Canterbury

[batman]

Ah, I had thought you were describing her conduct as unacceptable. Thanks for clarification

[mboy]

There's no point pretending that Labour doesn't still have a serious problem here. Starmer won't want to upset the horses during an election though, he wants all the the student zealots who approve of this bullying to continue leafleting until July 4th, so I don't expect much from him. We might see Wes "sensible" Streeting make a comment though.

[Merseymike]

She shouldn't be a candidate. I hope she loses.

[mboy]

Sad to see doktorb🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍⚧️ liking a comment like that, but the Lib Dems are even further down that road of lunacy. Anyone who would rather have a Tory MP (who will definitely be harder on trans rights) there instead of a solid social democrat is putting tribal adherence to dogma above real outcomes - the mark of religious behaviour.

[Davıd Boothroyd]

The Labour manifesto pledges to "modernise, simplify, and reform the intrusive and outdated gender recognition law to a new process. We will remove indignities for trans people who deserve recognition and acceptance", and I expect the whips to ensure that all Labour MPs vote accordingly. Subject to obeying NEC guidance on behaviour and conduct, Labour MPs are free to have and express their own views about trans issues.

[Ron Swanson]

It is high time that society as a whole decided to call out and start to confront these odious head bangers - who won’t ever be placated. No amount of back sliding will ever be enough.

[Merseymike]

Jun 16, 2024 12:17:41 GMT Davıd Boothroyd said:

The Labour manifesto pledges to "modernise, simplify, and reform the intrusive and outdated gender recognition law to a new process. We will remove indignities for trans people who deserve recognition and acceptance", and I expect the whips to ensure that all Labour MPs vote accordingly. Subject to obeying NEC guidance on behaviour and conduct, Labour MPs are free to have and express their own views about trans issues.

Duffield seems so disaffected - I would not be surprised if she leaves Labour.

[batman]

She looked like doing so at times in the last parliament, but has not done so. However you may be proved right, it's possible.

[mboy]

Jun 16, 2024 10:49:11 GMT mboy said:

There's no point pretending that Labour doesn't still have a serious problem here. Starmer won't want to upset the horses during an election though, he wants all the the student zealots who approve of this bullying to continue leafleting until July 4th, so I don't expect much from him. We might see Wes "sensible" Streeting make a comment though.

Wow - Starmer just proved me wrong in spectacular style:

"Labour peer who branded candidate ‘frit or lazy’ loses whip"

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/06/17/labour-peer-rosie-duffield-frit-or-lazy-loses-whip/

[batman]

I'm not sure he or the relevant Party figures had much option. Unlike Lord Cashman, Rosie Duffield is an official Labour Party candidate whether Keir Starmer agrees with her or not on certain issues, and a candidate for a seat which cannot yet be deemed safe to boot. Even if Starmer agrees more with Cashman or Duffield on these issues, personal insults of this kind against official Labour candidates in a general election campaign are asking for trouble, and in this case receiving it. I am sure that he will get the Whip back in due course if he does not reoffend. But it is important that insults against official Party candidates of this kind are not tolerated, otherwise it's basically writing the opposition's leaflets for them.

[Sibboleth]

The whip in the Lords is not so important in any case because of the way the chamber works.

[Merseymike]

Jun 17, 2024 15:21:17 GMT batman said:

I'm not sure he or the relevant Party figures had much option. Unlike Lord Cashman, Rosie Duffield is an official Labour Party candidate whether Keir Starmer agrees with her or not on certain issues, and a candidate for a seat which cannot yet be deemed safe to boot. Even if Starmer agrees more with Cashman or Duffield on these issues, personal insults of this kind against official Labour candidates in a general election campaign are asking for trouble, and in this case receiving it. I am sure that he will get the Whip back in due course if he does not reoffend. But it is important that insults against official Party candidates of this kind are not tolerated, otherwise it's basically writing the opposition's leaflets for them.

Yes. Personally some of the issues (the dreadful Duffield) for Twitter is not acceptable. If Shaheen is not 'acceptable' then Duffield is far, far worse.

[maxque]

Jun 17, 2024 15:21:17 GMT batman said:

I'm not sure he or the relevant Party figures had much option. Unlike Lord Cashman, Rosie Duffield is an official Labour Party candidate whether Keir Starmer agrees with her or not on certain issues, and a candidate for a seat which cannot yet be deemed safe to boot. Even if Starmer agrees more with Cashman or Duffield on these issues, personal insults of this kind against official Labour candidates in a general election campaign are asking for trouble, and in this case receiving it. I am sure that he will get the Whip back in due course if he does not reoffend. But it is important that insults against official Party candidates of this kind are not tolerated, otherwise it's basically writing the opposition's leaflets for them.

However, this seat is a seat that is sure to be lost for Labour she in inevitably defects to the Party of Women  once Starmer gets sick of her blackmailing. The easier way would have been to drop her like Shaheen as she is a high-defection risk.

