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Post by Ron Swanson on Jul 6, 2024 9:43:07 GMT
Every candidate has an election agent. it's just that sometimes the agent happens to also be the candidate (I was both in Coventry East, for example).
As for Farage organising a comeback, he only did that after the election was called. It might have been a snap decision, or it might have been always planned as a publicity stunt to be timed just after the election had been called. But it almost certainly would not have happened when it did if Sunak had left the election until the autumn.
I think that is nearly certainly the case. It would have been better for Farage to have done this last year and to have milked the scene for much longer. Better planning, more training, more vetting, more money and crucially a much more robust network of ground support and mutual aid; but it's not him is it? He likes the sudden drama and the personality cult and the grandstanding effects of being the star, the centre of gravity and the principal mover and shaker, without whom none of it being seen to be possible. He is the core attraction the reason for the success, such as it is; but also the major constraint on the development of a modern mass party as well!! Also, a lot of people who get involved with smaller/fringe (call it what you will) parties want to be seen to be doing something - so being a candidate basically, rather than actually doing something like being an agent to a handful of local council candidates and coming up with strategies for things like postal votes, collecting data and so on. |
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ricmk
Lib Dem
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Post by ricmk on Jul 6, 2024 9:48:50 GMT
Every candidate has an election agent. it's just that sometimes the agent happens to also be the candidate (I was both in Coventry East, for example).
As for Farage organising a comeback, he only did that after the election was called. It might have been a snap decision, or it might have been always planned as a publicity stunt to be timed just after the election had been called. But it almost certainly would not have happened when it did if Sunak had left the election until the autumn.
I think that is nearly certainly the case. It would have been better for Farage to have done this last year and to have milked the scene for much longer. Better planning, more training, more vetting, more money and crucially a much more robust network of ground support and mutual aid; but it's not him is it? He likes the sudden drama and the personality cult and the grandstanding effects of being the star, the centre of gravity and the principal mover and shaker, without whom none of it being seen to be possible. He is the core attraction the reason for the success, such as it is; but also the major constraint on the development of a modern mass party as well!! Are we sure about that? Reform seemed to have peaked, and awkward comments by candidates, Farage himself, and their supporters were being highlighted. They were under scrutiny as never before, and their polling was sliding back a little in that final week. The Tories also took the fight to Reform/Farage in a way never seen before after the Putin comments, after years of cosying up to them and pretending they were 'part of the family.' Isn't there a case that Farage timed it perfectly, so the election came at the peak for Reform, and that they would have gone backwards with further scrutiny, rather than forwards with more planning/campaign time? We'll never know but from here it looks like Farage timed things very smartly. |
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carlton43
Reform Party
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Post by carlton43 on Jul 6, 2024 10:11:47 GMT
I think that is nearly certainly the case. It would have been better for Farage to have done this last year and to have milked the scene for much longer. Better planning, more training, more vetting, more money and crucially a much more robust network of ground support and mutual aid; but it's not him is it? He likes the sudden drama and the personality cult and the grandstanding effects of being the star, the centre of gravity and the principal mover and shaker, without whom none of it being seen to be possible. He is the core attraction the reason for the success, such as it is; but also the major constraint on the development of a modern mass party as well!! Are we sure about that? Reform seemed to have peaked, and awkward comments by candidates, Farage himself, and their supporters were being highlighted. They were under scrutiny as never before, and their polling was sliding back a little in that final week. The Tories also took the fight to Reform/Farage in a way never seen before after the Putin comments, after years of cosying up to them and pretending they were 'part of the family.' Isn't there a case that Farage timed it perfectly, so the election came at the peak for Reform, and that they would have gone backwards with further scrutiny, rather than forwards with more planning/campaign time? We'll never know but from here it looks like Farage timed things very smartly. Well, Yes and No, Lord Copper, and up to a point Lord Copper! Farage is what Farage does. Without him, dull slow steady progress, and fewer votes and no seats. It is what people faced with Lloyd-George, Churchill and Boris. A lot of benefit and a lot of collateral damage. Anti-wokism and off-colour jokes are a real benefit, mild racism probably does no harm, but the Putin remarks (shared 100% by me) much better not touched upon at all. Those remarks damaged the party, stopped the bandwagon, diminished the final poll reading, diminished their vote, diminished their number of seats and possibly saved another 25 Conservative seats. It was a monumental error and I am sure he knows it. |
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Post by mrpastelito on Jul 6, 2024 11:08:07 GMT
He was too outspoken. He should simply have said that we could and probably should have done more to avoid this terrible war. Wouldn't have been like him, though.
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Post by eastmidlandsright on Jul 6, 2024 11:08:54 GMT
Every candidate has an election agent. it's just that sometimes the agent happens to also be the candidate (I was both in Coventry East, for example).
