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Post by Merseymike on Oct 4, 2017 17:08:25 GMT
Anyway, though it's true that Die Linke is riddled with embarrassing Ostalgie I'm not sure if it's really accurate to call it extremist or even Far Left. Foreign policy aside even Hard Left is pushing it these days. It's the history of their eastern wing (which is actually not as left wing as the western wing which o/c is an SPD splinter) and how the whole party reacts to it that makes them controversial, not their actual politics. And that's exactly why the SPD have no cogent reason for not working with them. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Oct 4, 2017 17:39:30 GMT
Anyway, though it's true that Die Linke is riddled with embarrassing Ostalgie I'm not sure if it's really accurate to call it extremist or even Far Left. Foreign policy aside even Hard Left is pushing it these days. It's the history of their eastern wing (which is actually not as left wing as the western wing which o/c is an SPD splinter) and how the whole party reacts to it that makes them controversial, not their actual politics. As a whole, they are definitely not extreme. The WASG element are your generic soft-left to hard-left setup, given their history. Even the embarassing Ostalgie is not that bad. But the problem remains that Eastern wing, as you say. After a few years of looking relatively positive, with Gysi et al, newer faces like Kipping or Bartsch, and the leftist dissident crowd trying to gently push out the totalitarian apologists, the apologists are back in fashion. It should be remembered that Bartsch had to intervene a few years ago when some members of Die Linke boycotted a minute's silence for the victims of the Berlin Wall and tried (and failed) to organise a purge of such types. The head of those types is of course La Wagenknecht. Gysi and Gabi Zimmer had to try and sort all this out before: www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/pds-erklaerung-gysi-isoliert-kommunistische-plattform-a-143009.htmlThen there was the hounding of Joachim Gauke, which let's face it was the old SED types settling scores with an old enemy. Until that Eastern wing has the courage to purge the lunatics, apologists for murder and Honecker groupies, can anyone blame the SPD for being uncomfortable with a party that contains people who celebrate the previous demise of the SPD, and long for the destruction of the SPD now? If Die Linke was an expanded WASG, even the suspicion of old traitors probably would not bother the SPD as much. |
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iain
Lib Dem
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Post by iain on Oct 4, 2017 17:46:37 GMT
Anyway, though it's true that Die Linke is riddled with embarrassing Ostalgie I'm not sure if it's really accurate to call it extremist or even Far Left. Foreign policy aside even Hard Left is pushing it these days. It's the history of their eastern wing (which is actually not as left wing as the western wing which o/c is an SPD splinter) and how the whole party reacts to it that makes them controversial, not their actual politics. And that's exactly why the SPD have no cogent reason for not working with them. Well no, because the reason the SPD won’t work with them isn’t to do with economics. |
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Post by Merseymike on Oct 4, 2017 18:22:48 GMT
And that's exactly why the SPD have no cogent reason for not working with them. Well no, because the reason the SPD won’t work with them isn’t to do with economics. Then they will have to rethink because they can't do another grand coalition and there's no chance of coalition with the FPD. Which means Red Red Green. No other option |
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,846
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Post by Georg Ebner on Oct 5, 2017 11:38:01 GMT
By the way: THE LEFT received in the East (incl. WestBerlin) last time 33/64 (51.6%), this time 26/69 (37.7%) MPs.
-0 Berlin (+West) 6:6
-2 Brandenburg 6:4
-0 MecklenburgVorpommern 3:3
-3 Sachsen 8:5
-0 SachsenAnhalt 5:5
-2 Thüringen 5:3
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Post by Andrew_S on Oct 5, 2017 14:43:41 GMT
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,137
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Post by Foggy on Oct 5, 2017 15:53:41 GMT
Despite a good performance on the constituency vote, the FDP failed to win even a list seat in Bremen. All of the groups that made it into the Bundestag won at least one seat each in all the other states.
