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Post by bungle on Apr 9, 2020 13:01:24 GMT
What an excellent idea this is! I'm happy to pick up the southern end of Derbyshire not already covered - so the two Derby seats plus Derbyshire Dales. I'll also do Burton. I'll also happily compose something for my now home constituency of Thirsk and Malton. Those should keep me busy during idle moments this next week. Right, I seem to have exhausted my first selections. I must say it is an enjoyable way to spend the lockdown. Feedback for my profiles seems to be positive (and yes I know they are lengthy but I do enjoy history, stories and colourful description about any constituency a la Andrew Teale's by-election profiles which are much fun) So my next choices will be Amber Valley, Skipton & Ripon and Beverley & Holderness unless anyone shouts up that they have these seats well advanced.
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Post by greenhert on Apr 10, 2020 21:08:03 GMT
Keep those profiles coming, everyone. So far we are exactly 22% of the way there.
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Post by yellowperil on Apr 18, 2020 14:57:38 GMT
I am very near the limit of constituencies I think I have sufficient first-hand knowledge to attempt- maybe Maidstone & the Weald to come, which would take my personal tally to 8 constituencies, and then I would stop. What I might do then is to go back to those eight and start putting in more statistical data like the referendum results, census data etc, which I failed to include much of at the first run, when I concentrated more on a word picture of the constituencies. I have spent a happy hour or two today (well it is my birthday) immersed in the Nomis data by constituency and realising maybe for the first time just how informative it is, so some of that stuff may be eventually making its way into my 8 chosen constituencies. Incidentally, I think this thread will continue to be quite important for all of us to discuss what we are doing and to compare notes generally. AdminSTB , is there a way of making this thread more accesible? At the moment only the sub-boards appear on the listing for general psephology and other threads like this one have vanished from sight?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 5:46:49 GMT
I can't deny that seeing this lockdown inspired subforum was the main reason to contribute something to the forum. I might not leave this subsection to be honest. I'll happily finish off central Lancashire, my knowledge of the eastern bits is lacking.
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Post by AdminSTB on Apr 19, 2020 8:19:55 GMT
AdminSTB , is there a way of making this thread more accesible? At the moment only the sub-boards appear on the listing for general psephology and other threads like this one have vanished from sight? They shouldn't have vanished; sub boards always appear at the top; it just means you need to scroll down to find the other threads. But to be helpful, I've now created some boundary changes: a board for the constituency profiles in their own right, separate from General Psephology.
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Post by yellowperil on Apr 19, 2020 8:26:47 GMT
AdminSTB , is there a way of making this thread more accesible? At the moment only the sub-boards appear on the listing for general psephology and other threads like this one have vanished from sight? They shouldn't have vanished; sub boards always appear at the top; it just means you need to scroll down to find the other threads. But to be helpful, I've now created some boundary changes: a board for the constituency profiles in their own right, separate from General Psephology. They had indeed vanished for me, but shortly after I made that comment they did re-appear after the sub-boards, so all was well after that. So thank you anyway for the new change - I don't know if the previous problem was just a blip of some sort on my computer.
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Post by yellowperil on Apr 19, 2020 18:57:50 GMT
I had said that I would do the eight Kent constituencies I had listed, but I saw carlton43 has muscled in on the last of those,Maidstone & the Weald , just after I had started work there, so I've decided I'll leave that to him- I will not attempt a strop like certain people have here and claim propietorial rights. So I am starting to work on the demographic statistics for the remaining seven. I have been trying to see what other people have provided but I don't really see a common pattern really, and I know there was some discussion as to what would ideally be required early in this thread but as far I can see nothing was resolved. Maybe the idea will be to see what different people come up with and what looks interesting and then either live with different formulae for different constituencies, or go through at the end of the process in an editorial manner and standardise on what people think is the best The same thing may arise in relation to electoral statistics which have been presented in a number of different ways. Decades ago, in an age before all this stuff was readily available online, I reckon I knew a lot about demographic data, but I am coming back to it after a very long gap so am virtually learning again from scratch. Not that I'm complaining, it's great fun, but I am looking through stuff that some of you probably know backwards and struggling with what one can and cannot do, so before trying to post anything I might try asking a few ignorant questions. Am I right in thinking that on some things like ethnicity there is no source available to provide numbers at constituency level later than the last census so nearly a decade out of date? If that is true in some areas the numbers must be near useless until the next census is available, or is there a magic source I haven't found?On employment statistics and the like, I have found the NOMIS stuff fascinating and really up to date, mostly available for 2019 at least, so much more relevant, but it seems to me for comparative purposes it's really frustrating because of the gaps where figures aren't provided because it implies they are vanishingly small or such that individuals might be identified! Is there a way round that?
