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Post by London Republic on Jan 22, 2021 7:25:16 GMT
There are several hundred black professional singers who should have got that gig ahead of her, but Woke was never about black lives actually mattering You seem to forget that African-Americans are well represented among American Musicans, likewise they where well represented in Biden's Inauguration as well. In fact I would argue that all of America's various communities where well represented in said Inauguration. |
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Post by London Republic on Jan 22, 2021 7:32:38 GMT
This is unbelievable: apparently Darth Murdoch is upset at Fox for calling the Arizona result correctly, and has sacked people for it. Yes. While Rupert Murdoch has played a big part in propping up the Conservative Right (in Britain, America & Australia) well past it's sell by date and has also done a fine job in conning a large section of the population (in Britain, America & Australia) to back Political Movements that support Laissez Faire Capitalism (despite the fact only a small % actually benefit from it), its clear that he has finally lost the plot from the economic & political perspective. Because as anyone with any sense would know; it makes more sense to try and win the streaming wars & monopolise the Media Sector (and promote a broader, more socially liberal message) than to carry on the dark arts of Conservative Right Propaganda towards a shrinking audience.
Hence why I feel that alongside doubling down on Conservative Right Propaganda and selling most of the Murdoch Media Empire to Disney (1); Rupert's biggest mistake was appointing Lachlan Murdoch to suceed him over James Murdoch, which all but guaranteed the fate of the Murdoch Media Empire towards economic & political irrelevance. Because while James Murdoch is a deeply flawed indivudual (2), at least he would have enough sense to realise that said empire needed to get out of the dark arts and instead focus on winning the various wars over the media sector's future.
(1) Rather than instead selling Fox News & the Tabloids and using the Murdoch's political influence to convince the Obama & Trump Adminstrations to allow News Corporation to buy Time Warner, NBCUniveral & Viacom/CBS (all of which where up for graps during the previous decade). Something that would have not only allowed the Murdochs to win the Streaming Wars and monopolise the Media Sector, but would have also allowed their economic & political influence to not only survive into the next generation, but also be futher expanded as well.
(2) From goading the Conservatives into spending the next decade doing their very best to destroy the BBC (something that has been quite sucessfull sadly) to being underqualified to actually run a Media Conglomerate
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Post by London Republic on Jan 22, 2021 7:36:58 GMT
I am not saying it warrants sackings but the election night call of Arizona was a bad call and the fact that Biden did eventually win Arizona doesn't change that. There is no way that they had enough information to call it when they did and had they believed it was going to be anything like as close as it was they wouldn't have called it. Fox News's Electoral Predictions Team does have a reliable record when it comes to Elections Calls (since the car crash that was the 2000 Presidential Election at least) and is willng to stand by their calls no matter how much unhappness it causes to the Conservative Right. Hence why they refused to drop their call (in 2012) in relation to Obama winning Ohio (which was of course correct), despite Karl Rove and other Fox News Presenters both pressuring them into doing exactly that.
Likewise if anything it's better to have a Predictions Team that actually makes the right calls rather than instead try & please the feelings of certain people. Because not only would it make the pain of defeat easier when it actually happens, but it also allows one to bring forward any discussions over why such a defeat has happened.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2021 9:01:08 GMT
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Jan 22, 2021 10:26:55 GMT
Wait... I thought the big mid-term backlash to Obama was caused by "white supremacy", but now we hear it was caused by his stimulus not being big enough? Oh... {shrug}
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Post by matureleft on Jan 22, 2021 10:47:30 GMT
Wait... I thought the big mid-term backlash to Obama was caused by "white supremacy", but now we hear it was caused by his stimulus not being big enough? Oh... {shrug} You do have some bees in your bonnet!
As I recall the 2010 mid-terms were focused on a. Obamacare (which was seen as a threat by many, encouraged by vigorous campaigning, and, of course, it didn't yet exist to offer its benefits) and b. the economy and the perceived inequity and inefficiency (to ordinary voters) of what had been done. I don't think "culture war" stuff played much part. Indeed it's worth stating the obvious: Obama was re-elected fairly comfortably in 2012. So it's difficult to claim that that stuff was dominant. And I may be lonely in this view but I still regard those things as matters that really drive the votes of relatively few (but more than then). Trump certainly elevated those anxieties (both ways of course). But his progress in deindustrialised and rural America was based on a wider discontent.
So who exactly thinks that "white supremacy" played some meaningful role in 2010?
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Jan 22, 2021 11:06:25 GMT
I'm surprised you didn't notice, but since Trump got elected a wave of tedious revisionist articles have argued that "White supremacy" was responsible for pretty much every bad thing, and the 2010 elections are definitely in there (argued as the harbinger for Trump). The word "whitelash" was invented for this.
