The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,525
|
Post by The Bishop on Sept 28, 2022 10:34:54 GMT
I've heard she said that he "doesn't sound black". If that's the case, that's even worse than what has been reported; that implies that black people are all supposed to have particular accents or that they shouldn't be allowed to be middle-class or educated. It's extremely racist. It is absolutely right, as Ed Miliband said earlier, that she has been suspended from the Whip. She has apologized but it was a dreadful thing to say. In answer to Greenhert's question, I'm not sure I'd even dignify her remarks by using the word thinking at all. I would not favour a swift return of the Whip to her. It has been claimed that she has previous on this sort of thing, is that correct?
|
|
|
Post by East Anglian Lefty on Sept 28, 2022 10:41:34 GMT
Is it that 'he doesn't sound black' means he should have an accent, or is that 'he doesn't sound black' means that the things he says should subscribe to a sort of groupthink and only way what follows an agenda? I wonder what she thinks of David Lammy's educational background given that both were scholarship boys (albeit Kwarteng's being means tested). I didn't realise that Lammy chaired the APPG on fatherhood. He has gone up in my estimation. A lot of Lammy's instincts on social policy are small-c conservative. It doesn't tend to get remarked upon because of a tendency for non-white MPs in both parties to be assumed to be further left than they actually are, but it's been a consistent theme of his politics.
|
|
|
Post by stb12 on Sept 28, 2022 12:24:06 GMT
Is it that 'he doesn't sound black' means he should have an accent, or is that 'he doesn't sound black' means that the things he says should subscribe to a sort of groupthink and only way what follows an agenda? I wonder what she thinks of David Lammy's educational background given that both were scholarship boys (albeit Kwarteng's being means tested). I didn't realise that Lammy chaired the APPG on fatherhood. He has gone up in my estimation. A lot of Lammy's instincts on social policy are small-c conservative. It doesn't tend to get remarked upon because of a tendency for non-white MPs in both parties to be assumed to be further left than they actually are, but it's been a consistent theme of his politics. For Lammy specifically I think the perception is because some of his views on race issues havent exactly come across as moderate or balanced, albeit clearly now toned down since joining the front bench
But I agree if you look at his politics overall he isn't heavily on the left of Labour
|
|
|
Post by Merseymike on Sept 28, 2022 12:28:44 GMT
He ran Starmer's leadership campaign.
He is a strong Anglo-Catholic and I think that has a major influence on some of his social attitudes though not all of them.
|
|
r34t
Non-Aligned
Posts: 831
|
Post by r34t on Sept 28, 2022 12:28:54 GMT
Is it that 'he doesn't sound black' means he should have an accent, or is that 'he doesn't sound black' means that the things he says should subscribe to a sort of groupthink and only way what follows an agenda? I wonder what she thinks of David Lammy's educational background given that both were scholarship boys (albeit Kwarteng's being means tested). I didn't realise that Lammy chaired the APPG on fatherhood. He has gone up in my estimation. A lot of Lammy's instincts on social policy are small-c conservative. It doesn't tend to get remarked upon because of a tendency for non-white MPs in both parties to be assumed to be further left than they actually are, but it's been a consistent theme of his politics. A lot of social policy views in the afro-caribbean community are small-c conservative
|
|
|
Post by Merseymike on Sept 28, 2022 12:30:10 GMT
A lot of Lammy's instincts on social policy are small-c conservative. It doesn't tend to get remarked upon because of a tendency for non-white MPs in both parties to be assumed to be further left than they actually are, but it's been a consistent theme of his politics. A lot of social policy views in the afro-caribbean community are small-c conservative Though often related to sexuality and that's an area where Lammy is not conservative
|
|
timmullen1
Labour
Closing account as BossMan declines to respond to messages seeking support.
Posts: 11,823
|
Post by timmullen1 on Sept 28, 2022 12:57:19 GMT
A lot of Lammy's instincts on social policy are small-c conservative. It doesn't tend to get remarked upon because of a tendency for non-white MPs in both parties to be assumed to be further left than they actually are, but it's been a consistent theme of his politics. For Lammy specifically I think the perception is because some of his views on race issues havent exactly come across as moderate or balanced, albeit clearly now toned down since joining the front bench
But I agree if you look at his politics overall he isn't heavily on the left of Labour
He was also challenged for the original selection by Sharon Grant, Bernie’s widow, for being too Blairite; IIRC it was a pretty fraught process with talks of breakaways, independents etc.