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carlton43
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 19, 2020 19:15:26 GMT
I don't see that there need only be one entry by one person on each constituency, nor one single style or model of presentation either. If we take this further and take it foward to an 'Authorised Version' then we shall need a 'House Style' and a more rigid schema for making the whole into a uniform presentation, plus a deal of rigorous and heavy editing.
Now we need various things in this form of Almanac, and I saw myself providing something not always present in the work of others, being a deeper understanding of how the constituency came to be how it is, and how the structure of the place has affected thinking and attitudes. For me that is as interesting and often much more interesting than the bald stats of the last few decades. I am intersted in why the place is as it is and why the people there think and react as they do.
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Post by AdminSTB on Apr 19, 2020 19:59:40 GMT
It is just three weeks since Robert Waller first started this thread. I've stated numerous times my encouragement for multiple contributions to be made for each constituency. And with the next general election almost certainly four years away, and the next census being held next year, there seems no reason to rush this work. I would agree that much needs to be done on presentation, formatting and so on, but that will come. Maybe let's see what we come up with first. Once all the constituencies have profiles, we'll be turning our attention to filling the gaps. A great deal of progress has been made in such a very short period of time.
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Post by greenhert on Apr 19, 2020 20:06:22 GMT
We are now 30% of the way there
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 20:08:51 GMT
Yeah, let's think of this as a Wikipedia. A Wallerpedia, perhaps? (I'm so, so, so sorry Robert Waller ) I can already see how entries elsewhere influence what I'm writing: Preston had no stats and figures at all, and now I'm Googling while I draft to add a few numbers and census titbits. Each contributor influences the other, just as should happen with contributions towards a single goal.
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Post by Robert Waller on Apr 19, 2020 21:07:37 GMT
It is just three weeks since Robert Waller first started this thread. I've stated numerous times my encouragement for multiple contributions to be made for each constituency. And with the next general election almost certainly four years away, and the next census being held next year, there seems no reason to rush this work. I would agree that much needs to be done on presentation, formatting and so on, but that will come. Maybe let's see what we come up with first. Once all the constituencies have profiles, we'll be turning our attention to filling the gaps. A great deal of progress has been made in such a very short period of time. I think this is entirely right. There is no rush, I feel we are collectively making very good progress, but I do have a number of ideas for further development e.g. regional surveys, statistical tables and additions. No one knows as well as I how big a task any kind of Almanac is ....
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Post by yellowperil on Apr 20, 2020 6:53:39 GMT
I would think the problem could come when we pass the half way point and the constituencies remaining are nobody's favourites, and there is nobody with special local knowledge... not that that seems to stop some people. The comparison with Wikipedia is an interesting one, and while there are people on here who could not spots off the average wikicontributor there are nothing like the numbers here compared with wikipedia. I absolutely agree with multiple contributions at this stage and had said so in an earlier post on this thread- on the Maidstone & the Weald thread I didn't think I had anything major to add after carlton43 had made the opening contribution- I had no wish to offer up a rival main entry but may at some point add a few extra thoughts. It was the one I was least confident of from the eight I had undertaken to do. I think we do need to observe certain courtesies in developing the almanac and telling people in advance which ones one is working on and asking if anyone minds if you go first after such a claim has been made would be nice. There have been a few awkward moments like that already, which are perfectly avoidable with a little give and take. Some people are spending a long time doing careful lengthy research and others are knocking off a few thoughts off the top of their heads from first hand knowledge - I am not knocking either approach and we probably learn from both and will probably eventually need to find a way to fuse the results from both approaches. Meanwhile I am continuing to try and chart my way though what has become the somewhat unfamiliar territory of modern demographic statistics. Yesterday I asked some questions which have remained unanswered- they were not rhetorical questions but genuine requests for information and guidance from those among you who are regular practioners in this field. Are there good reliable statistics on demography on a constituency level more recent than the last census? On the NOMIS data, which is substantially more up to date on the economic front, how do you deal with the holes deliberately left where the data is too sensitive? And of course one might also have asked, how relevant is all of this post-coronavirus? Okay, that last question is probably rhetorical.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2020 7:23:09 GMT
yellowperil, I have found that Googling "House prices {{constituency name}}" and "constituency demographics" has helped. The ONS and ONS Census websites are my go-tos.
