Community Council By-election

[cibwr]

Old St Mellons Community Council, Cardiff

Tuesday 6th October 2015

Two candidates:

Denis Joseph Matthews - no description

Jade Smith - Liberal Democrat

[The Bishop]

This could have gone in the 7-8 October thread?

[Deleted]

Oct 6, 2015 10:05:42 GMT The Bishop said:

This could have gone in the 7-8 October thread?

much too high status to be merged with mere LA by-elections .....

[cibwr]

It could have, but I think there might be a value in separating out town/community/parish council elections from unitary/district/county council elections.

[middleenglander]

Result: No Description elected with 262 votes (81%), Liberal Democrat 63 (19%)

[Harry Hayfield]

Because of the fact that we have put our house on the market I have been investigating this and would like to confirm the following:

1) When a member of a community council causes a by-election, the onus is on the electorate to call for a by-election
2) If ten electors ask for a by-election, then a by-election is held up to two months later

[tonygreaves]

Same rules as for Parish Councils in England. Community Councils are Welsh parish councils.

[peterl]

14 working days for 10 electors to call a by election, otherwise the vacancy can be filled by co-option.

[J.G.Harston]

Oct 11, 2015 21:40:51 GMT peterl said:

14 working days for 10 electors to call a by election, otherwise the vacancy can be filled by co-option.

Can be, not must be. If no electors call a by-election in that 14-day window, and the council subsequently does not chose to co-opt, the vacancy remains until the next normal election and no by-election is callable. (cf my similar question on Whitby Town Council)

[froome]

Oct 11, 2015 23:04:06 GMT J.G.Harston said:

Oct 11, 2015 21:40:51 GMT peterl said:

14 working days for 10 electors to call a by election, otherwise the vacancy can be filled by co-option.

Can be, not must be. If no electors call a by-election in that 14-day window, and the council subsequently does not chose to co-opt, the vacancy remains until the next normal election and no by-election is callable. (cf my similar question on Whitby Town Council)

I never realised that. So this is also the case in England?

Second question - does a community council in Wales have exactly the same powers as a parish council in England, or are there subtle differences?

[J.G.Harston]

Oct 12, 2015 6:01:45 GMT froome said:

Oct 11, 2015 23:04:06 GMT J.G.Harston said:

Can be, not must be. If no electors call a by-election in that 14-day window, and the council subsequently does not chose to co-opt, the vacancy remains until the next normal election and no by-election is callable. (cf my similar question on Whitby Town Council)

I never realised that. So this is also the case in England?

Second question - does a community council in Wales have exactly the same powers as a parish council in England, or are there subtle differences?

Wiki says: "Welsh community councils are a direct replacement for earlier parish councils, under the Local Government Act 1972, and are identical to English parish councils in terms of their powers and the way they operate."

This confirms my previous working assumption, that Welsh community councils are just parish councils by another name.

[greatkingrat]

Community councils are devolved so there will be subtle differences, although I couldn't tell you what they are.

[peterl]

I'm fairly sure that (in England at least) if the vacancy is not then filled by co-option within a certain period (I think its 35 working days from the expiry of the 14), a by election can once again be called by 10 signatures.

[J.G.Harston]

Oct 12, 2015 22:29:10 GMT peterl said:

I'm fairly sure that (in England at least) if the vacancy is not then filled by co-option within a certain period (I think its 35 working days from the expiry of the 14), a by election can once again be called by 10 signatures.

It doesn't seem to be so. In this thread we got some clarification, which seemed to come to a conclusion that:
- there's a first period in which and only in which electors can call a by-election;
- if and only if no by-election has been called after the expiry of that period, there's a second period in which and only in which the council can chose to co-opt members
After the termination of those two periods nobody on the ground can fill the vacancy and it remains until the next normal election, unless the district council choses to impose a solution (call a by-election, appoint a member, conduct a governance review).

Admittedly, this doesn't "feel" right to me, and I'd be much happier with a nice concrete flowchart the explicitly set things down in concrete.

[Deleted]

One of the issues with vacancies & co-options is that it can affect the 'quality status' of a parish or town council.

Which is important as if you have quality status & a neighbourhood plan then 25% of CIL (s106) money is delegated, if not then only 15%.

So there can be dosh involved

[cibwr]

Oct 12, 2015 18:04:39 GMT greatkingrat said:

Community councils are devolved so there will be subtle differences, although I couldn't tell you what they are.

Not sure either, but since devolution there have been a number of acts and orders that have slightly changed things, so I'd be cautious about saying identical.

[froome]

Oct 12, 2015 22:45:28 GMT J.G.Harston said:

Oct 12, 2015 22:29:10 GMT peterl said:

I'm fairly sure that (in England at least) if the vacancy is not then filled by co-option within a certain period (I think its 35 working days from the expiry of the 14), a by election can once again be called by 10 signatures.

It doesn't seem to be so. In this thread we got some clarification, which seemed to come to a conclusion that:
- there's a first period in which and only in which electors can call a by-election;
- if and only if no by-election has been called after the expiry of that period, there's a second period in which and only in which the council can chose to co-opt members
After the termination of those two periods nobody on the ground can fill the vacancy and it remains until the next normal election, unless the district council choses to impose a solution (call a by-election, appoint a member, conduct a governance review).

Admittedly, this doesn't "feel" right to me, and I'd be much happier with a nice concrete flowchart the explicitly set things down in concrete.

Well I'm glad I asked the question now. Presumably somebody out there will know precisely what the rules are. Mr Boothroyd perhaps?

[Dan]

Oct 13, 2015 8:45:41 GMT @robin said:

One of the issues with vacancies & co-options is that it can affect the 'quality status' of a parish or town council.

Which is important as if you have quality status & a neighbourhood plan then 25% of CIL (s106) money is delegated, if not then only 15%.

So there can be dosh involved

Not quite the case. The new Local Council Award scheme requires that, to achieve 'Quality' or 'Quality Gold' standard, two-thirds of the council must be elected (either opposed or un-opposed). If the criteria is met at the time of the award, it lasts during the lifetime of the accreditation rather than being an on-going assessment.

[Deleted]

Oct 14, 2015 9:33:54 GMT Dan said:

Oct 13, 2015 8:45:41 GMT @robin said:

One of the issues with vacancies & co-options is that it can affect the 'quality status' of a parish or town council.

Which is important as if you have quality status & a neighbourhood plan then 25% of CIL (s106) money is delegated, if not then only 15%.

So there can be dosh involved

Not quite the case. The new Local Council Award scheme requires that, to achieve 'Quality' or 'Quality Gold' standard, two-thirds of the council must be elected (either opposed or un-opposed). If the criteria is met at the time of the award, it lasts during the lifetime of the accreditation rather than being an on-going assessment.

Interesting, thanks you.

The advice that I got, (as chair of my parish), was that 'if vacancies occur you may fill up to 2 by co-option before status is down graded'.