Crimson King
Lib Dem
Be nice to each other and sing in tune
Posts: 9,843 
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Post by Crimson King on Apr 30, 2018 15:33:35 GMT
Exactly. Europe is not a continent. It is a social construct. but if it self identifies as a continent......... |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Apr 30, 2018 19:26:41 GMT
Exactly. Europe is not a continent. It is a social construct. It's hilarious that you think this supports your argument. |
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peterl
Green
Congratulations President Trump
Posts: 8,473
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Post by peterl on Apr 30, 2018 19:29:35 GMT
Exactly. Europe is not a continent. It is a social construct. It's hilarious that you think this supports your argument. Well if "Europe" is not a separate continent then what is it? An ideology. |
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
Posts: 16,028
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Post by Sibboleth on Apr 30, 2018 20:49:43 GMT
*endless screaming*
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Post by yellowperil on Apr 30, 2018 21:16:28 GMT
The concepts of continents as separate entities surely started in the classical era and there were 3 continents, Africa, Asia and Europe,each much smaller than currently defined. As we grew in understanding of the whole world, we added Australia, Antarctica and the two Americas to make 7 continents. It could be argued that Eurasia is a single very large continent including a couple of large peninsular subcontinents, the European one and the Indian one, but this all semantics, and of no real significance in relation to any practical purpose. Largish island masses adjacent to each continent , whether the British Isles, Japan, Madagascar, Sri Lanka or Cuba,say, are regarded as belonging to their adjacent continent or sub-continent.
And so what?
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Post by mrpastelito on Apr 30, 2018 21:27:39 GMT
The concepts of continents as separate entities surely started in the classical era and there were 3 continents, Africa, Asia and Europe,each much smaller than currently defined. As we grew in understanding of the whole world, we added Australia, Antarctica and the two Americas to make 7 continents. It could be argued that Eurasia is a single very large continent including a couple of large peninsular subcontinents, the European one and the Indian one, but this all semantics, and of no real significance in relation to any practical purpose. Largish island masses adjacent to each continent , whether the British Isles, Japan, Madagascar, Sri Lanka or Cuba,say, are regarded as belonging to their adjacent continent or sub-continent. And so what? Si tacuisses... |
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,589
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Post by cibwr on May 1, 2018 10:37:53 GMT
Well it was an important metropolis at one time :-) far bigger than Birmingham It was certainly one of the burghs fortified by Æthelflæd, Lady of the Mercians. Which is perhaps why she is commemorated in at least one Street Name in Wednesbury. |
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,589
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Post by cibwr on May 1, 2018 10:43:42 GMT
Aberffraw and Abergwyngregyn have been claimed as royal seats. Likewise Harlech, Mathrafal, Dinas Powys, Dinas Brân and of course Dinefwr |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,732
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Post by Chris from Brum on May 1, 2018 11:56:11 GMT
It was certainly one of the burghs fortified by Æthelflæd, Lady of the Mercians. Which is perhaps why she is commemorated in at least one Street Name in Wednesbury. Under the simplified spelling of Ethelfleda. |
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,589
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Post by cibwr on May 1, 2018 16:33:25 GMT
Which is perhaps why she is commemorated in at least one Street Name in Wednesbury. Under the simplified spelling of Ethelfleda. Indeed, which sparked an interest in her when I lived a street away... |
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Post by Adam in Stroud on May 1, 2018 20:18:54 GMT
Under the simplified spelling of Ethelfleda. Indeed, which sparked an interest in her when I lived a street away... There's going to be a three-day tamasha in Gloucester to commemorate the 1100th anniversary of her death in June. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2018 5:39:32 GMT
The Channel sets us apart as an independent sovereign entity. We are not part of a single land mass, and therefore we are separate. Oh FFS. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2018 6:22:21 GMT
It's hilarious that you think this supports your argument. Well if "Europe" is not a separate continent then what is it? An ideology. It’s a continent. That doesn’t mean you have have to support the European pan nationalism of the EU, I certainly don’t, but Europe is a continent and we are an integral part of it. |
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Post by Adam in Stroud on May 2, 2018 6:45:15 GMT
