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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 0:13:05 GMT
Looks OK in East and South London but Middlesex is a mess
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Post by kevinlarkin on Jun 8, 2021 0:37:27 GMT
Eltham & Chislehurst is not something anyone would have predicted. I am not saying it is a bad idea but I think it could be improved upon. By the removal of Chislehurst.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 1:14:48 GMT
The London proposals split 3 wards - Waddon (Croydon), Fairfield (Wandsworth) and Emerson Park (Havering) It's Hylands that's been split in Havering, which seems rather unnecessary - there were perfectly good and quite similar plans in that area which didn't involve a ward split. Still if they're happy to propose ward splits willy-nilly then it should be possible to use that to tidy up the abject mess they've made of Barnet etc
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Adrian
Co-operative Party
Posts: 1,726
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Post by Adrian on Jun 8, 2021 1:16:00 GMT
From the London summary page: In order to create 75 constituencies wholly within London, we have proposed one constituency (Stratford and Bow) that crosses the River Lee." The River what?!
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 1:26:23 GMT
From the London summary page: In order to create 75 constituencies wholly within London, we have proposed one constituency (Stratford and Bow) that crosses the River Lee." The River what?! Perfectly acceptable to spell it that way
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Post by mattb on Jun 8, 2021 4:57:18 GMT
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Post by John Chanin on Jun 8, 2021 7:01:08 GMT
Perfectly acceptable to spell it that way As a (former) local this is fraught. It is always spelled “Lea” in east London. It is spelled “Lee” in Hertfordshire, and the middle-class Conservative imposition of the “ Lee valley country park” caused widespread annoyance in east London. This is class warfare…. However sensibly the BCE isn’t actually proposing to use it in a constituency name. Obviously I haven’t had time to look at any details yet but clearly the ward splits in Croydon and Wandsworth are sensible, even if the one in Havering isn’t.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 7:15:47 GMT
Perfectly acceptable to spell it that way As a (former) local this is fraught. It is always spelled “Lea” in east London. It is spelled “Lee” in Hertfordshire, and the middle-class Conservative imposition of the “ Lee valley country park” caused widespread annoyance in east London. This is class warfare…. However sensibly the BCE isn’t actually proposing to use it in a constituency name. Obviously I haven’t had time to look at any details yet but clearly the ward splits in Croydon and Wandsworth are sensible, even if the one in Havering isn’t. Interestingly the wiki article almost seems to suggest the opposite: "The spelling Lea predominates west (upstream) of Hertford, but both spellings (Lea and Lee) are used from Hertford to the River Thames" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_LeaPersonally I have always used the 'Lea' spelling and that is surely the most common but I wouldn't 'correct' someone for using the other form
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Post by islington on Jun 8, 2021 7:43:51 GMT
As a (former) local this is fraught. It is always spelled “Lea” in east London. It is spelled “Lee” in Hertfordshire, and the middle-class Conservative imposition of the “ Lee valley country park” caused widespread annoyance in east London. This is class warfare…. However sensibly the BCE isn’t actually proposing to use it in a constituency name. Obviously I haven’t had time to look at any details yet but clearly the ward splits in Croydon and Wandsworth are sensible, even if the one in Havering isn’t. Interestingly the wiki article almost seems to suggest the opposite: "The spelling Lea predominates west (upstream) of Hertford, but both spellings (Lea and Lee) are used from Hertford to the River Thames" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_LeaPersonally I have always used the 'Lea' spelling and that is surely the most common but I wouldn't 'correct' someone for using the other form Agreed. I grew up in Waltham Abbey and Cheshunt and 'Lea' was the usual spelling but 'Lee' a familar variant.
In some contexts it is invariable: 'Lea Bridge' (an area between Walthamstow and Leyton) is always so spelt, and likewise the 'Lee Navigation Canal' and 'Lee Valley Park'.
