The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,489
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 21, 2020 10:46:16 GMT
Ah, of course - had already done my best to forget him  |
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Post by peterski on Feb 21, 2020 11:23:30 GMT
The resemblance is somewhat uncanny . Like the lovechild of a depraved tryst between Jared O'Mara and Ed Sheeran. God help us.
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Post by peterski on Feb 21, 2020 11:36:11 GMT
An active lib dem campaign just gifted a Tory landslide. Boris honeymoon still persists in ' aspirational ' areas like Coulby Newham . Labour need to get their shitshow back on the road quickly or we have 4 more years of Houchen's crap to put up with. While it must be tempting to blame the lib dems, the responsibility for Labour's abject failure lies with labour and only labour. If you ever want to win the red wall back you should be hammering us on cost of living issues like boris' rumoured u-turn on fuel duty. But instead your leadership election has become a contest to see who's the biggest denier of basic human biology. And you wonder why your vote share implodes... Nobody is claiming Labour aren't monumentally crap on Teesside at the moment . The party has been complacent , lazy and often openly dismissive towards folk who should be their natural voters . Labour support has been splintering for years but there are worrying signs that large numbers are now permanently coalescing around the Tories . Some of us find this perplexing bearing in mind the economic sabotage wreaked upon our communities by Thatcher and her heirs . But then others point out that Nu-Labour did precisely nowt for us either . I suspect Labour's only chance is an authentic working class Rebecca Long-Bailey leadership and maybe they can start reconnecting with their lost voters . It would help greatly if she minimises the woke bollocks but I'm not holding my breath on that.
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Post by andrewp on Feb 21, 2020 12:03:23 GMT
Confirmed that Lowther got 90 and Morrish 88
So full result is
Conservative 689
Labour 279
Liberal Democrat 259
Independent Lowther 90
Independent Morrish 88
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Post by gwynthegriff on Feb 21, 2020 12:27:19 GMT
While it must be tempting to blame the lib dems, the responsibility for Labour's abject failure lies with labour and only labour. If you ever want to win the red wall back you should be hammering us on cost of living issues like boris' rumoured u-turn on fuel duty. But instead your leadership election has become a contest to see who's the biggest denier of basic human biology. And you wonder why your vote share implodes... Nobody is claiming Labour aren't monumentally crap on Teesside at the moment . The party has been complacent , lazy and often openly dismissive towards folk who should be their natural voters . Labour support has been splintering for years but there are worrying signs that large numbers are now permanently coalescing around the Tories . Some of us find this perplexing bearing in mind the economic sabotage wreaked upon our communities by Thatcher and her heirs . But then others point out that Nu-Labour did precisely nowt for us either . I suspect Labour's only chance is an authentic working class Rebecca Long-Bailey leadership and maybe they can start reconnecting with their lost voters . It would help greatly if she minimises the woke bollocks but I'm not holding my breath on that.
That would be an interesting development. |
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Post by tonygreaves on Feb 21, 2020 15:36:49 GMT
Let's have no gingerism please.
Good result for Tom Carney the hard-working early morning swag-bag candidate! Expect to see him on the Council before too long.
As for Labour, some of us are more than happy to see them sink deep into the swamp at present. If they blame us, I take it as a badge of honour. Just a pity they scraped into second place.
Not that this result has much significance outside Middlesbrough, I suspect.
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Post by peterski on Feb 21, 2020 17:14:26 GMT
What happens in Middlesbrough always has significance . We built the modern world after all.
What certainly don't have significance in Middlesbrough , however, are the Liberal Democrats . Not that I don't believe hard campaigning shouldn't be rewarded . He should go for selection for some of the Redcar and Cleveland wards where Lib Dems get traction : Ormesby or Normanby for example.
That being said the LD's came within one vote of snatching a seat in Acklam last year and have some tradition in Marton and Stainton and Thornton.
