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Post by mercian on Feb 10, 2023 0:21:57 GMT
"Everyone needs a Willie" - M Thatcher.
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Post by johnloony on Feb 10, 2023 0:47:01 GMT
"Everyone needs a Willie" - M Thatcher. Something which Margaret Thatcher never said. (Nor did she ever say “Every Prime Minister needs a Willie” which is the usual version quoted). |
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Post by yellowperil on Feb 10, 2023 0:50:13 GMT
"Everyone needs a Willie" - M Thatcher. Do we have to bring the trans debate into everything? |
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Post by olympian95 on Feb 10, 2023 0:50:55 GMT
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Post by grahammurray on Feb 10, 2023 1:02:40 GMT
"Everyone needs a Willie" - M Thatcher. Something which Margaret Thatcher never said. (Nor did she ever say “Every Prime Minister needs a Willie” which is the usual version quoted). "Every Prime Minister needs a Willie." at the farewell dinner to Lord Whitelaw |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Feb 10, 2023 1:06:18 GMT
"Everyone needs a Willie" - M Thatcher. Something which Margaret Thatcher never said. (Nor did she ever say “Every Prime Minister needs a Willie” which is the usual version quoted). It has the ring of being a joke coined by someone else, referencing Thatcher's ignorance. But it could be genuine. It is consistently said to have been said by Thatcher at a Carlton Club dinner on 26 January 1988 to mark becoming the longest serving PM of the century (and also just after the retirement of Lord Whitelaw). It was seen in print in The Guardian, 29 January 1988, p. 24. Note that the official Margaret Thatcher website remarks: "“Every Prime Minister needs a Willie” is a quote impossible to pin down; she probably did say it, in some private setting, but when and where? There are press references as early as March 1989". But there is no note or draft of the speech at the Carlton Club dinner. |
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Post by johnloony on Feb 10, 2023 2:14:15 GMT
Something which Margaret Thatcher never said. (Nor did she ever say “Every Prime Minister needs a Willie” which is the usual version quoted). It has the ring of being a joke coined by someone else, referencing Thatcher's ignorance. But it could be genuine. It is consistently said to have been said by Thatcher at a Carlton Club dinner on 26 January 1988 to mark becoming the longest serving PM of the century (and also just after the retirement of Lord Whitelaw). It was seen in print in The Guardian, 29 January 1988, p. 24. Note that the official Margaret Thatcher website remarks: "“Every Prime Minister needs a Willie” is a quote impossible to pin down; she probably did say it, in some private setting, but when and where? There are press references as early as March 1989". But there is no note or draft of the speech at the Carlton Club dinner. ”Margaret Thatcher: The Authorised Biography” by Charles Moore, volume 3 “Herself Alone”, page 36:footnote on page 36: |
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 14,759 
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Post by J.G.Harston on Feb 10, 2023 4:59:28 GMT
That is far more a vote for the Countess of Swinton than anything at all to do with the LDs. It could even be thought of as a class vote of Upper Class over Middle Class? She stood as an Indy in May, beating the LDs into third place, so I expect there was some pragmatic recruitment by the local party. |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,729
Member is Online
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Post by Chris from Brum on Feb 10, 2023 7:38:35 GMT
The very predictable LD gain in Cheltenham You say that, but it's the one ward in Cheltenham that we'd never won before, even in the best of times for us. |
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Post by mattb on Feb 10, 2023 7:41:27 GMT
The very predictable LD gain in Cheltenham You say that, but it's the one ward in Cheltenham that we'd never won before, even in the best of times for us. LDs also running the council; and in recent weeks we have seen a number of underperformances by ruling groups of all parties. |
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Post by yellowperil on Feb 10, 2023 7:55:14 GMT
That is far more a vote for the Countess of Swinton than anything at all to do with the LDs. It could even be thought of as a class vote of Upper Class over Middle Class? She stood as an Indy in May, beating the LDs into third place, so I expect there was some pragmatic recruitment by the local party. Indeed, the result is pretty close to last May's if you add the Indy vote to the Lib Dem one, and allow for a bit more Tory slide. So @carlton is a bit wrong when he says "far more a vote", etc, it's rather closer to 50/50 than that suggests. On the Upper Class thing ("he looks down on him", etc) I seem to remember it was always thus in the more feudal bits of Yorkshire- I remember spending some time campaigning in those parts in the earliest days of the Lib Dems (even before they were so called) and being surprised at the support and influence of the great aristocratic (Whiggish?) families. Nor is this confined to Yorkshire- I'm remembering a famous victory in the more feudal parts of Kent where it pays to have the local aristocracy as the Lib Dem candidate- I am thinking Penshurst and Chiddingstone. Of course the added piquancy in the Masham case is the family connection to old style Toryism rather than Whiggery, what one might term Whitelawry. It might well be that that sort of old style Toryism which despises the spivvery of present day so-called Conservatism might find more in common with Liberal Democracy. |
