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Post by andrew111 on Jun 13, 2018 13:39:01 GMT
Well, actually, judging by twitter the Tories have been working pretty hard.. James Cleverly seems to be there every day with another couple of groups of 20 outside activists. They have all, without exception, been getting a "great response on the doorstep" Isn't that the traditional cry of a party whose vote is crumbling by the day? I think it is the traditional cry of all parties tbh! The Women's Equality Party tend to say "we had a lovely time talking to residents" though... (and our candidate is a true heroine for attending a hustings) |
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Post by andrew111 on Jun 13, 2018 13:42:00 GMT
I've been down a few times, enjoying the train timetable as I go. The other day I was doing some leafleting and quite by chance discovered that the section we'd been given included my old school's sports ground. The main response on the door on that particular occasion was politeness from everyone out front and only one very hostile dog which my co-leafletter had the pleasure of delivering to. There was a hustings arranged last night that got shut down by a mob including people waving Socialist Workers Party placards despite Anne Marie Waters having already decided not to attend on police advice. That was the hustings that neither the Labour nor the Tory candidate could find the time to go to on any date? (and the Labour candidate may or may not have eventually declined to go because of Far Right candidates...).
It is almost as if neither of them wanted to answer any questions from actual voters!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2018 15:39:24 GMT
I've been down a few times, enjoying the train timetable as I go. The other day I was doing some leafleting and quite by chance discovered that the section we'd been given included my old school's sports ground. The main response on the door on that particular occasion was politeness from everyone out front and only one very hostile dog which my co-leafletter had the pleasure of delivering to. There was a hustings arranged last night that got shut down by a mob including people waving Socialist Workers Party placards despite Anne Marie Waters having already decided not to attend on police advice. That was the hustings that neither the Labour nor the Tory candidate could find the time to go to on any date? (and the Labour candidate may or may not have eventually declined to go because of Far Right candidates...).
It is almost as if neither of them wanted to answer any questions from actual voters!
as a deputy mayor answering questions must be so alien to her |
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Post by andrew111 on Jun 13, 2018 17:39:15 GMT
That was the hustings that neither the Labour nor the Tory candidate could find the time to go to on any date? (and the Labour candidate may or may not have eventually declined to go because of Far Right candidates...).
It is almost as if neither of them wanted to answer any questions from actual voters!
as a deputy mayor answering questions must be so alien to her Did she ever answer a question from anyone in her 3 weeks as Deputy Mayor?
Presumably you are suggesting a training programme in that role (4 years, perhaps?) would be beneficial? with a big slice of luck she could try to get the job back after tomorrow!
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Post by yellowperil on Jun 13, 2018 19:52:00 GMT
Looking for a yardstick by which we might make a comparison with this week's election. and I was remembering Brent East 2003, the last London Labour defence which I consider at all comparable
The 2001 percentage figures had been Lab 63.2, Con18.2, LD 10.6, Green 4.7, minor candidates (3) 3.3
and the 2003 by-election................. ....LD 39.1, Lab 33.8, Con 16.2, Green 3.1, minor candidates (12) 8.0
In Lewisham East 2017 .........................Lab 67.9. Con 23.0, LD 4.4, Green 1.7, minor candidates (3) 2.7
and in this by-election Lab, Con , LD, Green and 10 minor candidates( ok I'm regarding all candidates outside the named 4 as minor!)
clearly this would be significantly more difficult for the LDs to actually win than was Brent and the general national mood and state of the parties is different., but the LDs are clearly expecting a result going some way towards what was achieved in Brent.
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k9
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Post by k9 on Jun 14, 2018 6:29:58 GMT
Picking up reports Labour are not telling at a couple of polling stations... either they think they have it won or just do not have the resources.?
