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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Mar 26, 2016 12:57:02 GMT
I wonder how many British Prime Ministers have won an election but the constituency of their birth has gone to another party. At this level the place of birth reflects where the maternity hospital for many. It's not just an urban thing - a significant chunk of the population in eastern Wales is English born to lifelong Welsh residents. Indeed, it's all a grey area. Still,interesting to see where some PMs were born (Lloyd George being born in Manchester being a particular curiosity). |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Mar 26, 2016 12:58:08 GMT
At this level the place of birth reflects where the maternity hospital for many. It's not just an urban thing - a significant chunk of the population in eastern Wales is English born to lifelong Welsh residents. Michael Portillo for example was born in Bushey as there was a maternity hospital there and his family actually lived in Harrow (similarly Mark Ramprakash). I was born at home which was about 100 yards from said maternity hospital Rejecting the State even in the womb!  |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 12:58:28 GMT
I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd will think that there was never any such constituency as 'Manchester Davyhulme' I always make that mistake. The local party had a tendency to call it that and it's a bad habit that must have stuck with me. It was a tendency that I think only developed after the Tories lost Withington and wanted to pretend they still had a seat in Manchester. I imagine that for many of the older members it would have gone down as well as calling Sutton Coldfield 'Birmingham Sutton Coldfield' would go down with the locals (even though in that case it would have some justification) |
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carlton43
Reform Party
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Post by carlton43 on Mar 26, 2016 12:59:18 GMT
Jim Callaghan was born in Portsmouth in 1912 when there was a single (but two member) Portsmouth constituency. In 1910 the two seats had been won by a Tory and a liberal unionist but as 1912 was the year the latter merged with the former it was two conservatives until the seat was split into three at the 1918 General Election. Callaghan didn't win an election of course , but becoming PM in 1976 was at time when Labour held one of the two Portsmouth constituences, Frank Judd holding on in Portsmouth North until 1979. I think that this included Copnor where Callaghan was born but I'm sure Khunanup will put me right if I've got that wrong.  carlton43 may be interested to know that Callaghan joined the Labour party while living in Maidstone. No I didn't know that he had been in Maidstone where I first joined a political party also. He worked for the CIR in Ashford and as a junior clerk I attended at the CIR daily to collect items and dealt with their clerk who had taken over from Callaghan. |
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Post by hullenedge on Mar 26, 2016 13:03:13 GMT
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 13:45:28 GMT
I can't really tell from that map but I'll take your word for it as you obviously know the area and the history of boundaries there very well. Shame as it would have made a nice narrative (which probably also indicates I was wrong, or we probably should have heard of it before) |
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 15:01:06 GMT
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 15:22:34 GMT
Ramsay Macdonald was as we all know born in Lossiemouth which at the time was in the Elginshire and Nairnshire constituency (now Moray) then held by the Conservatives but soon to fall to the Liberals. He maintained a house there but (there's a theme here) also had one in Hampstead for the last twelve years of his life. I think that means he was living somewhere else when he first became PM but where.... I don't know.
