|
|
Post by finsobruce on Feb 16, 2017 0:13:24 GMT
Cut all benefits and introduce an atheist tax. Speaking as an agnostic, where does that leave me? ... in every sense!  Needing the services of a non denominational accountant? anyway while you're here could you post in the link the song title thread?  |
|
carlton43
Reform Party
Posts: 51,014 
Member is Online
|
Post by carlton43 on Feb 16, 2017 0:18:05 GMT
Cut all benefits and introduce an atheist tax. Speaking as an agnostic, where does that leave me? ... in every sense! Agnostics are Atheists in the LD party. |
|
Sharon
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 2,564 
|
Post by Sharon on Feb 16, 2017 0:29:52 GMT
Not sure why funding is being discussed here as that's clearly not been the cause of the winter crisis (at least not directly: social care cuts have clearly not helped). The phrase @benjl (and the Labour Party in general but let us be realistic here comrades) wants to use instead is 'government mismanagement'. That's a bit of an understatement there! This is going way off-topic, but put quite bluntly, the current situation of hospitals missing their Emergency Department targets, is because of delayed discharge - people who are medically fit to go home, but need complex care packages, that cash-strapped Councils (of all political colours) are struggling to provide. We need a joined-up Health & Social Care service. |
|
|
|
Post by curiousliberal on Feb 16, 2017 1:53:49 GMT
no until you and the millionaires open your wallets the NHS will be cash starved. Not my problem you are clearly ideologically opposed to tax as a Tory, I realise that. But i'mfighting to protect what the great Nye Bevan set up. ‘The NHS will last as long as there are folk left with the faith to fight for it.’- you've got to understand that most Labour Party members & supporters take that quote very seriously, we will fight you every step of the way if you even think about switching to an insurance based system. Find the cash to fund it properly then I'll stop going on about it - promise!Cut all benefits and introduce an atheist tax.For someone who railed against the supposedly malign influence of Islam in the UK, you are surprisingly in favour of something awfully similar to the dhimmi (assuming you are not trolling). Why? |
|
neilm
Non-Aligned
Posts: 25,023
|
Copeland
Feb 16, 2017 4:13:18 GMT
via mobile
Post by neilm on Feb 16, 2017 4:13:18 GMT
The PM has done that face again  Oddly enough, that's the face I make whenever I have to be near kids. Maybe Andrea Leadsom was onto something! |
|
neilm
Non-Aligned
Posts: 25,023
|
Post by neilm on Feb 16, 2017 4:30:19 GMT
Producer interest. Good Labour principle. Are you seriously suggesting that these midwives should not be consulted or be listened to because of 'producer interest', and until you provide evidence that they are acting for their own advantage I am going to take there word for it, this hospital closing will cause DEATHS Love how the party that wet from social democratic and anti war to basically soft tory and pro middle east intervention in 10 years members are talking about principles! At least we have some, whats your lates scam? oh yes going against democracy, funny given your party's name Are you for real? I like your (unfocused) idealism because I wanted to change the world when I was 18. I still do, and I'm still unfocused. But I don't blindly listen to experts when it comes to the economics of healthcare. Why? Because I'm a realist. The NHS is producer led and is held up globally as an example of that. It's self serving and needs to be trimmed. I'm also a damn sight more qualified in health economics than most NHS managers, and definitely more than most consultants or GPs. I've got bits of paper in frames to prove that. If you'd like to take me on over this then please do. I welcome debate and I'm happy to be proven wrong or come up against a sound argument. Also, there word? It's 'their word': for someone who boasts of their GCSE grade that's poor. Maybe fear of the predicted deaths has addled your perspective? |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 8:32:03 GMT
5. "Going against democracy"? How? Your party's position is that the uk should stay in EU and it's MPs voted against article 50. Please tell me of this is otherwise as we are loosing many remain voters who have convinced themselves that Labour had betrayed them over article vote and have joined the party they hated at the election just 2 years ago. How do you distinguish yourself from a tory, most Lib Dems on here could easily pass as conservative imo.  |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 8:56:16 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Copeland
Feb 16, 2017 9:00:39 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 9:00:39 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 9:11:30 GMT
These sorts of things have no affect on me - people choose to be parents. |
|
Crimson King
Lib Dem
Be nice to each other and sing in tune
Posts: 9,854
|
Post by Crimson King on Feb 16, 2017 9:20:31 GMT