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Post by middleenglander on Feb 21, 2020 17:50:02 GMT
Back from a short break in the Cotswolds with our 6 week old grand-daughter. Middlesbrough, Coulby Newham - Conservative hold | Party | 2020 votes | 2020 share | since 2019 "top" | since 2019 "average" | since 2017B | since 2016B | since 2015"top" | since 2015 "average" | | Conservative | 689 | 49.0% | -0.1% | -5.5% | +11.1% | +27.1% | +23.3% | +21.4% | Labour | 279 | 19.9% | -31.0% | -25.6% | -15.6% | -25.7% | -17.9% | -15.6% | Liberal Democrat | 259 | 18.4% | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | +15.4% | +4.9% | -3.9% | Independent Lowther | 90 | 6.4% | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | Independent Morrish | 88 | 6.3% | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | from nowhere | Previous Independents |
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| -24.1% | -29.6% | -23.0% | -22.3% | Green |
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| -2.4% |
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| Total votes | 1,405 |
| 83% | 93% | 107% | 87% | 36% | 39% |
Swing Labour to Conservative ~ 15½% / 10% since 2019, 13½% since 2017 by-election (Conservative win), 26½% since 2016 by-election (Labour win), 20% / 18% since 2015
- as there was only one Conservative candidate for 3 member ward in both 2019 and 2015 the swings compared to "average" vote are not particular meaningful.
Council now 20 Labour, 15 Middlesbrough Independent Councillors Association, 8 Middlesbrough Independent Group, 3 Conservative + Independent elected Mayor
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,489
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 22, 2020 10:48:55 GMT
I suspect Labour's only chance is an authentic working class Rebecca Long-Bailey leadership and maybe they can start reconnecting with their lost voters . It would help greatly if she minimises the woke bollocks but I'm not holding my breath on that. I see why you might think this, but polling evidence since the GE has consistently shown that "Labour's lost voters" would by some margin prefer Starmer as the next leader. Perverse? Very possibly, but voters often are - and if anything even more so in recent years  |
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Post by peterski on Feb 22, 2020 11:09:34 GMT
there's a lot of political perversion going on at the moment . I hear people around Teesside say with a straight face that Boris and his Brexit is going to bring industry back to the region. They are in for a rude awakening when the inevitable happens and we get a Brexit solely calibrated for the Tory bankers.
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Post by evergreenadam on Feb 22, 2020 16:00:55 GMT
I suspect Labour's only chance is an authentic working class Rebecca Long-Bailey leadership and maybe they can start reconnecting with their lost voters . It would help greatly if she minimises the woke bollocks but I'm not holding my breath on that. I see why you might think this, but polling evidence since the GE has consistently shown that "Labour's lost voters" would by some margin prefer Starmer as the next leader. Perverse? Very possibly, but voters often are - and if anything even more so in recent years Agreed. The working classes are not a block vote anyway. She would struggle to appeal to all of them. |
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Post by finsobruce on Feb 22, 2020 18:12:11 GMT
I suspect Labour's only chance is an authentic working class Rebecca Long-Bailey leadership and maybe they can start reconnecting with their lost voters . It would help greatly if she minimises the woke bollocks but I'm not holding my breath on that. I see why you might think this, but polling evidence since the GE has consistently shown that "Labour's lost voters" would by some margin prefer Starmer as the next leader. Perverse? Very possibly, but voters often are - and if anything even more so in recent years What's perverse about that? |
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msc
Non-Aligned
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Post by msc on Feb 22, 2020 18:30:56 GMT
Well, here's some secret information from the working class.