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,137
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Post by Foggy on Oct 5, 2017 16:02:23 GMT
Would be interesting to get a follow-up article about differential turnout. It's quite possible that at least a quarter of those who actually ended up casting a valid vote at the election fell into the over-70 age category. |
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Post by greenhert on Oct 5, 2017 16:44:39 GMT
Despite a good performance on the constituency vote, the FDP failed to win even a list seat in Bremen. All of the groups that made it into the Bundestag won at least one seat each in all the other states. Difficult anyway since Bremen has only two list seats as well as only two constituency seats. |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,137
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Post by Foggy on Oct 5, 2017 17:01:59 GMT
Despite a good performance on the constituency vote, the FDP failed to win even a list seat in Bremen. All of the groups that made it into the Bundestag won at least one seat each in all the other states. Difficult anyway since Bremen has only two list seats as well as only two constituency seats. That's its base allocation in a 598-seat Bundestag. Since the SPD wins both constituency seats it ends up being allocated more due to overhangs and balancing seats. This time it finished with 6 seats, so the FDP were the only party to miss out. |
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Post by Andrew_S on Oct 5, 2017 17:09:38 GMT
Would be interesting to get a follow-up article about differential turnout. It's quite possible that at least a quarter of those who actually ended up casting a valid vote at the election fell into the over-70 age category. Not sure but it's possible they also helped keep Merkel's percentage above 30% since I think they were significantly more likely to be CDU/CSU supporters. |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,137
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Post by Foggy on Oct 5, 2017 17:45:54 GMT
Would be interesting to get a follow-up article about differential turnout. It's quite possible that at least a quarter of those who actually ended up casting a valid vote at the election fell into the over-70 age category. Not sure but it's possible they also helped keep Merkel's percentage above 30% since I think they were significantly more likely to be CDU/CSU supporters. Apparently the Union remained above 40% among those aged 60+. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Oct 5, 2017 20:01:00 GMT
Despite a good performance on the constituency vote, the FDP failed to win even a list seat in Bremen. All of the groups that made it into the Bundestag won at least one seat each in all the other states. I noticed this earlier only because I spotted that Lencke Steiner didn't make it in. I suspect the real battle for the FDP is the next Bremen election- they took 9.3% on the Zweitstimme this time compared to 6.5% in 2015 in the Buergerschaft election, which itself was up from a historic low of 2.5% the last time out. |
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Foggy
Non-Aligned
Yn Ennill Yma
Posts: 6,137
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Post by Foggy on Oct 5, 2017 23:38:48 GMT
Despite a good performance on the constituency vote, the FDP failed to win even a list seat in Bremen. All of the groups that made it into the Bundestag won at least one seat each in all the other states. I noticed this earlier only because I spotted that Lencke Steiner didn't make it in. I suspect the real battle for the FDP is the next Bremen election- they took 9.3% on the Zweitstimme this time compared to 6.5% in 2015 in the Buergerschaft election, which itself was up from a historic low of 2.5% the last time out. Given the result of the referendum, Bürgerschaftswahlen in Bremen will continue to come around more often than any other kind of election! Unfortunately I'm not sure that Steiner and friends can take heart from last month's good result too much, though. As with Die Linke, there seems to be a pattern of a much higher vote share in the recent federal election than at the latest corresponding Landtagswahlen. In fact, taking into account the wildly different performances of those parties in the former East, I'd even go so far as to say that the effect is even more pronounced in the case of the FDP. |
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
Posts: 16,036
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Post by Sibboleth on Oct 9, 2017 0:58:55 GMT
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2017 11:51:26 GMT
Merkel has invited FDP and the Greens to bilateral coalition talks with CDU/CSU on 18 October. This will be followed by talks between all three (well, technically four..) parties on 20 October.
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thetop
Labour
[k4r]
Posts: 945
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Post by thetop on Oct 9, 2017 11:56:06 GMT
I'd have thought if the Greens do go into coalition with such parties that might be to SPD/Left's favour.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2017 12:21:16 GMT
I'd have thought if the Greens do go into coalition with such parties that might be to SPD/Left's favour. Yes, but they could also influence government policy on some areas, its always a trade-off. |
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thetop
Labour
[k4r]
Posts: 945
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Post by thetop on Oct 9, 2017 12:26:35 GMT
I'd have thought if the Greens do go into coalition with such parties that might be to SPD/Left's favour. Yes, but they could also influence government policy on some areas, its always a trade-off. Of course - I'm just looking for a path to power for the German left. Opposition and a centre-left party alienating its base are ideal conditions. |
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,846
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Post by Georg Ebner on Oct 11, 2017 10:00:24 GMT
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