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Post by John Chanin on Apr 20, 2020 12:23:58 GMT
I have now completed the south Essex - north London traverse that I said I would do. Since no-one else has taken on Birmimgham, I will now go there, and do the city, plus neighbouring seats where I have some knowledge. I have the advantage of having done profiles of the new Birmingham wards in 2018, so much can simply be copied. There are perhaps a couple of seats elsewhere in the country which others haven't done, and where I have some personal familiarity. After that I will stop. It is very difficult to do profiles for areas you don't know.
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Post by yellowperil on Apr 20, 2020 14:13:09 GMT
We are now 30% of the way there We aren't, of course. What I think you mean is that there are entries of some sort for about 30% of constituencies, but some entries are a lot more complete and comprehensive than others, some have maybe conflicting summaries to be resolved, and anyway we have done the easiest third, i.e the ones that most of those interested in this project found easiest to do. Then there were the overarching concerns and comparisons across the whole country mentioned by Robert Waller. When we have done all the 650 constituencies we might be approaching the half way point for the whole project- maybe not even that. Swan is quite right to say this could be a project for the next 4 years -I think we will need most of that, and we'll still be going when Coronavirus is a distant memory (hopefully). I have been looking at where we have got to in the South-East, my home region. Overall we have entries of some sort for 29 constituencies out of 84, so slightly over the 30% mark, but of you look at the coverage by ceremonial counties ,say, we find a very uneven level of interest depending where people are, so Oxfordshire has 4 done out of 5 and Surrey 7 out of 11, but only 3 out of 19 in Hampshire, 1 out of 8 in Bucks, and 2 out of 8 in Berks. It looks as though we may need to find people interested in some of those black holes.In Kent there is a gap in West Kent and in Sussex only the Brighton & Hove conurbation has been done- nothing at all in the rest of Sussex, East or West. Maybe other people should look at their home regions to see where the holes are and to see who could be encouraged to make offers to work on those gaps.
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iang
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Post by iang on Apr 20, 2020 15:06:38 GMT
I have now completed the south Essex - north London traverse that I said I would do. Since no-one else has taken on Birmimgham, I will now go there, and do the city, plus neighbouring seats where I have some knowledge. I have the advantage of having done profiles of the new Birmingham wards in 2018, so much can simply be copied. There are perhaps a couple of seats elsewhere in the country which others haven't done, and where I have some personal familiarity. After that I will stop. It is very difficult to do profiles for areas you don't know. I might have a go at some of the Birmingham / Sandwell constituencies - been meaning to get round to the two West Brom seats. I could have a go at Walsall as well
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Post by John Chanin on Apr 20, 2020 16:15:55 GMT
I have now completed the south Essex - north London traverse that I said I would do. Since no-one else has taken on Birmimgham, I will now go there, and do the city, plus neighbouring seats where I have some knowledge. I have the advantage of having done profiles of the new Birmingham wards in 2018, so much can simply be copied. There are perhaps a couple of seats elsewhere in the country which others haven't done, and where I have some personal familiarity. After that I will stop. It is very difficult to do profiles for areas you don't know. I might have a go at some of the Birmingham / Sandwell constituencies - been meaning to get round to the two West Brom seats. I could have a go at Walsall as well I’ve started on Birmingham & Solihull, but if you could do the Black Country that would be fantastic.
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Richard Allen
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Post by Richard Allen on Apr 20, 2020 18:07:57 GMT
I might have a go at some of the Birmingham / Sandwell constituencies - been meaning to get round to the two West Brom seats. I could have a go at Walsall as well I’ve started on Birmingham & Solihull, but if you could do the Black Country that would be fantastic. I am currently writing a lengthy piece for Yardley. Feel free to do your own as well but you might want to prioritise the other seats.
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Post by John Chanin on Apr 20, 2020 18:25:22 GMT
I’ve started on Birmingham & Solihull, but if you could do the Black Country that would be fantastic. I am currently writing a lengthy piece for Yardley. Feel free to do your own as well but you might want to prioritise the other seats. My process is horizontal rather than vertical, but I won’t actually write a profile for Yardley as yours is certain to be better.
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