|
|
|
Post by Merseymike on Sept 28, 2022 13:16:39 GMT
For Lammy specifically I think the perception is because some of his views on race issues havent exactly come across as moderate or balanced, albeit clearly now toned down since joining the front bench But I agree if you look at his politics overall he isn't heavily on the left of Labour
He was also challenged for the original selection by Sharon Grant, Bernie’s widow, for being too Blairite; IIRC it was a pretty fraught process with talks of breakaways, independents etc. And Sharon Grant is white which added a further dimension to the argument....
|
|
|
Post by aargauer on Sept 28, 2022 13:34:26 GMT
A lot of social policy views in the afro-caribbean community are small-c conservative Though often related to sexuality and that's an area where Lammy is not conservative In my very brief canvass in Latchmere when I ran in 2018, I had an elderly Afro-carribean lady leaning out of her 1st floor council flat window, pointing her finger and shouting at me about excessive immigration. I'm not sure if I managed to win her over from Ukip or not.
|
|
|
Post by batman on Sept 28, 2022 22:36:44 GMT
I've heard she said that he "doesn't sound black". If that's the case, that's even worse than what has been reported; that implies that black people are all supposed to have particular accents or that they shouldn't be allowed to be middle-class or educated. It's extremely racist. It is absolutely right, as Ed Miliband said earlier, that she has been suspended from the Whip. She has apologized but it was a dreadful thing to say. In answer to Greenhert's question, I'm not sure I'd even dignify her remarks by using the word thinking at all. I would not favour a swift return of the Whip to her. It has been claimed that she has previous on this sort of thing, is that correct? she has some form for antisemitism, though not very far up the scale, and she did issue a satisfactory apology. That was some time ago. On anti-Black racism, not that I've heard.
|
|
|
Post by batman on Sept 29, 2022 7:34:34 GMT
it certainly wasn't glorious, but it was not felt to be a sufficiently serious one-off offence for suspension by most people except Labour Against Antisemitism who are particularly trigger-happy. There are degrees of antisemitism ranging from the mildly offensive up to outright genocide and her offence was not very far up the scale at all.
|
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,525
|
Post by The Bishop on Sept 29, 2022 10:16:44 GMT
it certainly wasn't glorious, but it was not felt to be a sufficiently serious one-off offence for suspension by most people except Labour Against Antisemitism who are particularly trigger-happy. There are degrees of antisemitism ranging from the mildly offensive up to outright genocide and her offence was not very far up the scale at all. Most of whom are not actually Labour members (and in some cases not even supporters)
|
|
Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
Posts: 15,277
|
Post by Sibboleth on Sept 29, 2022 10:25:22 GMT
She's largely been involved in increasingly crankish-sounding NIMBY stuff of late, which is an odd priority for a Labour MP in London. Anyway.
|
|
timmullen1
Labour
Closing account as BossMan declines to respond to messages seeking support.
Posts: 11,823
|
Post by timmullen1 on Sept 29, 2022 10:30:21 GMT
She's largely been involved in increasingly crankish-sounding NIMBY stuff of late, which is an odd priority for a Labour MP in London. Anyway. Driving the FCDO and No 10 to distraction to secure Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe’s release doesn’t smack of NIMBY-ism.
|
|
iain
Lib Dem
Posts: 10,702
|
Post by iain on Sept 29, 2022 10:33:14 GMT
She's largely been involved in increasingly crankish-sounding NIMBY stuff of late, which is an odd priority for a Labour MP in London. Anyway. Driving the FCDO and No 10 to distraction to secure Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe’s release doesn’t smack of NIMBY-ism. That was Tulip Siddiq, not Rupa Huq.
|
|
timmullen1
Labour
Closing account as BossMan declines to respond to messages seeking support.
Posts: 11,823
|
Post by timmullen1 on Sept 29, 2022 10:39:32 GMT
Driving the FCDO and No 10 to distraction to secure Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe’s release doesn’t smack of NIMBY-ism. That was Tulip Siddiq, not Rupa Huq. I’ll get my coat 🙄
|
|
|
Post by Pete Whitehead on Sept 29, 2022 11:20:46 GMT
That was Tulip Siddiq, not Rupa Huq. I’ll get my coat 🙄 They all look the same eh..
|
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,525
|
Post by The Bishop on Sept 29, 2022 11:27:26 GMT
Well they are both of Bangladeshi extraction and represent psephologically similar London seats, there have been worse mix ups than that really.
|
|
|
Post by grahammurray on Sept 29, 2022 11:43:20 GMT
Well they are both of Bangladeshi extraction and represent psephologically similar London seats, there have been worse mix ups than that really. And "they all look alike"
|
|
|
Post by threecrowns on Sept 29, 2022 12:09:26 GMT
|
|