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Post by AdminSTB on Jun 14, 2018 6:38:57 GMT
Picking up reports Labour are not telling at a couple of polling stations... either they think they have it won or just do not have the resources.? I would be surprised if it mattered very much at all. |
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Crimson King
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Post by Crimson King on Jun 14, 2018 7:30:11 GMT
Picking up reports Labour are not telling at a couple of polling stations... either they think they have it won or just do not have the resources.? These days telling is less popular, even if you have the resources there are better ways to use them unless the numbers of your supporters voting at the polling station mean that time spent sitting outside it is less than the time spent simply ringing round or visiting them |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Jun 14, 2018 7:57:34 GMT
There are only two reasons for telling. One is for visibility outside polling stations. The other is to identify which promises have actually voted. Polling agents can get the overall turnout level by asking presiding officers.
In a heavily fought byelection, there probably isn't any reason for specific presence outside polling stations to remind voters about your candidature. And if you knock on someone's door at 4 pm and they tell you they voted in the morning before 9, they might be slightly annoyed at the interruption but you don't lose their vote.
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Post by yellowperil on Jun 14, 2018 8:44:30 GMT
Picking up reports Labour are not telling at a couple of polling stations... either they think they have it won or just do not have the resources.? Labour tends not to do much telling at polling stations nowadays. It's the current thinking - it wastes resources which would be better deployed knocking up. Not saying I agree with it, but that's the thinking. I hear that thinking a lot but deplore it. At best, the telling system is also providing a welcoming face from your own side and a reassurance you are doing the right thing. Particularly important where there might be a little wobble at the last minute as to how to vote. What's the statistic about how many people decide who to vote for when actually in the polling station? By -elections where you are not contributing to deciding the fate of the nation but may be tempted to send a message to your own leadership? Just saying... |
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Post by andrew111 on Jun 14, 2018 8:59:28 GMT
Labour tends not to do much telling at polling stations nowadays. It's the current thinking - it wastes resources which would be better deployed knocking up. Not saying I agree with it, but that's the thinking. I hear that thinking a lot but deplore it. At best, the telling system is also providing a welcoming face from your own side and a reassurance you are doing the right thing. Particularly important where there might be a little wobble at the last minute as to how to vote. What's the statistic about how many people decide who to vote for when actually in the polling station? By -elections where you are not contributing to deciding the fate of the nation but may be tempted to send a message to your own leadership? Just saying... Well, it depends what resources you have. Getting tellers requires organisation, and if you are the only organiser and are struggling to get a polling day leaflet through every door on your list then it is a waste of resource... But in a by-election like Lewisham having a very visible presence everywhere may make a difference... Someone who votes in the morning might tell their spouse in the evening "the Lib Dems were there but no sign of Labour. No wonder after those splits on Europe yesterday!"
In this by-election the local Lib Dems are evidently of the opinion that it could be close, and appear to be telling on every polling station. Labour perhaps do not. As Yellow Peril pointed out, even to be close requires "the mother of all swings", so it is improbable, but Lib Dem activists do love by-elections!
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The Bishop
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Post by The Bishop on Jun 14, 2018 9:10:44 GMT
Picking up reports Labour are not telling at a couple of polling stations... either they think they have it won or just do not have the resources.? Given the level of party membership not merely in this seat but London more generally, that "explanation" does stretch credulity a tad. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2018 9:13:32 GMT
From what I can tell, a decent amount of people find telling operations nosey/rude/off-putting, or perceive it as intrusive collection of their data. This seems to be less common with age - the older you are, the more likely you are to have come across tellers multiple times in the past, I suppose. I'd imagine these people also take less issue with it when the teller is fairly old themselves.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2018 9:44:35 GMT
From what I can tell, a decent amount of people find telling operations nosey/rude/off-putting, or perceive it as intrusive collection of their data. This seems to be less common with age - the older you are, the more likely you are to have come across tellers multiple times in the past, I suppose. I'd imagine these people also take less issue with it when the teller is fairly old themselves. nothing new there then |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Jun 14, 2018 9:46:36 GMT
I would hope/assume that the large well organised parties have an abundance of volunteers today and a fair few of them of an age where delivering/knocking up for hours on end is less desirable, therefor a strong telling operation can be beneficial.
