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Post by aargauer on Feb 3, 2023 17:44:17 GMT
So basically everything is compliant at present - although there will certainly be mission creep.
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ColinJ
Labour
Living in the Past
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Post by ColinJ on Feb 3, 2023 17:57:39 GMT
Harrow Council challenging ULEZ expansion in court I wonder if Susan Hall, leader of the Tories on the GLA, is influencing this? She is also a Harrow councillor and a former leader of their group. It's a lot of council taxpayers money to put on the line!
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ColinJ
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Post by ColinJ on Feb 3, 2023 18:03:25 GMT
Well look on the brightside - if the ULEZ zone does get increased you can still drive your Bentley or Range Rover without paying the charge.. Save the planet.....er...hmm... I didn't know the ULEZ was claimed to be saving the planet! Ostensibly it's about improving the health of Londoners by penalizing the drivers of the worst polluting vehicles.
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Post by aargauer on Feb 3, 2023 18:06:55 GMT
Well look on the brightside - if the ULEZ zone does get increased you can still drive your Bentley or Range Rover without paying the charge.. Save the planet.....er...hmm... I didn't know the ULEZ was claimed to be saving the planet! Ostensibly it's about improving the health of Londoners by penalizing the drivers of the worst polluting vehicles. I guess the damage to air quality isn't necessarily proportional to mpg. Certainly as an asthmatic I don't think others should have the right to stop me from breathing properly.
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Post by Arthur Figgis on Feb 3, 2023 22:45:37 GMT
I didn't know the ULEZ was claimed to be saving the planet! Ostensibly it's about improving the health of Londoners by penalizing the drivers of the worst polluting vehicles. I guess the damage to air quality isn't necessarily proportional to mpg. Certainly as an asthmatic I don't think others should have the right to stop me from breathing properly. Handily. I have a new beast that eats fuel (average high 20s mpg) but is fully compliant. In all seriousness, as what used to be called a libertarian before the term got taken over by wankers, I have no problem with paying for the externalities of my behaviour- in fact I welcome it. I also fully recommend a Golf R to anyone listening, particularly the 20th anniversary edition.
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Feb 4, 2023 9:09:04 GMT
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Post by aargauer on Feb 4, 2023 9:43:53 GMT
If the Tory party weren't in such a bad place nationally this one would be for the taking. Khan is not popular.
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batman
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Post by batman on Feb 4, 2023 10:18:07 GMT
not just nationally though, they are in a generally weak position in London specifically. Things might be different if Labour were in power by the time of the Mayoral election, but that's unlikely - for the Tories to win the Mayoralty, they probably need both an unpopular mayor AND Labour to have been in power nationally for a reasonable time. I agree that Khan is not very popular, especially in outer London boroughs where many voters are angry about the ULEZ extension. Turning that into a Conservative victory, however, will be very difficult, though not totally impossible.
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The Bishop
Labour
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 4, 2023 11:48:38 GMT
And maybe we shouldn't use the 2021 result as totally definitive - Labour's vote was depressed by both the pandemic and an almost universal belief it was a done deal.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Feb 4, 2023 11:58:55 GMT
not just nationally though, they are in a generally weak position in London specifically. Things might be different if Labour were in power by the time of the Mayoral election, but that's unlikely - for the Tories to win the Mayoralty, they probably need both an unpopular mayor AND Labour to have been in power nationally for a reasonable time. I agree that Khan is not very popular, especially in outer London boroughs where many voters are angry about the ULEZ extension. Turning that into a Conservative victory, however, will be very difficult, though not totally impossible. The ULEZ thing just seems so avoidable. Thinking of the areas of London where I spent most of my time when I visit (out past Petts Wood and Orpington), it just doesn't seem necessary to be set that far out unless it is purely for administrative convenience. Is it really necessary to have such a zone include places like Chelsfield or Biggin Hill? It could be confined to the contiguous urban area, surely. Which would probably find more widespread support.
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neilm
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Post by neilm on Feb 4, 2023 12:16:47 GMT
not just nationally though, they are in a generally weak position in London specifically. Things might be different if Labour were in power by the time of the Mayoral election, but that's unlikely - for the Tories to win the Mayoralty, they probably need both an unpopular mayor AND Labour to have been in power nationally for a reasonable time. I agree that Khan is not very popular, especially in outer London boroughs where many voters are angry about the ULEZ extension. Turning that into a Conservative victory, however, will be very difficult, though not totally impossible. The lack of second preferences may hurt them as well: there is no option to get the extra votes that won't go to a transfer unfriendly Khan.
