Election petitions

[finsobruce]

Oct 12, 2020 16:04:14 GMT J.G.Harston said:

Oct 12, 2020 12:42:10 GMT robert1 said:

I think that is a fairly safe bet.

'Hugely controversial'?-given that the Labour Party uses them for many party memberships/meetings. 

The difference is that Random Joe Public is highly likely to be an elector with the right to vote. Random J. Public is highly *un*likely to be a Labour Party member with the right to vote in a party meeting.

If you just count electors, In Hornsey and Wood Green the chance is really quite high!

[middleenglander]

Another fortnight passes with no apparent news about the Brent: Barnhill election petition. It is now 14 weeks since the recount was undertaken but less than 9 weeks before the judiciary go on their Christmas holidays. What are the chances the judgement will be issued before then?

Another milestone is 13 March 2021. This is the mid point date between the disputed result being declared in January 2020 and the May 2022 elections. If the election were to be declared void or undue at that date, with Councillor(s) sitting unduly for half the period they were supposedly elected to have served, then the whole judicial system will be brought into further serious disrepute.

[middleenglander]

Whilst the antics across the pond have received much attention this week, our seriously flawed election petition process has still failed to produce a judgement on an election in Brent: Barnhill where the voters went to the polls in January.  A further fortnight has passed and it is now 16 weeks since the judicial supervised re-count was undertaken and 40 weeks since the declared result was formally challenged.   There are only 6 effective weeks left to achieve the milestone of determining the result of a January by-election within the same calendar year.

The precise dates of some of the events surrounding this ongoing saga do not appear to be in the public arena but the following are clear:
* 23 January 2020 - date of the by-election for Brent: Barnhill,
* 04 February 2020 - election petition, dated the day earlier, formally acknowledged by the High Court,
* 20 March 2020 - initial hearing to set date for trial.

It is not clear from the information available when it was discovered the bag containing the ballot papers had been mislaid nor precisely when it was found with the seal missing.  However a statement by one of the petitioners on a third party website suggests that it was a few days before the initial hearing that the Returning Officer's legal representatives informed the petitioners the seals were broken and sometime later that the seals could not be found.  I have been unable to find a copy of the relevant witness statement made by the Council's Head of Executive and Member Services although there are extensive quotes from it in the local newspaper.

I have never worked for a local authority let alone its electoral service.  However, I have been closely involved in internal investigations some leading the criminal ones.  I was taught from day one that best practice was to secure and safely store as much evidence as possible at the earliest possible opportunity.  The available timeline suggests this may not have been done in this particular instance.  The longer this petition goes on the more questions there are about the whole election petition process and how it has been applied in Brent: Barnhill.  

It is interesting to note that Stefan Volosenuic, one of the petitioners, is standing as an Independent in the Romanian Senate elections to be held on 6 December.

[middleenglander]

Whilst parts of America struggle to count the votes of an election three weeks ago, here we await the judgement of the High Court on an election held 10 months ago and where the recount was undertaken on 16 / 17 July, more than 18 weeks ago. There appears as yet to be no public indication as to whether the result will be declared during the current calendar year as there are fewer than 4 weeks to go before the Courts rise for Christmas.

There is more than who is / was / has been elected as Councillors for the Brent, Barnhill ward on 23 January 2020, or indeed anyone in the event the election has been declared void. It will be interesting to see what the judgement says, if indeed anything, about a range of issues including:

* the way the bag containing the ballot papers was handled after initially being mislaid and then found with the seal missing,
* whether the reasons for an Election Petition can be extended if something material is subsequently discovered after the petition has been lodged,
* in this case whether a recount includes verifying that all the ballot papers printed can be properly accounted for,
* the actions of the Returning Officer in deciding whether to undertake any request for a recount or checking of bundles before declaring the result and
* any considerations about the Election Petition process itself.

I am sure no-one can be content with a process which takes so long and where the limited number of recent occasions have highlighted weaknesses.

[robert1]

I tabled the following questions earlier this week. These arise from Brent but are in no way critical of/commenting on what has happened there which I fear may be COVID related. We have introduced timetables for aspects of reviews and think we should consider doing so for petitions (and other matters).

