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Post by evergreenadam on Jun 8, 2021 10:57:17 GMT
Initially I did this but I had an excess of voters further West (Ealing/Hillingdon) and needed to increase the electorate of the Willesden seat which was best achieved by adding Cricklewood (moving the Harrow ward of Edgware into the Hendon seat followed from that). No doubt a better plan in that whole area could be achieved by splitting a ward - Ideally I'd like to split Welsh Harp as it annoys me as is and actually that could solve the very problem I've identified here You can keep 5 seats for Barnet-Camden and 7 for Hackney-Haringey-Enfield but I think you do need to give Islington the City to avoid excess electorate somewhere else. This was my initial plan which I have posted before but I will have another look when I get some spare time. I'm pretty happy with the Middlesex area (I would have posted a more zoomed in image of the area but Imgur seems not to be working today). I agree with and endorse the Commission's plans for Ealing/Hammersmith & Chiswick but differ substantially elsewhere. The split of Heston is a notably bad suggestion as it's totally unnecessary. I certainly like your Hounslow and Feltham seat. The orphan LBRuT Heathfield is part of the Hanworth Road corridor so fits in nicely. Hounslow West and Heston are strongly linked so that makes sense.
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Post by islington on Jun 8, 2021 11:06:19 GMT
This is all as posted before, but here's what I'd suggest in north London.
This keeps the 'Cities' arrangement, it avoids splitting Wood Green and it keeps the boundary between Edmonton and Tottenham in the right place (a very positive feature of the BCE plan and one we should retain). Barnet is intact except for one ward. In Brent, an area that I know is close to the heart of Pete Whitehead , it's not perfect but it produces viable Wembley and Willesden seats (and I'd call them that, not 'Brent' names). Farther west I'd go along with the plan Pete posted earlier today. I agree that the placement of Heston E ward isn't great but it's not the sort of thing I'd feel strongly enough to make representations about, especially since the alternative arrangement ('Brentford & Heston' and 'Hounslow & Feltham') isn't ideal either.
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iain
Lib Dem
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Post by iain on Jun 8, 2021 11:43:04 GMT
Those Hackney wards are completely isolated from the rest of that Hornsey seat. Also not sure why you'd remove Alexandra (I know it's technically Wood Green, but that is irrelevant on the ground)
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Adrian
Co-operative Party
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Post by Adrian on Jun 8, 2021 12:32:51 GMT
They're the prime example of the "Lee" numpties.
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Post by islington on Jun 8, 2021 12:56:15 GMT
(1) Those Hackney wards are completely isolated from the rest of that Hornsey seat. Also (2) not sure why you'd remove Alexandra (I know it's technically Wood Green, but that is irrelevant on the ground) - I disagree. There are decent links along Blackstock Road and Green Lanes. Much of this area was historically part of the parish of Hornsey, and the seat as proposed bears a marked resemblance to the original Hornsey seat when it was first created back in 1885. If you're going to hive wards off the northern side of Hackney, which seems inevitable, these are definitely the best ones.
- Because of numbers - as simple as that. The ward is a better fit with Hornsey but it's not all that bad a fit with Wood Green.
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Post by pepperminttea on Jun 8, 2021 14:16:44 GMT
You can keep 5 seats for Barnet-Camden and 7 for Hackney-Haringey-Enfield but I think you do need to give Islington the City to avoid excess electorate somewhere else. This was my initial plan which I have posted before but I will have another look when I get some spare time. I'm pretty happy with the Middlesex area (I would have posted a more zoomed in image of the area but Imgur seems not to be working today). I agree with and endorse the Commission's plans for Ealing/Hammersmith & Chiswick but differ substantially elsewhere. The split of Heston is a notably bad suggestion as it's totally unnecessary. I've been playing around more and was arriving at something quite similar. I don't care for your Central Brent seat much but it isn't a lot worse than what's already there and there has to be compromises somewhere and the rest is pretty good. Agreed, although I've called it Willesden instead of continuing the awful 'Brent Central' name. If the seat goes too far north for 'Willesden' to be appropriate perhaps Neasden would be better?
