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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 23, 2024 21:07:02 GMT
It possibly holds together in a sense of tension. Like a couple staying together for the sake of the kids (or in this case, Brussels).
An independent Flanders would shoot for the stars. An independent Wallonia would sink.
Both are fantastically underrated destinations.
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rcronald
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Post by rcronald on Apr 23, 2024 21:14:27 GMT
It possibly holds together in a sense of tension. Like a couple staying together for the sake of the kids (or in this case, Brussels). An independent Flanders would shoot for the stars. An independent Wallonia would sink. Both are fantastically underrated destinations. I want to see how many years it would take for Wallonia to become a far right stronghold after merging into France. |
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andrea
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Post by andrea on Apr 23, 2024 21:23:47 GMT
I am in Flanders since the beginning of March and I didn't notice there is an election campaign going on.
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Post by markgoodair on Apr 23, 2024 21:27:57 GMT
I am in Flanders since the beginning of March and I didn't notice there is an election campaign going on. I saw some PS Election posters in a restaurant in Tournai over the Easter weekend. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 23, 2024 21:40:19 GMT
It possibly holds together in a sense of tension. Like a couple staying together for the sake of the kids (or in this case, Brussels). An independent Flanders would shoot for the stars. An independent Wallonia would sink. Both are fantastically underrated destinations. I want to see how many years it would take for Wallonia to become a far right stronghold after merging into France. If it did merge. Walloons are fairly proud of being Francophone but not French, and there are differences. Lots of monolingual Francophones in Brussels consider themselves Flemish. Indeed, Jacques Brel (who could speak both) described himself as Flemish, even though his command of the language was dodgy. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 23, 2024 21:41:19 GMT
I am in Flanders since the beginning of March and I didn't notice there is an election campaign going on. I saw some PS Election posters in a restaurant in Tournai over the Easter weekend. Lots of NV-A and VB posters in Aalst last week. |
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Apr 23, 2024 22:46:22 GMT
I'm less of that opinion after visiting actually. It kind of holds together as a coherent entity though obviously there are distinct differences between the two. The language thing genuinely threw me though It is semi-coherent, the problem is that Belgium is not functioning properly as a country since the mid 2000s. There’s also a strange asymmetry where the Flemings seem to know/speak French and are generally culturally literate about Wallonia/France, but the Walloons seem to know nothing about the Flemings and generally look down on their culture despite the Flemings being better than them in most aspects… What just proves, that the Walloons are real French! Just like the similarily ignorant&arrogant Romands in SwitzerLand. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2024 22:54:35 GMT
I don't think they are. I could actually understand their french, which I can do Aquitaine, most of Occitanie, and parts of PACA but definitely cannot do in Paris. The bits I went to looked different to France, felt different to France, and seemed to "work" in a different way to France though I couldn't put my finger on anything specific. Mariembourg felt a little french but that was it.