To ask HMG what assessment they have made of the legislative framework governing the conduct of election petitions; and what plans they have, if any, to change any such framework.

To ask HMG what assessment they have made of (1) the integrity of elections, and (2) the time taken to determine outcomes of disputed elections, in England.

[middleenglander]

Dec 10, 2020 13:37:58 GMT robert1 said:

I tabled the following questions earlier this week. These arise from Brent but are in no way critical of/commenting on what has happened there which I fear may be COVID related. We have introduced timetables for aspects of reviews and think we should consider doing so for petitions (and other matters).

To ask HMG what assessment they have made of the legislative framework governing the conduct of election petitions; and what plans they have, if any, to change any such framework.

To ask HMG what assessment they have made of (1) the integrity of elections, and (2) the time taken to determine outcomes of disputed elections, in England.

Now just 6 working days to go in order to get the judgment in this calendar year.

How long before the answers to your questions are supposedly due? Is it 28 days, with or without the Christmas adjournment?

[robert1]

Answers, I am told, due by 21st December. Calculated as working days unaffected by recesses.

[middleenglander]

Dec 14, 2020 17:21:39 GMT robert1 said:

Answers, I am told, due by 21st December. Calculated as working days unaffected by recesses.

Thanks. Will wait with interest.

[middleenglander]

2020 has ended with no apparent determination of the Brent: Barnhill election petition. It should be noted that the Barnhill saga, currently 346 days and continuing since the by-election, is now over 8 weeks longer than the Denbighshire: Prestatyn North election petition. Possibly more importantly, at 24 weeks and counting since the recount in the middle of July the time-line from recount to determination is already twice as long as for Prestatyn North. This petition was described in 2013 by the Institute of Local Government Studies at the University of Birmingham as "Prestatyn's election farce and the busted petition process" and "an all-round total embarrassment".

Milestones coming up include:
* 19 days until the anniversary of the by-election on 23 January.
* 31 days until the anniversary of the petition received on 04 February.
* 68 days until the mid-point from the by-election until when the next election is due on 05 May 2022.

We still await the answers to robert1's questions where he was told they would be provided by 21st December.

[edgbaston]

Jan 4, 2021 15:09:58 GMT middleenglander said:

2020 has ended with no apparent determination of the Brent: Barnhill election petition. It should be noted that the Barnhill saga, currently 346 days and continuing since the by-election, is now over 8 weeks longer than the Denbighshire: Prestatyn North election petition. Possibly more importantly, at 24 weeks and counting since the recount in the middle of July the time-line from recount to determination is already twice as long as for Prestatyn North. This petition was described in 2013 by the Institute of Local Government Studies at the University of Birmingham as "Prestatyn's election farce and the busted petition process" and "an all-round total embarrassment".

Milestones coming up include:
* 19 days until the anniversary of the by-election on 23 January.
* 31 days until the anniversary of the petition received on 04 February.
* 68 days until the mid-point from the by-election until when the next election is due on 05 May 2022.

We still await the answers to robert1's questions where he was told they would be provided by 21st December.

I will celebrate every date with much joy. I hope this drags on as long as possible and that your coverage of it is maintained the entire time.

[greatkingrat]

Jan 4, 2021 15:09:58 GMT middleenglander said:

We still await the answers to robert1's questions where he was told they would be provided by 21st December.

They have been answered, albeit the answers aren't particularly illuminating.

questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-questions/detail/2020-12-07/hl11129

[🏴‍☠️ Neath West 🏴‍☠️]

With such slow progress, despite the recount having taken place nearly 6 months ago, does anyone know if it would be possible for the petitioner to apply for a writ of mandamus (or "mandatory order" in Newspeak)? Or are election courts somehow immune to this?

[middleenglander]

Jan 4, 2021 15:09:58 GMT middleenglander said:

2020 has ended with no apparent determination of the Brent: Barnhill election petition. It should be noted that the Barnhill saga, currently 346 days and continuing since the by-election, is now over 8 weeks longer than the Denbighshire: Prestatyn North election petition. Possibly more importantly, at 24 weeks and counting since the recount in the middle of July the time-line from recount to determination is already twice as long as for Prestatyn North. This petition was described in 2013 by the Institute of Local Government Studies at the University of Birmingham as "Prestatyn's election farce and the busted petition process" and "an all-round total embarrassment".