Well if "Europe" is not a separate continent then what is it? An ideology. It’s a continent. That doesn’t mean you have have to support the European pan nationalism of the EU, I certainly don’t, but Europe is a continent and we are an integral part of it. That was kind of my point several pages back. Vaguely on topic, it could be argued that if there is going to be a political capital for Europe, Brussels is a bit odd and even more so if it is split with Strasbourg. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2018 7:09:54 GMT
It’s a continent. That doesn’t mean you have have to support the European pan nationalism of the EU, I certainly don’t, but Europe is a continent and we are an integral part of it. That was kind of my point several pages back. Vaguely on topic, it could be argued that if there is going to be a political capital for Europe, Brussels is a bit odd and even more so if it is split with Strasbourg. For historical reasons I’d much prefer it if the capital of Europe was Rome, Vienna or Athens. |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,732
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Post by Chris from Brum on May 2, 2018 10:19:14 GMT
It’s a continent. That doesn’t mean you have have to support the European pan nationalism of the EU, I certainly don’t, but Europe is a continent and we are an integral part of it. That was kind of my point several pages back. Vaguely on topic, it could be argued that if there is going to be a political capital for Europe, Brussels is a bit odd and even more so if it is split with Strasbourg. Strasbourg was allegedly Adenauer's idea - he had been told that they spoke French at work, and German at home, so to him it seemed like the exemplar of Franco-German co-operation (forgetting that they'd been to war over it several times in the last century). |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2018 12:48:38 GMT
Vaguely on topic, it could be argued that if there is going to be a political capital for Europe, Brussels is a bit odd and even more so if it is split with Strasbourg. One explanation put to me about ten years ago was that it's at least partly because Brussels is the largest city in the EU that is at least officially bilingual with a Romance language and a Germanic language. Though whether this was really factored into things is another question. It probably helps that Belgium is not a major European power, has probably the weakest national identity of any European state, and that Brussels is probably the European capital city that is least strongly identified with any country or nation, as well as being highly accessible. I suppose the question is, what would be the alternative? |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,732
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Post by Chris from Brum on May 2, 2018 12:59:18 GMT
It probably helps that Belgium is not a major European power, has probably the weakest national identity of any European state, and that Brussels is probably the European capital city that is least strongly identified with any country or nation, as well as being highly accessible. I suppose the question is, what would be the alternative? Luxemb(o)urg - French is the language of government and business, German is the language of education, media and the church, and Letzeburgesch (Luxembourgish) is the language of home, and while it is basically a dialect of German, has a lot of French loanwords. And almost everyone speaks at least serviceable English. Plus the tax on fuel is very low. |
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Post by Adam in Stroud on May 2, 2018 19:13:40 GMT
Vaguely on topic, it could be argued that if there is going to be a political capital for Europe, Brussels is a bit odd and even more so if it is split with Strasbourg. One explanation put to me about ten years ago was that it's at least partly because Brussels is the largest city in the EU that is at least officially bilingual with a Romance language and a Germanic language. Though whether this was really factored into things is another question. It probably helps that Belgium is not a major European power, has probably the weakest national identity of any European state, and that Brussels is probably the European capital city that is least strongly identified with any country or nation, as well as being highly accessible. I suppose the question is, what would be the alternative? I completely understand why Brussels was chosen, it was the "offend nobody" choice. It is also quite well placed geographically in the heart of the North European economic power house. But if one was genuinely choosing a capital that is a great city at the heart of the history and culture of the area it is capital of, then @davidr's choices are good. Out of the original Six I'd have said Rome's the obvious choice but post-Cold War I'd go for Vienna. |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,135
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Post by Foggy on May 2, 2018 21:55:52 GMT
Prague and Vilnius both have wildly varying claims to being the closest capitals to the geographical centre of Europe. Naturally neither was an option in the 1950s, and the latter would be politically very contentious even now.
Not all official languages of the EU are Germanic or Romance anymore either, and you'd be hard-pressed to find a city where Greek, Maltese, Hungarian, Swedish, Irish Gaelic and Latvian are all spoken to a high standard by a significant chunk of the populace!
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