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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Mar 26, 2016 10:42:48 GMT
Appreciate the title isn't accurate but, inspired by a comment made by Khunanup, I note that Wikipedia has a list of United States presidents by place of birth and state of primary affiliation. Obvious with having changing constituencies and no primary system, it would be more subjective than the American version, but it would be interesting to see in particular who won an election but saw their home seat go to another party. I suspect we would need to split this into constituency of birth (and its modern counterpart), constituency raised in or identified with most strongly (and modern counterpart), and seat (s) elected in. So for example, were I elected from my current seat and became PM, mine would read: Manchester Davyhulme/Stretford and Urmston, Stretford and Urmston, Cheadle. I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd and finsobruce might have some interesting thoughts on this. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Mar 26, 2016 10:46:47 GMT
To start:
David Cameron.
Place of birth: Marylebone. Now Cities of London and Westminster, was St Marylebone (I suspect this is wrong, I'm not familiar with the boundaries here)
Place of "primary affiliation". Peasemore, Berkshire. Newbury then and now.
Seat: Witney
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Post by carlton43 on Mar 26, 2016 10:48:57 GMT
Mine would be Crewe (Crewe and Nantwich), Ashford, Ross, Skye and Lochaber. I claim the prize for the greatest geographical reach? I suppose there will be some bloody Shetlander to spoil it?
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Mar 26, 2016 10:50:10 GMT
Mine would be Crewe (Crewe and Nantwich), Ashford, Ross, Skye and Lochaber. I claim the prize for the greatest geographical reach? I suppose there will be some bloody Shetlander to spoil it? Actually makes (accidentally) for an interesting discussion in its own right then! Looks like I'm already challenging for smallest geographical reach... |
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Post by carlton43 on Mar 26, 2016 10:50:35 GMT
Disraeli would be a good one.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2016 10:53:42 GMT
A part of Marylebone is in Westminster North.
Of course if we were to adopt the American presidential system, we would probably be awarding college votes for candidates who won a plurality in each county. But then the county boundaries have changed as well.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2016 10:53:49 GMT
I suspect where you were born unlike in America purely represent your political affiliation. Maybe you would have to break down to a council ward level.
I find it interesting how the seats held by Prime Ministers so expected to be the safest in the UK, are won by opposition parties.
Glenrothes Gordon Browns won by the SNP
Finchley, abeit boundary changes being Maggie Thatchers seat being Labour 1997 to 2010
and even though Ed Miliband never lost the seat in an election when the votes from that area were counted for european and council elections he was being strongly contested by UKIP so couldn't gaurantee Labour sopport.
A list of those types of seats would interest me as well, if it is was possible to do both.
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mondialito
Labour
Everything is horribly, brutally possible.
Posts: 4,961 
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Post by mondialito on Mar 26, 2016 10:58:14 GMT
John Major winning Carshalton and losing all three Lambeth seats in 1992.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 11:16:26 GMT
Mine would be Crewe (Crewe and Nantwich), Ashford, Ross, Skye and Lochaber. I claim the prize for the greatest geographical reach? I suppose there will be some bloody Shetlander to spoil it? Actually makes (accidentally) for an interesting discussion in its own right then! Looks like I'm already challenging for smallest geographical reach... I think I would beat you there |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 11:19:06 GMT
As I mentioned on the other thread, it appears that Harold Wilson's birth place and where he largely grew up is actually in Colne Valley which was I think the only seat Labour lost in the 1966 landslide and one of a few lost also in 1974
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 11:22:52 GMT
Jim Callaghan was born in Portsmouth in 1912 when there was a single (but two member) Portsmouth constituency. In 1910 the two seats had been won by a Tory and a liberal unionist but as 1912 was the year the latter merged with the former it was two conservatives until the seat was split into three at the 1918 General Election. Callaghan didn't win an election of course , but becoming PM in 1976 was at time when Labour held one of the two Portsmouth constituences, Frank Judd holding on in Portsmouth North until 1979. I think that this included Copnor where Callaghan was born but I'm sure Khunanup will put me right if I've got that wrong.  carlton43 may be interested to know that Callaghan joined the Labour party while living in Maidstone. |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 11:27:23 GMT