Milestones coming up include:
* 19 days until the anniversary of the by-election on 23 January.
* 31 days until the anniversary of the petition received on 04 February.
* 68 days until the mid-point from the by-election until when the next election is due on 05 May 2022.

The first of these milestones has come and gone without any apparent news. It is now more than one year since the by-election subject to the election petition.

[johnhemming]

Jan 23, 2021 10:36:55 GMT middleenglander said:

The first of these milestones has come and gone without any apparent news. It is now more than one year since the by-election subject to the election petition.

The courts are moving more slowly than normal. That does not mean nothing is happening, but things will be slower than they historically would have been. The parties to the case may know what is going on. It is also subject to some public scrutiny. I have not done an election petition for over a decade, but there is almost certainly an office in the RCJ Eastern Wing that will have some idea as to what is happening (if any hearings are scheduled that sort of thing).

Back over a decade ago I used to get copies of all of the petitions and post basic information on the net. I don't know if anyone does that outside this forum.

[Davıd Boothroyd]

When I last went to the Election Petitions Office, it was still in Room E105. It's a fairly cramped small office. But I don't think personal visits are encouraged under lockdown conditions.

[middleenglander]

Jan 23, 2021 10:36:55 GMT middleenglander said:

Jan 4, 2021 15:09:58 GMT middleenglander said:

2020 has ended with no apparent determination of the Brent: Barnhill election petition. It should be noted that the Barnhill saga, currently 346 days and continuing since the by-election, is now over 8 weeks longer than the Denbighshire: Prestatyn North election petition. Possibly more importantly, at 24 weeks and counting since the recount in the middle of July the time-line from recount to determination is already twice as long as for Prestatyn North. This petition was described in 2013 by the Institute of Local Government Studies at the University of Birmingham as "Prestatyn's election farce and the busted petition process" and "an all-round total embarrassment".

Milestones coming up include:
* 19 days until the anniversary of the by-election on 23 January.
* 31 days until the anniversary of the petition received on 04 February.
* 68 days until the mid-point from the by-election until when the next election is due on 05 May 2022.

The first of these milestones has come and gone without any apparent news. It is now more than one year since the by-election subject to the election petition.

The second of these milestones has come and gone without any apparent news. It is now over a year since the election petition was dated on 3 February 2020 and exactly a year since it was received by the High Court of Justice and date stamped 4 February 2020.

Upcoming milestones include:

February 6 - current petition saga will be 3 months longer from the date of election than that for Denbighshire: Prestatyn North petition in 2012
February 25 - current time since recount will be 6 months longer than for Waltham Forest: High Street in 2010
February 27 - current petition saga will be 9 months longer from the date of election than that for Waltham Forest: High Street in 2010
March 16 - mid point between election on 23 January 2020 and end of term following 2022 elections
March 20 - anniversary of High Court ordering a recount

[Davıd Boothroyd]

The hearing has been set for 19 February.

[middleenglander]

Assuming we get a resolution of the Brent: Barnhill petition on 19 February, a comparison with Waltham Forest: High Street and Denbighshire: Prestatyn North is given by:

	Brent	Denbighshire	Waltham Forest
	Barnhill	Prestatyn North	High Street
Date of:
election	23 January 2020	03 May 2012	06 May 2010
recount ordered	20 March 2020	27 July 2012	not available
recount undertaken	16 / 17 July 2020	29 October 2012	30 July 2010
decision hearing	19 February 2021	23 January 2013	08 September 2010
Days from:
election to recount ordered	57	85	not available
recount ordered to recount	118	94	not available
election to recount	175	179	85
recount to decision hearing	217 /218	86	40
election to decision hearing	393	265	125
recount ordered to hearing	336	180	not available

[Davıd Boothroyd]

The effect of a decade of Tory/Lib Dem cuts to the court service there.

[grahammurray]

Feb 8, 2021 15:33:24 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

The effect of a decade of Tory/Lib Dem cuts to the court service there.

How large would Labour's cuts to the court service have been?