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Post by islington on Jun 8, 2021 15:46:26 GMT
According to the BCE Report, their scheme involves three split wards and 31 seats that cross borough boundaries.
Yet I had a plan that required no ward splits at all and included only 28 cross-boundary seats.
And several of those boundary-crossings were to accommodate unhelpful wards in Lambeth and Wandsworth. If you allow yourself a single split ward in Wandsworth, you can treat both Wandsworth and Lambeth separately and bring the number of cross-boundary seats down to 24.
I'm not yet sure exactly what I'm going to suggest in my submission, but I'm definitely going to try to cut down of the boundary crossings.
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Post by minionofmidas on Jun 8, 2021 15:52:48 GMT
Pete Whitehead was talking about not having been able to find a 5-seat solution for Tower Hamlets and Newham. I think I have one. Splits Bromley North from Bromley South, but otherwise I'm happy enough with it. Bethnal Green 77000 Polar & Limehouse 75814 Stratford & Bow 73574 Canning Town 70865 East Ham 70902 The snag is that I'm struggling to get 9 seats out of the remaining East London boroughs, so I'm hoping the new wards in Havering will bail me out there. this is the commission's plan except that they switch Green Street W for "West Ham" (a Central missing from the ward name?) but the more I look at that northern crossing the less I like it. There's a huge gap in the middle and the split through West Ham appears really, really random. Crossing in the south at least has past precedent. The best solution is probably or possibly Another non-split East: East Ham 70902 Yes 11 West Ham 70841 Yes 12 London Docklands 75806 Yes 13 Stepney 75958 Yes 14 Bethnal Green and Bow 74648 Yes (Pete Whitehead suggested it earlier, as an alternative to what his map showed. Also, names need work. Poplar & Canning Town certainly; probably Stepney & Bromley) but playing around with the report and calc offline I came up with another version i didn't find in this thread afterwards (i used the search function, I didn't look through every page) - compared to the above you can exchange Whitechapel, Spitalfields and Weavers for the Bromleys and Lansbury, giving you Stepney and a Bethnal Green & Bow that's mostly Bow. Problem areas are: Lansbury is really Poplar and should be in that seat (this is why I'm commending pepperminttea's version), Weavers is really Bethnal Green and should be in that seat, parts of the Canning Town wards are really not Canning Town and should be in the West Ham seat. It turns out that you can fix all three objections (splitting Canning Town N; indeed you need to for this version) ... by also splitting the Isle of Dogs, moving the western ward into Stepney. Don't think I'll recommend that to the Commission.
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Post by Wisconsin on Jun 8, 2021 17:25:19 GMT
"West Ham" (a Central missing from the ward name?) I made this point to the LGBCE this repeatedly. Stubbornly refused to engage. Instead they introduced a brand new “East Ham” ward too.
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Post by evergreenadam on Jun 8, 2021 17:27:57 GMT
"West Ham" (a Central missing from the ward name?) I made this point to the LGBCE this repeatedly. Stubbornly refused to engage. There’s an “East Ham” ward too. The local authority can change the ward name itself if it wanted to, there is a procedure for doing that.
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Post by Wisconsin on Jun 8, 2021 17:31:54 GMT
I’m a local resident and I really like the idea of Stratford and Bow. Crossing the Lea to the North is almost unnoticeable these days, and I like that the new and similar (Olympic) communities in Stratford & New Town and Bow East are together.
Having the park in the middle seems harmless enough to me - it’s more of a common focus than a division.
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Post by Wisconsin on Jun 8, 2021 17:33:08 GMT
The local authority can change the ward name itself if it wanted to, there is a procedure for doing that. Not without local consultation, and not before 2026 without the LGBCE’s permission.
