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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Sept 29, 2022 12:12:44 GMT
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CatholicLeft
Labour
2032 posts until I was "accidentally" deleted.
Posts: 6,285
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Post by CatholicLeft on Sept 29, 2022 13:08:10 GMT
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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Sept 29, 2022 13:18:27 GMT
He isn't necessarily wrong tbf. 15 years will be enough. After that, a rest and reboot. Besides, Labour no longer being controlled by a cabal of the antisemitic and the insane means that it isn't dangerous to have a change of government.
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 29, 2022 13:29:49 GMT
He isn't necessarily wrong tbf. 15 years will be enough. After that, a rest and reboot. Besides, Labour no longer being controlled by a cabal of the antisemitic and the insane means that it isn't dangerous to have a change of government. let's hope Starmer is forced to introduce PR, be nice if this was the last conservative majority
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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Sept 29, 2022 13:46:43 GMT
He isn't necessarily wrong tbf. 15 years will be enough. After that, a rest and reboot. Besides, Labour no longer being controlled by a cabal of the antisemitic and the insane means that it isn't dangerous to have a change of government. let's hope Starmer is forced to introduce PR, be nice if this was the last conservative majority Even if you tried to rig the electoral system for partisan reasons, we'd just do a pact with someone like Farage and have a Conservative/Nationalist coalition. We run in the Midlands, South, Wales and Scotland, whilst he runs in the North and some other places and appeals to the so called 'Red Wall' type of voter.
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Post by stb12 on Sept 29, 2022 13:47:20 GMT
He isn't necessarily wrong tbf. 15 years will be enough. After that, a rest and reboot. Besides, Labour no longer being controlled by a cabal of the antisemitic and the insane means that it isn't dangerous to have a change of government. let's hope Starmer is forced to introduce PR, be nice if this was the last conservative majority I’m pretty open to PR but this idea of introducing it simply to stop one party could end up counterproductive And if Labour does win a comfortable majority at the next election then whatever the arguments it’ll be tough for them to introduce something that basically takes that majority away
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Post by threecrowns on Sept 29, 2022 13:51:35 GMT
Maybe so but if Labour have got anything about them they'll get Boles (or anyone else if the same boat) to do the media rounds in the lead up to the next GE in the same manner that the Tories did with Ian Austin in 2019.
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,678
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Post by J.G.Harston on Sept 29, 2022 13:54:51 GMT
Well they are both of Bangladeshi extraction and represent psephologically similar London seats, there have been worse mix ups than that really. When I was first on Sheffield Council I used to mix up two councillors. not because they looked the same, or their names were similar, or anything else, but because one represented EcclesFIELD and one represented EcclesALL. And not even Ecclesfield as a ward name - at that time, it was South Wortley. She didn't become an (East) Ecclesfield councillor until the 2004 boundary changes.
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 29, 2022 14:03:38 GMT
let's hope Starmer is forced to introduce PR, be nice if this was the last conservative majority I’m pretty open to PR but this idea of introducing it simply to stop one party could end up counterproductive And if Labour does win a comfortable majority at the next election then whatever the arguments it’ll be tough for them to introduce something that basically takes that majority away I think it more likely labour win a minority government and require confidence and supply in exchange for PR like the party in Wales and Scotland did
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Post by stb12 on Sept 29, 2022 14:06:35 GMT
I’m pretty open to PR but this idea of introducing it simply to stop one party could end up counterproductive And if Labour does win a comfortable majority at the next election then whatever the arguments it’ll be tough for them to introduce something that basically takes that majority away I think it more likely labour win a minority government and require confidence and supply in exchange for PR like the party in Wales and Scotland did Not if 17 point leads come to pass. I know we’d generally expect the Tories to recover to some extent but they’re just so awful at the moment I’d not consider that a given
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,678
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Post by J.G.Harston on Sept 29, 2022 14:09:24 GMT
let's hope Starmer is forced to introduce PR, be nice if this was the last conservative majority Even if you tried to rig the electoral system for partisan reasons, we'd just do a pact with someone like Farage and have a Conservative/Nationalist coalition. We run in the Midlands, South, Wales and Scotland, whilst he runs in the North and some other places and appeals to the so called 'Red Wall' type of voter. You can't build electoral reform on the basis of "rig it to stop them lot getting in". We aren't in 1920s Northern Ireland or 1940s South Africa.