On the whole, people who can be persuaded to vote Labour don't give a shit where the leader comes from. A competent leader who seems to get whats up could come from Mars for all folk care.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Feb 22, 2020 20:20:23 GMT
Nobody is claiming Labour aren't monumentally crap on Teesside at the moment . The party has been complacent , lazy and often openly dismissive towards folk who should be their natural voters . Labour support has been splintering for years but there are worrying signs that large numbers are now permanently coalescing around the Tories . Some of us find this perplexing bearing in mind the economic sabotage wreaked upon our communities by Thatcher and her heirs . But then others point out that Nu-Labour did precisely nowt for us either . I suspect Labour's only chance is an authentic working class Rebecca Long-Bailey leadership and maybe they can start reconnecting with their lost voters . It would help greatly if she minimises the woke bollocks but I'm not holding my breath on that.
That would be an interesting development. I had to chortle at that one. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,489
Member is Online
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 23, 2020 12:09:17 GMT
I see why you might think this, but polling evidence since the GE has consistently shown that "Labour's lost voters" would by some margin prefer Starmer as the next leader. Perverse? Very possibly, but voters often are - and if anything even more so in recent years What's perverse about that? Well if you buy the line that Brexit is the be-all and end-all of why these people voted as they did - it *is* slightly perverse isn't it? (of course, what this really demonstrates is that things aren't actually that simple) |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Feb 23, 2020 21:16:18 GMT
What's perverse about that? Well if you buy the line that Brexit is the be-all and end-all of why these people voted as they did - it *is* slightly perverse isn't it? (of course, what this really demonstrates is that things aren't actually that simple) It's not impossible. After all, it's not unlikely that someone might be Eurosceptic, Labour-voting and dislike Corbyn. The man himself ticks two of those boxes. |
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Post by bigfatron on Feb 24, 2020 8:28:26 GMT
there's a lot of political perversion going on at the moment . I hear people around Teesside say with a straight face that Boris and his Brexit is going to bring industry back to the region. They are in for a rude awakening when the inevitable happens and we get a Brexit solely calibrated for the Tory bankers. Hi Peterski Sorry, presumably as you live oop north and news travels slowly in those parts, you won't have heard...* The Tories don't give a shit anymore about the bankers, as they are generally pro EU, most think Boris is a useless to55er after his inept performance as London mayor, and some are even social liberals; their new best friends are hedge fund owners and pro-Brexit entrepreneurs (aka Weatherspoon, Bamford and Hargreaves) who have joined the more traditional media owners, theatrical impresarios, property developers and the like. Don't expect the Tories to be particularly nice to bankers, as they keep whining about lost markets in Europe - its all about minimising regulation of tax havens, controlling the media and tryig to fool enough of the people enough of the time. *This is a joke - my better half is from the north-east and I've sampled the delights of Ayrsome Park a few times before it was knocked down. Splendid place with wonderfully cheap beer... |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,489
Member is Online
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 24, 2020 10:34:21 GMT
Well if you buy the line that Brexit is the be-all and end-all of why these people voted as they did - it *is* slightly perverse isn't it? (of course, what this really demonstrates is that things aren't actually that simple) It's not impossible. After all, it's not unlikely that someone might be Eurosceptic, Labour-voting and dislike Corbyn. The man himself ticks two of those boxes. Not really what I was getting at, yes these voters all dislike Corbyn (they wouldn't have deserted Labour otherwise) its their liking for Starmer that is the "surprise". |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Feb 24, 2020 10:54:05 GMT
It's not impossible. After all, it's not unlikely that someone might be Eurosceptic, Labour-voting and dislike Corbyn. The man himself ticks two of those boxes. Not really what I was getting at, yes these voters all dislike Corbyn (they wouldn't have deserted Labour otherwise) its their liking for Starmer that is the "surprise". I suppose there's an aspect to which many people have no idea of where he stands. Being sidelined during the campaign reinforces that, giving him an air of vagueness on the issue. |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Feb 24, 2020 10:57:01 GMT
A lot of voters instinctively disliked Corbyn because he looked like a generic lefty protestor, not a potential Prime Minister (and let's be honest, appearances were not entirely deceptive).
Starmer looks like someone who could be Prime Minister.
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