As for Farage organising a comeback, he only did that after the election was called. It might have been a snap decision, or it might have been always planned as a publicity stunt to be timed just after the election had been called. But it almost certainly would not have happened when it did if Sunak had left the election until the autumn.
I think that is nearly certainly the case. It would have been better for Farage to have done this last year and to have milked the scene for much longer. Better planning, more training, more vetting, more money and crucially a much more robust network of ground support and mutual aid; but it's not him is it? He likes the sudden drama and the personality cult and the grandstanding effects of being the star, the centre of gravity and the principal mover and shaker, without whom none of it being seen to be possible. He is the core attraction the reason for the success, such as it is; but also the major constraint on the development of a modern mass party as well!! It would have certainly helped get organisation in place but even Farage can only milk the scene for so long before people start to lose interest. From a publicity perspective the late entry works brilliantly. |
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Post by eastmidlandsright on Jul 6, 2024 11:12:43 GMT
Are we sure about that? Reform seemed to have peaked, and awkward comments by candidates, Farage himself, and their supporters were being highlighted. They were under scrutiny as never before, and their polling was sliding back a little in that final week. The Tories also took the fight to Reform/Farage in a way never seen before after the Putin comments, after years of cosying up to them and pretending they were 'part of the family.' Isn't there a case that Farage timed it perfectly, so the election came at the peak for Reform, and that they would have gone backwards with further scrutiny, rather than forwards with more planning/campaign time? We'll never know but from here it looks like Farage timed things very smartly. Well, Yes and No, Lord Copper, and up to a point Lord Copper! Farage is what Farage does. Without him, dull slow steady progress, and fewer votes and no seats. It is what people faced with Lloyd-George, Churchill and Boris. A lot of benefit and a lot of collateral damage. Anti-wokism and off-colour jokes are a real benefit, mild racism probably does no harm, but the Putin remarks (shared 100% by me) much better not touched upon at all. Those remaks damaged rhe party, stopped the bandwagon, diminished the final poll reading, diminished their vote, diminished their number of seats and possibly saved another 25 Conservative seats. It was a monumental error and I am sure he knows it. I am cynical enough to think that Farage has got exactly what he wanted. 15-20 Reform MPs would have included far too many of unknown quality and reliability. A small team of reliable MPs and strong base for the next election is probably he best possible outcome for Reform. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 6, 2024 16:05:57 GMT
Well, Yes and No, Lord Copper, and up to a point Lord Copper! Farage is what Farage does. Without him, dull slow steady progress, and fewer votes and no seats. It is what people faced with Lloyd-George, Churchill and Boris. A lot of benefit and a lot of collateral damage. Anti-wokism and off-colour jokes are a real benefit, mild racism probably does no harm, but the Putin remarks (shared 100% by me) much better not touched upon at all. Those remaks damaged rhe party, stopped the bandwagon, diminished the final poll reading, diminished their vote, diminished their number of seats and possibly saved another 25 Conservative seats. It was a monumental error and I am sure he knows it. I am cynical enough to think that Farage has got exactly what he wanted. 15-20 Reform MPs would have included far too many of unknown quality and reliability. A small team of reliable MPs and strong base for the next election is probably he best possible outcome for Reform. It's much better for Farage than in 2015 because it's Labour in gov't. It's easier for the Tories to (try to) outflank Farage than it is for the Labour Party. |
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john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 15,774
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Post by john07 on Jul 6, 2024 16:15:59 GMT
I am cynical enough to think that Farage has got exactly what he wanted. 15-20 Reform MPs would have included far too many of unknown quality and reliability. A small team of reliable MPs and strong base for the next election is probably he best possible outcome for Reform. It's much better for Farage than in 2015 because it's Labour in gov't. It's easier for the Tories to (try to) outflank Farage than it is for the Labour Party. It didn’t seem to stop some Tories doing that over the previous Parliament! |
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essexman
Reform Party
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Post by essexman on Jul 7, 2024 17:48:55 GMT
Nigel Farage said the Reform candidate here didn’t have an election agent and was at the recount with his mum and dad. If somewhere promising like here had no election agent, could say 90% or more Reform candidates not have had election agents? Also, would this be the only MP elected in the country without one? I for one think a later election would have helped Reform. They would have had a few months to fundraise and get the barebones organisation like agents between Nigel announcing a comeback and the election date. A good few 3-4% losses could have fallen into line (Basildon & Billericay, Sittingbourne & Sheppey, Hornchurch & Upminster, SW Norfolk, Llanelli). Every candidate has an election agent. it's just that sometimes the agent happens to also be the candidate (I was both in Coventry East, for example).