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Feb 6, 2023 9:29:37 GMT
not just nationally though, they are in a generally weak position in London specifically. Things might be different if Labour were in power by the time of the Mayoral election, but that's unlikely - for the Tories to win the Mayoralty, they probably need both an unpopular mayor AND Labour to have been in power nationally for a reasonable time. I agree that Khan is not very popular, especially in outer London boroughs where many voters are angry about the ULEZ extension. Turning that into a Conservative victory, however, will be very difficult, though not totally impossible. The ULEZ thing just seems so avoidable. Thinking of the areas of London where I spent most of my time when I visit (out past Petts Wood and Orpington), it just doesn't seem necessary to be set that far out unless it is purely for administrative convenience. Is it really necessary to have such a zone include places like Chelsfield or Biggin Hill? It could be confined to the contiguous urban area, surely. Which would probably find more widespread support. The bits of London that aren't part of the contiguous urban area are a very small percentage of London. I've no doubt opposition is more widespread there, but most of the opposition from within London is coming from the contiguous urban area (and many of the objections are coming from people outside Greater London anyway.)
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batman
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Post by batman on Feb 6, 2023 9:45:04 GMT
yes I'd agree with that, in places like Hillingdon or West Drayton (although it's right on the edge of the built-up area) which are contiguous there is plenty of opposition.
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myth11
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Post by myth11 on Feb 6, 2023 10:53:32 GMT
not just nationally though, they are in a generally weak position in London specifically. Things might be different if Labour were in power by the time of the Mayoral election, but that's unlikely - for the Tories to win the Mayoralty, they probably need both an unpopular mayor AND Labour to have been in power nationally for a reasonable time. I agree that Khan is not very popular, especially in outer London boroughs where many voters are angry about the ULEZ extension. Turning that into a Conservative victory, however, will be very difficult, though not totally impossible. The ULEZ thing just seems so avoidable. Thinking of the areas of London where I spent most of my time when I visit (out past Petts Wood and Orpington), it just doesn't seem necessary to be set that far out unless it is purely for administrative convenience. Is it really necessary to have such a zone include places like Chelsfield or Biggin Hill? It could be confined to the contiguous urban area, surely. Which would probably find more widespread support. The Problem with ULEZ is that the income is needed to help fund London transport and that income will decline as car fleet becomes younger in part due to the charge which leave three choices. 1.Go deeper like the congestion charge which will start charging electric cars from 2025. 2.Go wider which is the option he picked but will only work for a couple of years. 3.Come up with a complex system such as charge by mile and emissions.
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Post by timrollpickering on Feb 6, 2023 13:40:48 GMT
There is a Parliament petition calling for a referendum to abolish the Mayor and Assembly, citing Ulez and demanding the franchise "for all voters who live inside the M25" (which is very unfair on North Ockenden and falls into the lazy "London is everything within the M25" which even the media haven't gone in for with the tragic news from Epsom). It is notable there's a high number of signatures from constituencies immediately outside Greater London, many have more signing than in inner London, but the largest numbers generally come from outer London constituencies that don't have Labour MPs. petition.parliament.uk/petitions/631763petitionmap.unboxedconsulting.com/?petition=631763
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myth11
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Post by myth11 on Feb 9, 2023 11:31:55 GMT
There is a Parliament petition calling for a referendum to abolish the Mayor and Assembly, citing Ulez and demanding the franchise "for all voters who live inside the M25" (which is very unfair on North Ockenden and falls into the lazy "London is everything within the M25" which even the media haven't gone in for with the tragic news from Epsom). It is notable there's a high number of signatures from constituencies immediately outside Greater London, many have more signing than in inner London, but the largest numbers generally come from outer London constituencies that don't have Labour MPs. petition.parliament.uk/petitions/631763petitionmap.unboxedconsulting.com/?petition=631763I guessing those signatures in places like Scotland are from those who have been fined on a visit as happen to a friend of mine despite my warning.
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Post by uthacalthing on Feb 9, 2023 11:57:18 GMT
Is there any possibility that a rival to Khan might emerge from Labour or is it a job for life or you lose?
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batman
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Post by batman on Feb 9, 2023 12:08:42 GMT
None whatsoever, as Khan has already been reselected with very little opposition. 2028 will be a different matter. Unless you mean a Corbyn-supporting independent. That's possible but it wouldn't be much of a worry for Labour.
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Post by greatkingrat on Feb 9, 2023 12:12:05 GMT
There is a Parliament petition calling for a referendum to abolish the Mayor and Assembly, citing Ulez and demanding the franchise "for all voters who live inside the M25" (which is very unfair on North Ockenden and falls into the lazy "London is everything within the M25" which even the media haven't gone in for with the tragic news from Epsom). It is notable there's a high number of signatures from constituencies immediately outside Greater London, many have more signing than in inner London, but the largest numbers generally come from outer London constituencies that don't have Labour MPs. petition.parliament.uk/petitions/631763petitionmap.unboxedconsulting.com/?petition=631763I guessing those signatures in places like Scotland are from those who have been fined on a visit as happen to a friend of mine despite my warning. Or just the sort of people who spend their lives signing petitions, regardless of whether the issue concerned actually affects them.
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Post by andrewp on Feb 10, 2023 12:34:11 GMT
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