Offence Alan on Jan 25, 2021 18:30:04 GMT
Just explain how we are meant to go out and get the necessary signatures for the nomination papers considering the current restrictions on meeting people? How are your Scottish colleagues getting around that? 3 by-elections in process there at the moment. Still if you all leave it between UKIP, Scottish Libertarians and Reform UK I don't mind. Up here in civilisation you only need 3 signatures, a proposer, a seconder and the candidate. That still didn't stop an independent only getting one vote in a local by-election once.
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,636
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Post by J.G.Harston on Jan 25, 2021 19:23:47 GMT
How are your Scottish colleagues getting around that? 3 by-elections in process there at the moment. Still if you all leave it between UKIP, Scottish Libertarians and Reform UK I don't mind. Up here in civilisation you only need 3 signatures, a proposer, a seconder and the candidate. That still didn't stop an independent only getting one vote in a local by-election once. So it's true! Scotland *is* a parish council!
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ilerda
Conservative
Posts: 1,028
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Post by ilerda on Jan 25, 2021 19:36:54 GMT
The Government is apparently reviewing large parts of the election process to see how it can be done safely. This explicitly includes the nomination process, and I would expect it to be suspended or at very least reduced for this year's elections if they do go ahead. I think that is an exaggerated view of what they are doing. Any useful work is being done by the EC. The government are flitting around in circles stuck between the pleas of councils to postpone to September and the Conservative Party that sees a good opportunity to sweep the board. I’m sure the EC is doing a lot of work, but it is up to the Government to decide whether to change the law or not to change things like the nomination process. And the idea that the Conservative Party thinks it can sweep the board in local elections this year is frankly for the birds.
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peterl
Green
Monarchic Technocratic Localist
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Post by peterl on Jan 25, 2021 21:26:46 GMT
Another question is if weddings are limited to less than 10 people at the moment and the police dispurse mass gatherings like raves and weddings. Isn't the count just a mass gathering ? How can it be legal to hold an election count, it is not a work place as everyone there aren't employed by the council. If libraries and civic buildings are closed or only open by appointment I can't see how on one day it can be a free for all. I can answer this part. Because, as stated up-thread, there is a specific statutory exception for activities connected to an election.
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Post by hugh01 on Jan 25, 2021 21:58:50 GMT
Another question is if weddings are limited to less than 10 people at the moment and the police dispurse mass gatherings like raves and weddings. Isn't the count just a mass gathering ? How can it be legal to hold an election count, it is not a work place as everyone there aren't employed by the council. If libraries and civic buildings are closed or only open by appointment I can't see how on one day it can be a free for all. I can answer this part. Because, as stated up-thread, there is a specific statutory exception for activities connected to an election. Yes the covid regs do allow leaving home to vote in a polling station, to work in one and similarly to work or attend a count. However, aren't these so you don't get fined for a non urgent journey by the police? Covid regs also allow you to attend a wedding or a funeral but other regs limit the numbers. Do the regs allow exemptions meaning that 100s can gather in sports halls ? I expect small church vestry type polling stations will have a maximum number allowed in at one time due to their size, so won't that mean that leisure centres will also have a maximum number of attendees ? Then how does this work with mass gatherings classifications ?
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European Lefty
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Post by European Lefty on Jan 26, 2021 9:12:23 GMT
I can answer this part. Because, as stated up-thread, there is a specific statutory exception for activities connected to an election. Yes the covid regs do allow leaving home to vote in a polling station, to work in one and similarly to work or attend a count. However, aren't these so you don't get fined for a non urgent journey by the police? Covid regs also allow you to attend a wedding or a funeral but other regs limit the numbers. Do the regs allow exemptions meaning that 100s can gather in sports halls ? I expect small church vestry type polling stations will have a maximum number allowed in at one time due to their size, so won't that mean that leisure centres will also have a maximum number of attendees ? Then how does this work with mass gatherings classifications ? I suspect if it comes to it they'll "creatively interpret" (ie ignore) any regulations that are too inconvenient. Or lift the restrictions a week before polling day so the Tories can take the credit
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Jan 26, 2021 12:13:00 GMT
Another vacancy impending in Lewisham - Joe Dromey is standing down in New Cross ward:
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