Before going with a friend back in September I had never really thought about the place, but I fell in love with it very quickly (slight exception along the coast and Ostend). I want to go back to the places I made flying visits to and spend some proper time there
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rcronald
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Post by rcronald on Apr 24, 2024 4:34:27 GMT
I want to see how many years it would take for Wallonia to become a far right stronghold after merging into France. If it did merge. Walloons are fairly proud of being Francophone but not French, and there are differences. Lots of monolingual Francophones in Brussels consider themselves Flemish. Indeed, Jacques Brel (who could speak both) described himself as Flemish, even though his command of the language was dodgy. Is an independent Wallonia even financially viable? |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 24, 2024 6:18:17 GMT
If it did merge. Walloons are fairly proud of being Francophone but not French, and there are differences. Lots of monolingual Francophones in Brussels consider themselves Flemish. Indeed, Jacques Brel (who could speak both) described himself as Flemish, even though his command of the language was dodgy. Is an independent Wallonia even financially viable? Probably not. But it could be if they could break their addiction to spending beyond their means. It could have a lot going for it. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 24, 2024 6:33:25 GMT
I don't think they are. I could actually understand their french, which I can do Aquitaine, most of Occitanie, and parts of PACA but definitely cannot do in Paris. The bits I went to looked different to France, felt different to France, and seemed to "work" in a different way to France though I couldn't put my finger on anything specific. Mariembourg felt a little french but that was it. Before going with a friend back in September I had never really thought about the place, but I fell in love with it very quickly (slight exception along the coast and Ostend). I want to go back to the places I made flying visits to and spend some proper time there Out of interest, where on the coast did you go? Some bits are definitely not great but there are some beautiful spots, some slightly inland (but served by the Coast Tram). |
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Post by markgoodair on Apr 24, 2024 8:35:24 GMT
It is semi-coherent, the problem is that Belgium is not functioning properly as a country since the mid 2000s. There’s also a strange asymmetry where the Flemings seem to know/speak French and are generally culturally literate about Wallonia/France, but the Walloons seem to know nothing about the Flemings and generally look down on their culture despite the Flemings being better than them in most aspects… What just proves, that the Walloons are real French! Just like the similarily ignorant&arrogant Romands in SwitzerLand. There is a separate Walloon language . |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 24, 2024 9:10:37 GMT
What just proves, that the Walloons are real French! Just like the similarily ignorant&arrogant Romands in SwitzerLand. There is a separate Walloon language . Not widely spoken these days, sadly. Like Flemish in Brussels, a victim of the Francisation efforts in the decades from 1830 to 1898. But it does still rear its head. It is on street signs in Liège and Namur amongst others. And it is quite common to hear the odd Walloon phrase such as "non di dju!" (Nom de Dieu!), barakî (chav), houtsiplou (middle of nowhere) in everyday life. As well as words and grammar taken from Flemish. Belgian French is a brilliant mess. Deeply expressive, loaded with irony, full of archaic terms that don't just speak to pre-revolutionary France but also reflect the days of Burgundy. |
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Post by markgoodair on Apr 24, 2024 9:17:56 GMT
There is a separate Walloon language . Not widely spoken these days, sadly. Like Flemish in Brussels, a victim of the Francisation efforts in the decades from 1830 to 1898. But it does still rear its head. It is on street signs in Liège and Namur amongst others. And it is quite common to hear the odd Walloon phrase such as "non di dju!" (Nom de Dieu!), barakî (chav), houtsiplou (middle of nowhere) in everyday life. As well as words and grammar taken from Flemish. Belgian French is a brilliant mess. Deeply expressive, loaded with irony, full of archaic terms that don't just speak to pre-revolutionary France but also reflect the days of Burgundy. I understand Belgian French is more logical when it comes to counting numbers. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 24, 2024 10:06:38 GMT
Not widely spoken these days, sadly. Like Flemish in Brussels, a victim of the Francisation efforts in the decades from 1830 to 1898. But it does still rear its head. It is on street signs in Liège and Namur amongst others. And it is quite common to hear the odd Walloon phrase such as "non di dju!" (Nom de Dieu!), barakî (chav), houtsiplou (middle of nowhere) in everyday life. As well as words and grammar taken from Flemish. Belgian French is a brilliant mess. Deeply expressive, loaded with irony, full of archaic terms that don't just speak to pre-revolutionary France but also reflect the days of Burgundy. I understand Belgian French is more logical when it comes to counting numbers. That's correct. Septante instead of soixante-dix, and nonante instead of quatre-vingt-dix. The Swiss do the same. Some Swiss used octante or huitante instead of quatre-vingt. The Belgians also maintain the original order of meals- déjeuner, dîner, souper. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2024 10:28:19 GMT