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The Bishop
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Post by The Bishop on Jan 22, 2021 12:10:29 GMT
I'm surprised you didn't notice, but since Trump got elected a wave of tedious revisionist articles have argued that "White supremacy" was responsible for pretty much every bad thing, and the 2010 elections are definitely in there (argued as the harbinger for Trump). The word "whitelash" was invented for this. I mean, nobody is saying it was the *main* reason but (amongst other things) the "birther" nonsense was well established by then wasn't it? Whilst a majority in the US welcomed his election, there was a significant section of people who deeply resented having a non-white POTUS from the start. They were also more likely to vote in lower turnout mid-term elections. |
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Post by matureleft on Jan 22, 2021 12:21:02 GMT
I'm surprised you didn't notice, but since Trump got elected a wave of tedious revisionist articles have argued that "White supremacy" was responsible for pretty much every bad thing, and the 2010 elections are definitely in there (argued as the harbinger for Trump). The word "whitelash" was invented for this. Presumably some of your Twitter twits? If so, indeed I don't notice... You should try and spend some time away from that medium.
The 2010 elections were much more Tea Party, a very different, genuinely Conservative in origin, movement. Of course there's a bit of cross over between the nativist Trump stuff and deep fiscal conservatives with a strong aversion to central government otherwise his coalition couldn't have worked. Judicial appointments. The tax code. Cutting back the power of federal agencies. But a fair number of fiscal conservatives would have been appalled at the ballooning deficit (even before the virus). Hence the noisy Republican mess over the additional boost being discussed during the Georgia elections. |
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Jan 22, 2021 13:17:54 GMT
Yeh, I agree with you entirely on 2010. I disagree on the whole "whitelash" narrative being a Twitter thing, obvs - perhaps if you read more US media like the NYT and WaPo (which I do a lot, unfortunately - I need to give that up!) you'd understand that better.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2021 8:09:45 GMT
Viewing figures
Trump's inauguration: 39 million
Biden's inauguration: 40 million
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Post by matureleft on Jan 23, 2021 8:34:16 GMT
Yeh, I agree with you entirely on 2010. I disagree on the whole "whitelash" narrative being a Twitter thing, obvs - perhaps if you read more US media like the NYT and WaPo (which I do a lot, unfortunately - I need to give that up!) you'd understand that better. Glad we agree on the substance. But you still haven't given an example of someone claiming that this was what happened in 2010. Do share. |
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Post by London Republic on Jan 23, 2021 8:37:50 GMT
I'm surprised you didn't notice, but since Trump got elected a wave of tedious revisionist articles have argued that "White supremacy" was responsible for pretty much every bad thing, and the 2010 elections are definitely in there (argued as the harbinger for Trump). The word "whitelash" was invented for this. Presumably some of your Twitter twits? If so, indeed I don't notice... You should try and spend some time away from that medium.
Not going to lie; while Twitter is a good place to promote ones message, I would much rather have discussions on this fourm instead. Mainly because one is better able to have a proper political debate on this forum. |
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Jan 23, 2021 9:49:57 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2021 10:45:37 GMT
Viewing figures Trump's inauguration: 31 million Biden's inauguration: 40 million Well, this is the first inauguration I've viewed live, to see if anything kicked off, also to make sure responsibility safely passed over to the grown-ups. So, Trump can rightly claim that some people only watched because of him  |
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Post by matureleft on Jan 23, 2021 10:55:10 GMT
Thanks. An interesting read. It would certainly be a perverse person who felt that race had nothing to do with voting behaviour in the US (or, for that matter, most other places, but the US, for historical reasons, has a sharper profile I'd guess). His contention is that Obama's election increased resentment among those prepared to be influenced by these instincts. I'd guess intuitively that's probably so, and his data supports that. However some of his analysis muddles two things: 1. Resentment against Obama because he was black 2. Opposition to the policies of an Obama presidency, thus making his identification with Democrat candidates in 2010 problematic.
It also seems not to discuss the longer-term realignment of the south, as the core area of historical memory and overt racism. This was largely complete by the time Obama was elected, but probably had a little more to run.
In a relatively low turnout election, as the 2010 mid terms were, an increase in straightforward racial preference might well have made some difference (although the other factors we've agreed on would have counted for more both in motivating Republicans and demotivating Democrats, and his limited policy data seems to show that). But 2012 demonstrated the limits of that effect with a relatively normal Republican candidate and a higher turnout. Trump's arrival in 2016 removed any dog whistles and substituted fog horns. His 2020 performance suggested that some in both Latino and black communities set aside his rhetoric and looked at what was happening in their own lives. For example tax cuts work for affluent people of any race.
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Jan 23, 2021 11:19:12 GMT
I agree with your analysis. Also, in retrospect of how GOP supporters have reacted to Biden (who is obviously not black) in the last year - which stretched as far as literal insurrection - I think it becomes harder to argue that the similar (but lesser) behaviour towards Obama was primarily driven by Obama being black.
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The Bishop
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Post by The Bishop on Jan 23, 2021 11:24:21 GMT
Yes, but in the immediate aftermath of 2008 stuff like "DEMS ARE A VAST PAEDOPHILE CONSPIRACY" was hardly even on the fringe of the fringe.
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Post by therealriga on Jan 23, 2021 11:26:28 GMT
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mboy
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Post by mboy on Jan 23, 2021 11:29:53 GMT
Surely a lot of people who despise Trump watched his inauguration just to cringe? I did!
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