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Post by Forfarshire Conservative on Sept 29, 2022 14:13:16 GMT
Even if you tried to rig the electoral system for partisan reasons, we'd just do a pact with someone like Farage and have a Conservative/Nationalist coalition. We run in the Midlands, South, Wales and Scotland, whilst he runs in the North and some other places and appeals to the so called 'Red Wall' type of voter. You can't build electoral reform on the basis of "rig it to stop them lot getting in". We aren't in 1920s Northern Ireland or 1940s South Africa. It's also supremely arrogant. If and when we lose, a right leaning party or coalition will eventually win again. This country isn't the country Labour lefties think we are. We aren't a cold water Cali.
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pl
Non-Aligned
Posts: 1,565
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Post by pl on Sept 29, 2022 14:28:30 GMT
I think it more likely labour win a minority government and require confidence and supply in exchange for PR like the party in Wales and Scotland did Not if 17 point leads come to pass. I know we’d generally expect the Tories to recover to some extent but they’re just so awful at the moment I’d not consider that a given I seem to remember a 26 point in 2008, and the Conservatives being the largest party in a hung parliament in 2010.
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 29, 2022 14:28:56 GMT
let's hope Starmer is forced to introduce PR, be nice if this was the last conservative majority Even if you tried to rig the electoral system for partisan reasons, we'd just do a pact with someone like Farage and have a Conservative/Nationalist coalition. We run in the Midlands, South, Wales and Scotland, whilst he runs in the North and some other places and appeals to the so called 'Red Wall' type of voter. in most European contexts, the centre right party does a deal with the liberals like CDU and FDP or Marke Rutte and D66
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 29, 2022 14:29:49 GMT
I think it more likely labour win a minority government and require confidence and supply in exchange for PR like the party in Wales and Scotland did Not if 17 point leads come to pass. I know we’d generally expect the Tories to recover to some extent but they’re just so awful at the moment I’d not consider that a given I think most accept it won't. I mean do you expect Starmer to outpoll Blair
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 29, 2022 14:32:29 GMT
You can't build electoral reform on the basis of "rig it to stop them lot getting in". We aren't in 1920s Northern Ireland or 1940s South Africa. It's also supremely arrogant. If and when we lose, a right leaning party or coalition will eventually win again. This country isn't the country Labour lefties think we are. We aren't a cold water Cali. no we're the UK where unless your name is Boris Tories haven't had a significant majority since the 80s
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Post by stb12 on Sept 29, 2022 14:36:30 GMT
Not if 17 point leads come to pass. I know we’d generally expect the Tories to recover to some extent but they’re just so awful at the moment I’d not consider that a given I think most accept it won't. I mean do you expect Starmer to outpoll Blair No but I now believe Starmer will win a majority. I didn’t until recently with the Tories implosion and the choice of Truss as leader confirms it for me
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 29, 2022 14:38:28 GMT
I think most accept it won't. I mean do you expect Starmer to outpoll Blair No but I now believe Starmer will win a majority. I didn’t until recently with the Tories implosion and the choice of Truss as leader confirms it for me I'll give it to you that's confident. Labour have never achieved the swing required
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Post by greatkingrat on Sept 29, 2022 14:41:17 GMT
It's also supremely arrogant. If and when we lose, a right leaning party or coalition will eventually win again. This country isn't the country Labour lefties think we are. We aren't a cold water Cali. no we're the UK where unless your name is Boris Tories haven't had a significant majority since the 80s Well unless your name is Tony, Labour haven't had a significant majority either.
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Merseymike
Independent
Posts: 39,205
Member is Online
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Post by Merseymike on Sept 29, 2022 14:54:32 GMT
You can't build electoral reform on the basis of "rig it to stop them lot getting in". We aren't in 1920s Northern Ireland or 1940s South Africa. It's also supremely arrogant. If and when we lose, a right leaning party or coalition will eventually win again. This country isn't the country Labour lefties think we are. We aren't a cold water Cali. Not the issue - the question is whether any party no matter what it's ideology is should gain a majority of seats without a majority of votes, on their own. I don't think electoral reform would lead to a permanent coalition and in any case there would inevitably be more parties and the ability for some parties to poll better in terms of seats.
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