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Post by minionofmidas on Jun 8, 2021 17:38:12 GMT
I’m a local resident and I really like the idea of Stratford and Bow. Crossing the Lea to the North is almost unnoticeable these days, and I like that the new and similar (Olympic) communities in Stratford & New Town and Bow East are together. Having the park in the middle seems harmless enough to me - it’s more of a common focus than a division. Is West Ham or Green Street the better ward to include and what should be the name of the remnant West Ham seat in your opinion? (Also, what does local mean here - will Forest Gate like the plan?)
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johnloony
Conservative
Posts: 21,853
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Post by johnloony on Jun 8, 2021 18:09:53 GMT
I am pleasantly surprised by the BC's decision to grasp the nettle by the horns and split a few wards in order to avoid contrafibularitous combinations of wards which would otherwise be required in some places (unlike the stubborn decision of the Commission not to do so in the previous abortive review). I cautiously support the mostly sensible proposals for Croydon. I am concerned that there will probably be changes due to unpopular proposals in other parts of London, and concerned that knock-on effects might undo the good proposals for Croydon.
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Post by minionofmidas on Jun 8, 2021 18:13:09 GMT
I am pleasantly surprised by the BC's decision to grasp the nettle by the horns and split a few wards in order to avoid contrafibularitous combinations of wards which would otherwise be required in some places (unlike the stubborn decision of the Commission not to do so in the previous abortive review). I cautiously support the mostly sensible proposals for Croydon. I am concerned that there will probably be changes due to unpopular proposals in other parts of London, and concerned that knock-on effects might undo the good proposals for Croydon. potentially they could be convinced to nix the Merton salient in exchange for a split ward or two, but otherwise i don't see how Croydon (and Lambeth, and Southwark, and Lewisham) is threatened by proposals elsewhere.
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Post by Wisconsin on Jun 8, 2021 19:13:20 GMT
I’m a local resident and I really like the idea of Stratford and Bow. Crossing the Lea to the North is almost unnoticeable these days, and I like that the new and similar (Olympic) communities in Stratford & New Town and Bow East are together. Having the park in the middle seems harmless enough to me - it’s more of a common focus than a division. Is West Ham or Green Street the better ward to include and what should be the name of the remnant West Ham seat in your opinion? (Also, what does local mean here - will Forest Gate like the plan?) There are some people in Green Street West that like to think there are in Forest Gate. Kicked up a lot of fuss in the recent LGBCE. I guess this suits them better. I don’t think Forest Gate has much attachment to the rest of Newham - probably okay with it. I’m not sure West Ham (Central) would mind either way.
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Post by John Chanin on Jun 8, 2021 19:55:36 GMT
Is West Ham or Green Street the better ward to include and what should be the name of the remnant West Ham seat in your opinion? (Also, what does local mean here - will Forest Gate like the plan?) There are some people in Green Street West that like to think there are in Forest Gate. Kicked up a lot of fuss in the recent LGBCE. I guess this suits them better. You might be amused to read the comments on the Almanac entry for West Ham.
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Post by Wisconsin on Jun 8, 2021 21:08:54 GMT
There are some people in Green Street West that like to think there are in Forest Gate. Kicked up a lot of fuss in the recent LGBCE. I guess this suits them better. You might be amused to read the comments on the Almanac entry for West Ham. I was a bit harsh. I don’t really have strong feelings about how far south Forest Gate goes. The McDonalds on Romford Road feels Forest Gate-y.
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Post by Disgusted Of Tunbridge Wells on Jun 12, 2021 21:38:52 GMT
You might be amused to read the comments on the Almanac entry for West Ham. I was a bit harsh. I don’t really have strong feelings about how far south Forest Gate goes. The McDonalds on Romford Road feels Forest Gate-y. I would say south of the Romford Road is essentially Plaistow/ Upton Park, different more inner - Londony feel to the Green St area.
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Post by John Chanin on Jun 13, 2021 7:51:12 GMT
There are some people in Green Street West that like to think there are in Forest Gate. Kicked up a lot of fuss in the recent LGBCE. I guess this suits them better. You might be amused to read the comments on the Almanac entry for West Ham. Actually in best VoteUK style the little spat about Forest Gate and Green Street was on the East Ham entry.
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