I don't think they are. I could actually understand their french, which I can do Aquitaine, most of Occitanie, and parts of PACA but definitely cannot do in Paris. The bits I went to looked different to France, felt different to France, and seemed to "work" in a different way to France though I couldn't put my finger on anything specific. Mariembourg felt a little french but that was it. Before going with a friend back in September I had never really thought about the place, but I fell in love with it very quickly (slight exception along the coast and Ostend). I want to go back to the places I made flying visits to and spend some proper time there Out of interest, where on the coast did you go? Some bits are definitely not great but there are some beautiful spots, some slightly inland (but served by the Coast Tram). The whole length of the coast tram, with time in both termini, and Ostend. It wasn't the place so much, I found the people quite cold and unfriendly. Quite a contrast to Antwerp and Ghent and a world away from a lot of Wallonia |
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Georg Ebner
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Post by Georg Ebner on Apr 24, 2024 10:45:48 GMT
It is semi-coherent, the problem is that Belgium is not functioning properly as a country since the mid 2000s. There’s also a strange asymmetry where the Flemings seem to know/speak French and are generally culturally literate about Wallonia/France, but the Walloons seem to know nothing about the Flemings and generally look down on their culture despite the Flemings being better than them in most aspects… What just proves, that the Walloons are real French! Just like the similarily ignorant&arrogant Romands in SwitzerLand. P.scr.: Considering, what even the great French literaryCritics of the XIX - who were so unmatched on French literature - wrote on foreigners (HOMER! SHAKESPEARE!! GOETHE!!!), it is anyWay better, that the French remain within their civilized&rational kosmos and ignore us wild barbarians outside... |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 24, 2024 12:40:24 GMT
Out of interest, where on the coast did you go? Some bits are definitely not great but there are some beautiful spots, some slightly inland (but served by the Coast Tram). The whole length of the coast tram, with time in both termini, and Ostend. It wasn't the place so much, I found the people quite cold and unfriendly. Quite a contrast to Antwerp and Ghent and a world away from a lot of Wallonia That does surprise me. Knokke is definitely pretty cold but De Haan struck me as very friendly. There are definitely some very hostile spots in Wallonia! I've found the friendliest Belgians are in Limburg, Luxembourg and the two halves of Brabant. |
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carlton43
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 24, 2024 14:19:18 GMT
The whole length of the coast tram, with time in both termini, and Ostend. It wasn't the place so much, I found the people quite cold and unfriendly. Quite a contrast to Antwerp and Ghent and a world away from a lot of Wallonia That does surprise me. Knokke is definitely pretty cold but De Haan struck me as very friendly. There are definitely some very hostile spots in Wallonia! I've found the friendliest Belgians are in Limburg, Luxembourg and the two halves of Brabant. I came across a little gem entirely by accident called Saint-Hubert which is insular, upper crust and very old school (or it was when I visited?) and I liked the built environment which was classy and distinguished. I got on very well with people I encountered in hotels and on the streets. For about 10-years I detoured to spend the night there and was very spoiled by the hotel and sometimes asked to join a large party for a bit of a feast at no expense to me. Best end Belgian cuisine is superb. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 24, 2024 14:33:33 GMT
That does surprise me. Knokke is definitely pretty cold but De Haan struck me as very friendly. There are definitely some very hostile spots in Wallonia! I've found the friendliest Belgians are in Limburg, Luxembourg and the two halves of Brabant. I came across a little gem entirely by accident called Saint-Hubert which is insular, upper crust and very old school (or it was when I visited?) and I liked the built environment which was classy and distinguished. I got on very well with people I encountered in hotels and on the streets. For about 10-years I detoured to spend the night there and was very spoiled by the hotel and sometimes asked to join a large party for a bit of a feast at no expense to me. Best end Belgian cuisine is superb. Couldn't agree more. When it comes to classic European cooking, the Belgians really know what they're doing. Even down to meatballs and potato croquettes in a pub. I found Belgian wine in the supermarket the other day. Really unusual. I haven't opened it yet so no idea how bad or good it is! |
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