Greek Election 2012

[erlend]

How far down the list does the president have to go? And can he offer it to anyone else that he thinks could make a go of it?

[Pete Whitehead]

What happens if the KKE say yes?

[Andrew_S]

One report I read made it sound like only the top three parties get a chance at forming a government.

Meanwhile the latest bailout installment for Greece has been held back:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18014075

[Deleted]

Wouldn't it be better all round if this Greek tragedy, which is like a car crash in slow motion, was just ended by kicking Greece out of the Euro rather than prolonging the agony?

Had they had austerity (lived within their means...) some years ago, it would have been much lighter than what they are having to have now - something that only the two deluded Eds can apparently not see...

[The Bishop]

Shame you had to end that post with such a petty and irrelevant aside

[Deleted]

Sorry Bish but it is very relevant. Ed & Ed would take us exactly down that same path of jam today but more severe long-term pain later, just like Brown did.

The French appear to be going down that path, and when they get some short-term and unsustainable growth, you can bet your bottom Euro that a smug Ed Balls will be claiming it vindicates his policy...

[erlend]

I think not even the Eds would go as far as the Greeks went but would still go well too far.

[Richard Allen]

May 9, 2012 23:48:32 GMT erlend said:

I think not even the Eds would go as far as the Greeks went but would still go well too far.

I think the obvious point here is no one would deliberately go to far but the exact point at where you have gone to far is pretty much impossible to see and can easily be stumbled over unintentionally.

[toryjim]

May 10, 2012 12:11:46 GMT ArmchairCritic said:

May 9, 2012 23:24:40 GMT @thesituation said:

Wouldn't it be better all round if this Greek tragedy, which is like a car crash in slow motion, was just ended by kicking Greece out of the Euro rather than prolonging the agony?

Well, strangely enough this is the myth......that Greece can be kicked out of the Euro.....They can't be. There is no mechanism to do so.

The Greeks can adopt any currency they like if they are minded to. Montenegro adopted the Euro but are not in the formal group of Eurozone countries.

If Greece leaves, it will need to be Greece's decision.

Not having a mechanism won't stop it happening if needs be. The problem is that there will be all manner of collateral damage from Greece exiting.

[East Anglian Lefty]

May 10, 2012 11:14:37 GMT Richard Allen said:

May 9, 2012 23:48:32 GMT erlend said:

I think not even the Eds would go as far as the Greeks went but would still go well too far.

I think the obvious point here is no one would deliberately go to far but the exact point at where you have gone to far is pretty much impossible to see and can easily be stumbled over unintentionally.

Whether Greece did actually 'go too far' is another matter entirely, of course, since their problems don't stem from suddenly spending too much. Rather it's a cocktail of endemic tax evasion, wasteful spending and lying about the public finances, all of which have been around for decades. They didn't go too far, they were already there.

[Sibboleth]

Now, now, now. Mustn't let the facts get in the way of partisan bitching.

[Andrew_S]

"Third Greek coalition bid fails":

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18041223

[tricky]

May 10, 2012 12:11:46 GMT ArmchairCritic said:

May 9, 2012 23:24:40 GMT @thesituation said:

Wouldn't it be better all round if this Greek tragedy, which is like a car crash in slow motion, was just ended by kicking Greece out of the Euro rather than prolonging the agony?

Well, strangely enough this is the myth......that Greece can be kicked out of the Euro.....They can't be. There is no mechanism to do so.

The Greeks can adopt any currency they like if they are minded to. Montenegro adopted the Euro but are not in the formal group of Eurozone countries.

If Greece leaves, it will need to be Greece's decision.

Untrue. There is a process. There wasn't before Lisbon but there is now.

The problem for Greece is that there is no way to leave/be kicked out of the Euro without also exiting the EU itself.

It's academic anyway in my opinion, the Grexit is going to happen I suspect because the voters are going to vote for it. Then they will get what they voted for and that won't be pleasant.

[Richard Allen]

We certainly do appear to be approaching the endgame. Unless one of the "anti-bailout" parties fold within the next couple of days we are clearly heading for another election and it is hard to see ND and Pasok making any improvements.

[Deleted]

The truth is that Greece should never have joined the Euro but political dogma prevailed over economic reality. Greece joined in 2002 some three years later the first entrants because they hadn't met the criteria by miles. This was then convieniently fudged in 2002 because the EU wanted to create a sense of inenvitability of all EU countries joining, including of course the big prize of the UK. The rest is history...

It is time to stop throwing good money after bad. The EU or the global economy will not impload by a relatively small country leaving the Euro. The media assume it will but offer no explanation as to how. Countries change currencies all the time and it mostly goes unnoticed.

[toryjim]

May 11, 2012 23:45:58 GMT @thesituation said:

The truth is that Greece should never have joined the Euro but political dogma prevailed over economic reality. Greece joined in 2002 some three years later the first entrants because they hadn't met the criteria by miles. This was then convieniently fudged in 2002 because the EU wanted to create a sense of inenvitability of all EU countries joining, including of course the big prize of the UK. The rest is history...

It is time to stop throwing good money after bad. The EU or the global economy will not impload by a relatively small country leaving the Euro. The media assume it will but offer no explanation as to how. Countries change currencies all the time and it mostly goes unnoticed.

The problem is that when Howongaland changes from one currency to another few people are exposed to such a country and the relative movements. The Euro is different because it is a currency union, so any moves against the Euro following a Greek exit will be costly. There is also the nasty little prob of European bank exposure to Greek sovereign debt. The bailouts weren't really about solving the problem but buying time for French and Belgian banks to unwind their exposure. Some of that has happened but there is still a multi-billion dollar hole that will be blown in the finances of a frightening number of european banks.

[Deleted]

May 11, 2012 23:28:29 GMT Richard Allen said:

We certainly do appear to be approaching the endgame. Unless one of the "anti-bailout" parties fold within the next couple of days we are clearly heading for another election and it is hard to see ND and Pasok making any improvements.

Appears that SYRIZA is now leading with 23.8% in latest polls.

www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/10/us-greece-poll-idUSBRE84915C20120510

[Andrew_S]

Golden Dawn have an invitation to the Greek presidential mansion tomorrow:

www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/may/12/greek-president-last-ditch-unity

[johnloony]

May 12, 2012 5:40:03 GMT toryjim said:

The problem is that when Howongaland changes from one currency ...

Where?

[Deleted]

from Sky

Greek anti-bailout party leader, Alexis Tsipras, says other parties have agreed two-year coalition deal excluding his party

how is that possible ?