Obviously this is by far the most important issue we have to discuss today.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 8:36:36 GMT
Interestingly the wiki article almost seems to suggest the opposite: "The spelling Lea predominates west (upstream) of Hertford, but both spellings (Lea and Lee) are used from Hertford to the River Thames" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_LeaPersonally I have always used the 'Lea' spelling and that is surely the most common but I wouldn't 'correct' someone for using the other form Agreed. I grew up in Waltham Abbey and Cheshunt and 'Lea' was the usual spelling but 'Lee' a familar variant. In some contexts it is invariable: 'Lea Bridge' (an area between Walthamstow and Leyton) is always so spelt, and likewise the 'Lee Navigation Canal' and 'Lee Valley Park'. Obviously this is by far the most important issue we have to discuss today.
Don't worry I'm working on counter proposals as we speak. I'm happy to accept the proposals South of the river in their entirety and most of those East of the Lea (I'd do different in Havering to avoid the unnecessary ward-split there). The situation in Barnet, Brent, Camden etc is appalling though - undoubtedly the worst proposals I have seen anywhere
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 8:41:43 GMT
This is what I've got so far. Much of it already seen of course
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Post by evergreenadam on Jun 8, 2021 8:49:54 GMT
This is what I've got so far. Much of it already seen of course Is it worth chucking Avonmore and Brook Green out of Hammersmith and Chiswick and into a Fulham seat? These are core Hammersmith wards. The compensatory addition of College Park & Old Oak and Wormholt to Hammersmith and Chiswick is not such a big advantage. Both of those wards contain the Old Oak and Wormholt estates which are part of the East Acton community, currently split between Ealing and H&F and which would be united in Ealing Central and Acton.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 8:55:05 GMT
This is what I've got so far. Much of it already seen of course Is it worth chucking Avonmore and Brook Green out of Hammersmith and Chiswick and into a Fulham seat? These are core Hammersmith wards. The compensatory addition of College Park & Old Oak and Wormholt to Hammersmith and Chiswick is not such a big advantage. Both of those wards contain the Old Oak and Wormholt estates which are part of the East Acton community, currently split between Ealing and H&F and which would be united in Ealing Central and Acton. I take your point about that but it is the boundaries to the East of there that I am trying to resolve. Also Avonmore was historically always in Fulham
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Post by islington on Jun 8, 2021 8:56:43 GMT
Nice plan.
But if you're treating Childs Hill with Camden (which I agree with) the rest of Barnet can get three seats with no need for further boundary-crossings. And you've put a boundary through the middle of Wood Green. I'd suggest combining the whole of Wood Green with the Southgate area and this means that the boundary between Edmonton and Tottenham can be respected.
I'll post something later.
Nevertheless, a great improvement on the BCE plan in this area.
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Post by evergreenadam on Jun 8, 2021 9:02:45 GMT
Is it worth chucking Avonmore and Brook Green out of Hammersmith and Chiswick and into a Fulham seat? These are core Hammersmith wards. The compensatory addition of College Park & Old Oak and Wormholt to Hammersmith and Chiswick is not such a big advantage. Both of those wards contain the Old Oak and Wormholt estates which are part of the East Acton community, currently split between Ealing and H&F and which would be united in Ealing Central and Acton. I take your point about that but it is the boundaries to the East of there that I am trying to resolve. Also Avonmore was historically always in Fulham True RE Avonmore but not many residents there think of themselves as being part of Fulham since the demise of Fulham Met Borough. The construction of the A4 has also created such a big severance effect. The BCE plan for Ealing is also neater, I know Walpole should ideally be in Ealing Central, but keeping Hobbayne and Cleveland together in Ealing North is much neater. I don’t like the idea of three different seats north of the GW Main Line, Hobbayne being in Southall, Cleveland in North and Ealing Broadway in Central.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 9:04:14 GMT
Nice plan. But if you're treating Childs Hill with Camden (which I agree with) the rest of Barnet can get three seats with no need for further boundary-crossings. And you've put a boundary through the middle of Wood Green. I'd suggest combining the whole of Wood Green with the Southgate area and this means that the boundary between Edmonton and Tottenham can be respected. I'll post something later. Nevertheless, a great improvement on the BCE plan in this area. Initially I did this but I had an excess of voters further West (Ealing/Hillingdon) and needed to increase the electorate of the Willesden seat which was best achieved by adding Cricklewood (moving the Harrow ward of Edgware into the Hendon seat followed from that). No doubt a better plan in that whole area could be achieved by splitting a ward - Ideally I'd like to split Welsh Harp as it annoys me as is and actually that could solve the very problem I've identified here
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Post by evergreenadam on Jun 8, 2021 9:08:39 GMT
It’s at this point we could be taking nominations for daftest ward in London following the recent LGBCE round of ward boundary reviews.