: Manchester Davyhulme/Stretford and Urmston, Stretford and Urmston, Cheadle. I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd and finsobruce might have some interesting thoughts on this. I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd will think that there was never any such constituency as 'Manchester Davyhulme' |
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Post by timrollpickering on Mar 26, 2016 11:51:10 GMT
I suspect where you were born unlike in America purely represent your political affiliation. Maybe you would have to break down to a council ward level. I find it interesting how the seats held by Prime Ministers so expected to be the safest in the UK, are won by opposition parties. Glenrothes Gordon Browns won by the SNP Finchley, abeit boundary changes being Maggie Thatchers seat being Labour 1997 to 2010 and even though Ed Miliband never lost the seat in an election when the votes from that area were counted for european and council elections he was being strongly contested by UKIP so couldn't gaurantee Labour sopport. A list of those types of seats would interest me as well, if it is was possible to do both. I think the myth came about because John Major had such a huge majority in 1992. Gordon Brown stood down just as Scottish elections realigned and broke the dictionary and Thatcher was in a seat that demographically was on a slide against the party - IIRC she never had a five figure majority as PM. And sometimes the PM can be in a rather tight spot - I think Ramsay MacDonald in 1931 is the last time the PM of the day had a real fight. He's also the last former PM to lose his seat - by a majority on the SNP scale. There's also cases where the seat has stayed with the party but rather moved against a particular PM's part of it - e.g. Bexley & Sidcup is rather Eurosceptic these days. |
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 12:11:09 GMT
As I mentioned on the other thread, it appears that Harold Wilson's birth place and where he largely grew up is actually in Colne Valley which was I think the only seat Labour lost in the 1966 landslide and one of a few lost also in 1974 I've been trying to work this out. Wilson was born in Cowersley but is described as growing up in Milnsbridge. Milnsbridge ward was part of the Huddersfield West constituency which Labour gained in 1964, but I'm not sure if Cowersley was in the Milnsbridge ward... |
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Post by timrollpickering on Mar 26, 2016 12:15:28 GMT
I wonder how many British Prime Ministers have won an election but the constituency of their birth has gone to another party. At this level the place of birth reflects where the maternity hospital for many. It's not just an urban thing - a significant chunk of the population in eastern Wales is English born to lifelong Welsh residents. |
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 12:17:43 GMT
He didn't get to be PM of course but as Hugh Gaitskell was born in Kensington and lived in Hampstead when he was Labour leader, I don't think he ever lived in a Labour held seat.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 12:40:46 GMT
As I mentioned on the other thread, it appears that Harold Wilson's birth place and where he largely grew up is actually in Colne Valley which was I think the only seat Labour lost in the 1966 landslide and one of a few lost also in 1974 I've been trying to work this out. Wilson was born in Cowersley but is described as growing up in Milnsbridge. Milnsbridge ward was part of the Huddersfield West constituency which Labour gained in 1964, but I'm not sure if Cowersley was in the Milnsbridge ward... According to Wiki he 'Wilson was born at 4 Warneford Road'. That street is within the Golcar ward currently but looks like it may have been a closer run thing then when the boundaries were different which I'm trying to aascertain from lookinng at this www.visionofbritain.org.uk/maps/sheet/bc_reports_1900s/Yorkshire_West_Riding_1954 |
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Post by finsobruce on Mar 26, 2016 12:41:55 GMT
Neville Chamberlain was born in Edgbaston when it was a Liberal constituency and his father became its MP seven years later. He was first the MP for Ladywood (1918-29) and then moved to ....Edgbaston when almost beaten by Oswald Mosley.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Mar 26, 2016 12:55:12 GMT
: Manchester Davyhulme/Stretford and Urmston, Stretford and Urmston, Cheadle. I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd and finsobruce might have some interesting thoughts on this. I suspect that Davıd Boothroyd will think that there was never any such constituency as 'Manchester Davyhulme' I always make that mistake. The local party had a tendency to call it that and it's a bad habit that must have stuck with me. |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Mar 26, 2016 12:55:58 GMT
I wonder how many British Prime Ministers have won an election but the constituency of their birth has gone to another party. At this level the place of birth reflects where the maternity hospital for many. It's not just an urban thing - a significant chunk of the population in eastern Wales is English born to lifelong Welsh residents. Michael Portillo for example was born in Bushey as there was a maternity hospital there and his family actually lived in Harrow (similarly Mark Ramprakash). I was born at home which was about 100 yards from said maternity hospital |
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