Again, citation needed. You see Benji you're in grave danger of making a fool of yourself here, because - as far as I am aware - no hospital providing maternity services is proposed for closure in Copeland. My understanding is that the preferred option for Whitehaven is 24hour midwife-led maternity care. The only change is that night-time consultant cover will be withdrawn which means high-risk cases will go to Carlisle. That's my understanding, because I've carried out some basic research into the issue. Have you? But is a 40 miles night trip really a good idea for an high-risk pregnant woman? It may be if the alternative is delivering in a unit which doesnt hav ethe facilities she needs, or it may not be. I don't know,and neither does @benjl. But I do know its a bit more complicated than some are making out |
|
maxque
Non-Aligned
Posts: 9,312
|
Post by maxque on Feb 16, 2017 9:28:32 GMT
But is a 40 miles night trip really a good idea for an high-risk pregnant woman? It may be if the alternative is delivering in a unit which doesnt hav ethe facilities she needs, or it may not be. I don't know,and neither does @benjl . But I do know its a bit more complicated than some are making out Indeed, that's why I asked a question, to advance debate. My point, in general, is than I'm opposed to using quotas for things like that (like "the settlement must have 25k inhabitants for that service"). Local context and the distance to get the service is important. Going to another hospital is easier in big cities and dense urban areas than in rural or less dense areas. Also, wouldn't people living south of Whitehaven (so most of the constituency) prefer going to Barrow than Carlisle? |
|
|
|
Post by finsobruce on Feb 16, 2017 9:35:33 GMT
These sorts of things have no affect on me - people choose to be parents. Top Tory advocates one child policy. |
|
john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 15,809
|
Copeland
Feb 16, 2017 9:48:06 GMT
via mobile
Post by john07 on Feb 16, 2017 9:48:06 GMT
no until you and the millionaires open your wallets the NHS will be cash starved. Not my problem you are clearly ideologically opposed to tax as a Tory, I realise that. But i'mfighting to protect what the great Nye Bevan set up. ‘The NHS will last as long as there are folk left with the faith to fight for it.’- you've got to understand that most Labour Party members & supporters take that quote very seriously, we will fight you every step of the way if you even think about switching to an insurance based system. Find the cash to fund it properly then I'll stop going on about it - promise! I wonder what Aneurin (to give him his proper name) would have thought of the PFIs which are crippling some hospitals (including at least one in Cumbria). And what he'd think of the party which introduced them ... What's this alt news you are coming out with? PFI was a concept invented by the Conservative administration in the 1990s. Labour followed this up with the PPP. |
|
|
|
Post by Adam in Stroud on Feb 16, 2017 9:56:37 GMT
Fair enough, but I wouldn't apply for a job writing Conservative election material if I were you. |
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,998
Member is Online
|
Post by The Bishop on Feb 16, 2017 10:13:33 GMT
Also, wouldn't people living south of Whitehaven (so most of the constituency) prefer going to Barrow than Carlisle? South of Egremont more likely, which is very much a minority in population if not land area terms. |
|
|
|
Post by mrpastelito on Feb 16, 2017 12:12:49 GMT
Cut all benefits and introduce an atheist tax.For someone who railed against the supposedly malign influence of Islam in the UK, you are surprisingly in favour of something awfully similar to the dhimmi (assuming you are not trolling). Why? Do I really have to confess I was trolling? Benji mentioned on the Islam thread he was an atheist, so I thought it a great idea to tax him in order to save his beloved NHS. |
|
The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,998
Member is Online
|
Post by The Bishop on Feb 16, 2017 12:30:32 GMT
Beg to disagree - if Labour hold this seat on the back of a campaign where the future of the local hospital featured prominently, it may send a message?
|
|
|
|
Post by gwynthegriff on Feb 16, 2017 12:31:39 GMT
I wonder what Aneurin (to give him his proper name) would have thought of the PFIs which are crippling some hospitals (including at least one in Cumbria). Did the NHS that Bevan created have pay beds in NHS hospitals? Were hospital consultants required to work full time in the NHS or were they allowed to continue private work? Did it require GP surgeries to be owned by the state or did it leave them as private businesses? I have no doubt you already know the answers to all those questions David. |
|
|
|
Post by gwynthegriff on Feb 16, 2017 12:33:54 GMT
Maternity is not closing. As already explained. I suspect the reality is that the night consultant spends his time twiddling his thumbs, doing things way below his pay scale. At a cost - I would estimate - of £500K per annum. For the occasional high-risk case which will now go to Carlisle. NHS hospitals are massively overstretched, Yes, we know that. I can tell you there is no twiddling of thumbs, Work in the NHS do you? that's just what conservatives tell themselves to justify cuts. Evil Tories againAssertion is not evidence. |
|