Heston East was always a stringy, left over ward with bits of Heston, Lampton and Spring Grove. Not surprisingly it has been transferred from Feltham & Heston and Brentford & Isleworth to make up the numbers.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 9:16:01 GMT
It’s at this point we could be taking nominations for daftest ward in London following the recent LGBCE round of ward boundary reviews. Heston East was always a stringy, left over ward with bits of Heston, Lampton and Spring Grove. Not surprisingly it has been transferred from Feltham & Heston and Brentford & Isleworth to make up the numbers. You can take my previous post as a nomination
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Post by pepperminttea on Jun 8, 2021 10:26:41 GMT
Nice plan. But if you're treating Childs Hill with Camden (which I agree with) the rest of Barnet can get three seats with no need for further boundary-crossings. And you've put a boundary through the middle of Wood Green. I'd suggest combining the whole of Wood Green with the Southgate area and this means that the boundary between Edmonton and Tottenham can be respected. I'll post something later. Nevertheless, a great improvement on the BCE plan in this area. Initially I did this but I had an excess of voters further West (Ealing/Hillingdon) and needed to increase the electorate of the Willesden seat which was best achieved by adding Cricklewood (moving the Harrow ward of Edgware into the Hendon seat followed from that). No doubt a better plan in that whole area could be achieved by splitting a ward - Ideally I'd like to split Welsh Harp as it annoys me as is and actually that could solve the very problem I've identified here You can keep 5 seats for Barnet-Camden and 7 for Hackney-Haringey-Enfield but I think you do need to give Islington the City to avoid excess electorate somewhere else. This was my initial plan which I have posted before but I will have another look when I get some spare time. I'm pretty happy with the Middlesex area (I would have posted a more zoomed in image of the area but Imgur seems not to be working today). I agree with and endorse the Commission's plans for Ealing/Hammersmith & Chiswick but differ substantially elsewhere. The split of Heston is a notably bad suggestion as it's totally unnecessary.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jun 8, 2021 10:30:56 GMT
Initially I did this but I had an excess of voters further West (Ealing/Hillingdon) and needed to increase the electorate of the Willesden seat which was best achieved by adding Cricklewood (moving the Harrow ward of Edgware into the Hendon seat followed from that). No doubt a better plan in that whole area could be achieved by splitting a ward - Ideally I'd like to split Welsh Harp as it annoys me as is and actually that could solve the very problem I've identified here You can keep 5 seats for Barnet-Camden and 7 for Hackney-Haringey-Enfield but I think you do need to give Islington the City to avoid excess electorate somewhere else. This was my initial plan which I have posted before but I will have another look when I get some spare time. I'm pretty happy with the Middlesex area (I would have posted a more zoomed in image of the area but Imgur seems not to be working today). I agree with and endorse the Commission's plans for Ealing/Hammersmith & Chiswick but differ substantially elsewhere. The split of Heston is a notably bad suggestion as it's totally unnecessary. I've been playing around more and was arriving at something quite similar. I don't care for your Central Brent seat much but it isn't a lot worse than what's already there and there has to be compromises somewhere and the rest is pretty good.
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