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Post by matureleft on Feb 10, 2023 8:10:30 GMT
Well that's a nasty shock. Though this being West Merseyside North Wales probably has very little to do with actual party politics as that seems to be virtually irrelevant to local elections there The vacancy came from the death of a very long-serving, presumably popular, Labour member. The Tory had been a councillor for the ward. Not sure where the Labour candidate came from within Rhyl. A wider range of choices than in the main election. But certainly a resilient Tory vote (which was what was required) in times where getting their vote out must be hard. |
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Post by batman on Feb 10, 2023 8:19:19 GMT
When you get a pretty counter-intuitive result like the one from Rhyl, which none of us predicted, my first thought tends to be, were there local factors? The local council has recently passed into Labour control and I wonder if it has taken some decisions which are quite unpopular locally. The intervention of Plaid & the Independent seems also to have hit Labour disproportionately although one would normally expect Plaid to take more votes from Labour than the Conservatives. It's obviously a very welcome & good result for the Tories but it does stick out like a sore thumb and it doesn't mean that they are in a good position nationally by any means. Perhaps also Labour didn't fight a good campaign & the Tories did to a greater extent.
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iang
Lib Dem
Posts: 1,813
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Post by iang on Feb 10, 2023 8:23:30 GMT
Maybe complacency? Given the national polls etc, Tories can't possibly win, so no need to really exert ourselves in the campaign - and the Tories are able to sneak up on the blind side? Pure speculation, but it is very different to what was happening elsewhere
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ColinJ
Labour
Living in the Past
Posts: 2,126
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Post by ColinJ on Feb 10, 2023 8:27:31 GMT
That looks like a very good Labour performance. I was concerned there were some problems for us in the division, as I had received numerous email appeals for help. I hope someone will calculate the % shares and swing ...... |
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ColinJ
Labour
Living in the Past
Posts: 2,126
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Post by ColinJ on Feb 10, 2023 8:31:06 GMT
Maybe complacency? Given the national polls etc, Tories can't possibly win, so no need to really exert ourselves in the campaign - and the Tories are able to sneak up on the blind side? Pure speculation, but it is very different to what was happening elsewhere Quite possibly. The 'binary' choice before electors at the previous election and its result made the ward look safe-ish for Labour. Yesterday's result confirmed otherwise. |
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Tony Otim
Green
Suffering from Brexistential Despair
Posts: 11,892
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Post by Tony Otim on Feb 10, 2023 9:17:29 GMT
When you get a pretty counter-intuitive result like the one from Rhyl, which none of us predicted, my first thought tends to be, were there local factors? The local council has recently passed into Labour control and I wonder if it has taken some decisions which are quite unpopular locally. The intervention of Plaid & the Independent seems also to have hit Labour disproportionately although one would normally expect Plaid to take more votes from Labour than the Conservatives. It's obviously a very welcome & good result for the Tories but it does stick out like a sore thumb and it doesn't mean that they are in a good position nationally by any means. Perhaps also Labour didn't fight a good campaign & the Tories did to a greater extent. The Conservative candidate and wider range of candidates were probably factors, but looking at the figures - even if one were to assume (highly unlikely) that the vast majority of Plaid and Indy voters voted Labour in May, there's still a bare minimum (in reality probably considerably more) of over 100 voters who voted Labour in May and didn't vote at all this time, which perhaps suggests some combination of complacency/poor campaign and/or dissatisfaction with Labour running the council? |
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Post by rockefeller on Feb 10, 2023 10:11:49 GMT
😂
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Post by london(ex)tory on Feb 10, 2023 10:37:46 GMT
The winner in Cheltenham is one for the good looking councillors thread:
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 10, 2023 10:59:16 GMT
That looks like a very good Labour performance. I was concerned there were some problems for us in the division, as I had received numerous email appeals for help. I hope someone will calculate the % shares and swing ...... Double figure swing to Labour since 2021. Also a strongish Green performance (up a few points since then) which may have had Labour guarding against complacency. |
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