As for Farage organising a comeback, he only did that after the election was called. It might have been a snap decision, or it might have been always planned as a publicity stunt to be timed just after the election had been called. But it almost certainly would not have happened when it did if Sunak had left the election until the autumn.
Thank you - I’m all a bit new to this. There must be many candidates in that position, though probably not so many elected while being their own agent? I was basing the comeback on him saying he had “a venue booked for next week” to announce it when the election was called. We’ll never know for sure but I do accept that was a convenient line. There could have been some logic to that planned date - the earliest point that wouldn’t have given the Tories time to call a pre-summer recess election. In hindsight I imagine he wishes he came back a month or so earlier to get some money in the door and some basic hiring/organising/vetting sorted. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2024 17:53:20 GMT
UKIP 2015 / Reform 2024
Castle Point - 31.1% / 30.2%
Clacton - 44.4% / 46.2%
South Basildon & East Thurrock - 26.5% / 30.8%
Thurrock - 31.7% / 25.5%
Basildon & Billericay - 19.8% / 26.3%
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Post by Strontium Dog on Jul 12, 2024 20:16:45 GMT
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Post by Strontium Dog on Jul 12, 2024 21:55:25 GMT
Someone in the Labour Party didn't do their job. This should have been dredged up before the election. Had it been widely known that the Reform candidate was a violent woman-beating thug, I'm sure Labour would have won here.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Jul 13, 2024 8:33:36 GMT
Someone in the Labour Party didn't do their job. This should have been dredged up before the election. Had it been widely known that the Reform candidate was a violent woman-beating thug, I'm sure Labour would have won here. They'd probably be best advised to not try to make any capital out of it now and leave it till next time. Not least because a) it'll be quite jarring when they've gone and appointed a promoter of rehabilitation to the prison job, and b) there will undoubtedly turn out to be a Labour MP with a dodgy past as well. When even the FT are crawling over people's backgrounds, loads of stuff is about to turn up. |
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Clark
Forum Regular
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Post by Clark on Jul 25, 2024 14:56:53 GMT
Given the result here and in Basildon & Billericay, is it fair to assume that Reform will have carried Basildon town overall?
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birkinabe
Non-Aligned
winning here
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Post by birkinabe on Jul 25, 2024 17:23:05 GMT
Given the result here and in Basildon & Billericay, is it fair to assume that Reform will have carried Basildon town overall?
It's definitely possible that they did (and it wouldn't surprise me if that was indeed the case), but I would say probably not - the East Thurrock portion of this seat wouldn't have been much worse for Reform (if anything I think they might have done slightly better there), and their vote will likely have been more thinly spread throughout Basildon and Billericay than either the Conservative or Labour votes were.
Also, for what it's worth, all attempts at ward level estimates of the general election that I've seen have Labour winning the clear majority of wards in Basildon and Reform winning the rest.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jul 25, 2024 18:00:19 GMT
I posted some figures somewhere. Possibly the other Basildon seat, but Labour would have carried the town with Reform a fairly close second.
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Post by pepperminttea on Jul 25, 2024 21:38:28 GMT
Someone in the Labour Party didn't do their job. This should have been dredged up before the election. Had it been widely known that the Reform candidate was a violent woman-beating thug, I'm sure Labour would have won here. I guess it depends where their votes would have gone. The Tories weren't in that distant a third and it's quite possible that Reform voters would have split favourably enough that they would have won instead. |
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Post by No Offence Alan on Jul 25, 2024 21:49:40 GMT
Someone in the Labour Party didn't do their job. This should have been dredged up before the election. Had it been widely known that the Reform candidate was a violent woman-beating thug, I'm sure Labour would have won here. So you are not the kind of liberal who thinks criminals who serve their time and turn their lives around should be allowed to get on with their lives 20 years later? |
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Post by Strontium Dog on Jul 25, 2024 21:57:59 GMT
Someone in the Labour Party didn't do their job. This should have been dredged up before the election. Had it been widely known that the Reform candidate was a violent woman-beating thug, I'm sure Labour would have won here. So you are not the kind of liberal who thinks criminals who serve their time and turn their lives around should be allowed to get on with their lives 20 years later? I think that should be for his prospective employers ie the voters to decide. |
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right
Conservative
Posts: 18,761
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Post by right on Jul 26, 2024 5:47:53 GMT
Someone in the Labour Party didn't do their job. This should have been dredged up before the election. Had it been widely known that the Reform candidate was a violent woman-beating thug, I'm sure Labour would have won here. So you are not the kind of liberal who thinks criminals who serve their time and turn their lives around should be allowed to get on with their lives 20 years later? Dependant on their politics clearly |
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