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 15:33:10 GMT
I can't really tell from that map but I'll take your word for it as you obviously know the area and the history of boundaries there very well. Shame as it would have made a nice narrative (which probably also indicates I was wrong, or we probably should have heard of it before) A lot of books etc refer to Wilson growing up in the Colne Valley which is probably true in a geographical sense, just not quite correct in constituency terms. |
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Post by David Ashforth on Mar 26, 2016 17:05:47 GMT
I can't really tell from that map but I'll take your word for it as you obviously know the area and the history of boundaries there very well. Shame as it would have made a nice narrative (which probably also indicates I was wrong, or we probably should have heard of it before) Some more maps of the area, from the National Library of Scotland ( link) |
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Post by hullenedge on Mar 26, 2016 18:29:26 GMT
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Post by hullenedge on Mar 26, 2016 20:49:32 GMT
Apologies I stand corrected. Harold Wilson did live in the Colne Valley Division. Milnsbridge ward (i.e. Cowlersley) was absorbed into Hudds CB from March 1937. Special election on Tuesday 23rd March 1937 returned candidates from all three main parties.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2016 21:13:30 GMT
Appreciate the title isn't accurate but, inspired by a comment made by Khunanup , I note that Wikipedia has a list of United States presidents by place of birth and state of primary affiliatioun. Obvious with having changing constituencies and no primary system, it would be more subjective than the American version, but it would be interesting to see in particular who won an election but saw their home seat go to another party. I suspect we would need to split this into constituency of birth (and its modern counterpart), constituency raised in or identified with most strongly (and modern counterpart), and seat (s) elected in. So for example, were I elected from my current seat and became PM, mine would read: Manchester Davyhulme/Stretford and Urmston, Stretford and Urmston, Cheadle. I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd and finsobruce might have some interesting thoughts on this. Born in Newcastle Central. Newcastle Central still exists, but place of birth now in Newcastle East (and pre-1983 was in Newcastle North). Current seat Putney. |
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Post by Tangent on Mar 28, 2016 13:26:20 GMT
Ramsay Macdonald was as we all know born in Lossiemouth which at the time was in the Elginshire and Nairnshire constituency (now Moray) then held by the Conservatives but soon to fall to the Liberals. He maintained a house there but (there's a theme here) also had one in Hampstead for the last twelve years of his life. I think that means he was living somewhere else when he first became PM but where.... I don't know. When he first became PM, he lived at 9 Howitt Road in Belsize Park, having moved there in 1916. Before that, he lived at a flat in 3 Lincoln's Inn Fields for about 20 years; all his children were born there, I believe, and it was a frequent meeting place for the big guns of the pre-war Labour party. |
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Sibboleth
Labour
'Sit on my finger, sing in my ear, O littleblood.'
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Post by Sibboleth on Mar 28, 2016 13:48:32 GMT
He didn't get to be PM of course but as Hugh Gaitskell was born in Kensington and lived in Hampstead when he was Labour leader, I don't think he ever lived in a Labour held seat. May have done when he was a WEA lecturer in Notts. |
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 28, 2016 14:20:11 GMT
He didn't get to be PM of course but as Hugh Gaitskell was born in Kensington and lived in Hampstead when he was Labour leader, I don't think he ever lived in a Labour held seat. May have done when he was a WEA lecturer in Notts. True it is. Did he live in Hucknall as well as lecture there? |
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Post by Tangent on Mar 28, 2016 20:57:11 GMT
Disraeli would be a good one. Disraeli was born in Bloomsbury, and lived there for most of his youth, but, when Isaac d'Israeli moved to Bradenham in 1829, Buckinghamshire became the site of his real home, and marked his primary affiliation for most of his life, especially after he thankfully left behind Shrewsbury to stand for the county in 1847. However, he maintained various residences at Town, and died at one he had only just taken on rental. |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 29, 2016 9:01:10 GMT
Apologies I stand corrected. Harold Wilson did live in the Colne Valley Division. Milnsbridge ward (i.e. Cowlersley) was absorbed into Hudds CB from March 1937. Special election on Tuesday 23rd March 1937 returned candidates from all three main parties. I don't know as I think the relevant question is whether they won or lost the constituency that contained their birthplace at the time of the election, not the constituency of the time of their birth. So I think from what you're saying Harold Wilson was born in the Colne Valley seat but by 1964 his birthplace was in Huddersfield West so that is the constituency we need to consider. Of the 10 elections fought in Huddersfield West between 1950 and 1979, Labour won all five when Harold Wilson was Labour leader and lost on the other five occasions |
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
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Post by cibwr on Mar 29, 2016 9:33:31 GMT
Disraeli would be a good one. Disraeli was born in Bloomsbury, and lived there for most of his youth, but, when Isaac d'Israeli moved to Bradenham in 1829, Buckinghamshire became the site of his real home, and marked his primary affiliation for most of his life, especially after he thankfully left behind Shrewsbury to stand for the county in 1847. However, he maintained various residences at Town, and died at one he had only just taken on rental. And drank in the Cow and Snuffers pub in Llandaff North (then known as Llandaff Yard)..... |
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