Fully accept that if you've only got 100 helpers, prioritise knocking up, but on a day like today when the only other alternative is the delayed election in Southwalk there should be plenty of scope to draft inn activists and helpers from the rest of London and the South East.
The few (and I mean few) occasions I've been a teller, some people have refused point blank to give me their number, those that ask always seem to understand why it's being done, so I wouldn't say its too nosey/rude/off-putting etc.
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Jun 14, 2018 9:49:35 GMT
I remember having an argument with one voter (after she had voted) who refused to give me her number and interrogated me about why I wanted. She maintained she had an absolute right to secrecy about not just who she had voted for but whether she had voted at all. I pointed out that after the election we would buy from the Returning Officer a copy of the marked register which showed exactly who had voted which she refused to believe.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 14, 2018 10:02:34 GMT
I would hope/assume that the large well organised parties have an abundance of volunteers today and a fair few of them of an age where delivering/knocking up for hours on end is less desirable, therefor a strong telling operation can be beneficial. Fully accept that if you've only got 100 helpers, prioritise knocking up, but on a day like today when the only other alternative is the delayed election in Southwalk there should be plenty of scope to draft inn activists and helpers from the rest of London and the South East. The few (and I mean few) occasions I've been a teller, some people have refused point blank to give me their number, those that ask always seem to understand why it's being done, so I wouldn't say its too nosey/rude/off-putting etc. @barnabymarder and Arthur Figgis are good examples |
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Post by catking on Jun 14, 2018 10:02:34 GMT
I remember having an argument with one voter (after she had voted) who refused to give me her number and interrogated me about why I wanted. She maintained she had an absolute right to secrecy about not just who she had voted for but whether she had voted at all. I pointed out that after the election we would buy from the Returning Officer a copy of the marked register which showed exactly who had voted which she refused to believe.
I'm always amused by the myths many voters believe about elections.
Some are convinced that the secret ballot isn't real and that political parties can find out how they voted afterwards.
Others insist angrily that we're not allowed to campaign on polling day and that it is illegal.
But my favourite is the burning anger some voters get when they find out you know their name. Some simply refuse to accept that political parties can have access to the unredacted electoral roll. Having grown sick of arguing with the angriest voters about this point who have chased me down the street after receiving a mail merged piece of literature, I now respond to the question "how do you know my name?" with the answer "I rummaged through your bins" before walking off.
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Jun 14, 2018 10:12:06 GMT
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Post by carlton43 on Jun 14, 2018 10:16:26 GMT
I remember having an argument with one voter (after she had voted) who refused to give me her number and interrogated me about why I wanted. She maintained she had an absolute right to secrecy about not just who she had voted for but whether she had voted at all. I pointed out that after the election we would buy from the Returning Officer a copy of the marked register which showed exactly who had voted which she refused to believe.
I'm always amused by the myths many voters believe about elections.
Some are convinced that the secret ballot isn't real and that political parties can find out how they voted afterwards.
Others insist angrily that we're not allowed to campaign on polling day and that it is illegal.
But my favourite is the burning anger some voters get when they find out you know their name. Some simply refuse to accept that political parties can have access to the unredacted electoral roll. Having grown sick of arguing with the angriest voters about this point who have chased me down the street after receiving a mail merged piece of literature, I now respond to the question "how do you know my name?" with the answer "I rummaged through your bins" before walking off.
Please forgive me for observing that all of that is deeply silly on your own part also. One tries to present well as a party officer of any rank or none. For that moment you represent the party to others. So you should be neat, tidy and pleasant. You are not on a mission to correct misunderstandings or mad views held by others. Never argue because you cannot win without enraging or distressing the voter and he will not thank you for it, will be less likely to vote for you now and in future, and will cascade those feelings about you and your party throughout his circle. Be general and mild and helpful in response. Say that there is an Electoral register that lists all voters by name and address, that we are merely 'telling' so as to avoid someone knocking on your door in the evening asking you to vote when you have already done so. In face of anger always apologise, shrug and sympathise, AND smile. It turneth away anger. Never get cocky, clever or argumentative yourself. You should know all that! |
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