[michaelarden]

Jul 20, 2024 22:33:55 GMT maxque said:

Jun 17, 2024 15:21:17 GMT batman said:

I'm not sure he or the relevant Party figures had much option. Unlike Lord Cashman, Rosie Duffield is an official Labour Party candidate whether Keir Starmer agrees with her or not on certain issues, and a candidate for a seat which cannot yet be deemed safe to boot. Even if Starmer agrees more with Cashman or Duffield on these issues, personal insults of this kind against official Labour candidates in a general election campaign are asking for trouble, and in this case receiving it. I am sure that he will get the Whip back in due course if he does not reoffend. But it is important that insults against official Party candidates of this kind are not tolerated, otherwise it's basically writing the opposition's leaflets for them.

However, this seat is a seat that is sure to be lost for Labour she in inevitably defects to the Party of Women  once Starmer gets sick of her blackmailing. The easier way would have been to drop her like Shaheen as she is a high-defection risk.

She'll lose as a Labour MP possibly next time or the time after. Probably to the Greens who have moved in front of the Lib Dems. Canterbury is a good fit for them and with a base of 12+% (higher than 50% of their gains this time around) and Brighton safely transitioned to a new MP - it wouldn't be a bad target for them. 

[Devil Wincarnate]

How much longer will this seat survive in its current state? The council have just signed off 3,500 new homes for Whitstable alone, and its electorate is already very high.

[pl]

Jul 21, 2024 14:49:02 GMT Devil Wincarnate said:

How much longer will this seat survive in its current state? The council have just signed off 3,500 new homes for Whitstable alone, and its electorate is already very high.

The interesting thing is going to be the interplay of Labour's electoral and franchise reforms.

Depending on how auto voter registration works it may be that it massively boost registration of students, and people in metropolitan urban areas.

Votes at 16 would mean more London seats v the rest of the UK - with university cities likely to have less 16 year olds per constituency on average.

I'll have to try and work out all the numbers.

Of course, all bets are off if UK Labour follows the Scottish and Welsh examples and enfranchises all foreign nationals

[john07]

How do you define a ‘University City’?

Obviously the likes of Oxford, Cambridge, Durham, would certainly qualify as would St Andrews and Lampeter if they had City status.

The problem is that all large Cities and most small to medium ones have Universities. Many small to medium-sized towns have Universities. However, since the advent of the University Colleges in the 1930s and the upgrade of the Colleges of Advanced Technology and the New Universities in the 1960s this spread things even wider.

Post 1992, the upgrade of the Polytechnics and other Colleges has made the term University Cities almost meaningless. Do University constituencies behave very differently to others? Probably yes. But you could say much the same about constituencies with League football teams (one Conservative MP out of 92 teams). No one seems to talk about football constituencies.

Is Lincoln a University City? It certainly looks like one, yet this can only be traced back to 2002 when the University of Humberside was renamed after relocation from Hull. Even the University of Kent, largely based in Canterbury, was only founded in 1965.

[pl]

Jul 21, 2024 16:01:59 GMT john07 said:

How do you define a ‘University City’?

Obviously the likes of Oxford, Cambridge, Durham, would certainly qualify as would St Andrews and Lampeter if they had City status.

The problem is that all large Cities and most small to medium ones have Universities. Many small to medium-sized towns have Universities. However, since the advent of the University Colleges in the 1930s and the upgrade of the Colleges of Advanced Technology and the New Universities in the 1960s this spread things even wider.

Post 1992, the upgrade of the Polytechnics and other Colleges has made the term University Cities almost meaningless. Do University constituencies behave very differently to others? Probably yes. But you could say much the same about constituencies with League football teams (one Conservative MP out of 92 teams). No one seems to talk about football constituencies.

Is Lincoln a University City? It certainly looks like one, yet this can only be traced back to 2002 when the University of Humberside was renamed after relocation from Hull. Even the University of Kent, largely based in Canterbury, was only founded in 1965.

Indeed. You are quite right.

Maybe better if I say "constituencies with a high proportion of the electorate studying at a university, who are not resident at their parents' home address".

The location of halls and residential areas popular with students is of course more important than the location of the university itself in cities with universities that are divided into more than one constituency.

[islington]

Jul 21, 2024 16:01:59 GMT john07 said:

How do you define a ‘University City’?

Obviously the likes of Oxford, Cambridge, Durham, would certainly qualify as would St Andrews and Lampeter if they had City status.

The problem is that all large Cities and most small to medium ones have Universities. Many small to medium-sized towns have Universities. However, since the advent of the University Colleges in the 1930s and the upgrade of the Colleges of Advanced Technology and the New Universities in the 1960s this spread things even wider.

Post 1992, the upgrade of the Polytechnics and other Colleges has made the term University Cities almost meaningless. Do University constituencies behave very differently to others? Probably yes. But you could say much the same about constituencies with League football teams (one Conservative MP out of 92 teams). No one seems to talk about football constituencies.

Is Lincoln a University City? It certainly looks like one, yet this can only be traced back to 2002 when the University of Humberside was renamed after relocation from Hull. Even the University of Kent, largely based in Canterbury, was only founded in 1965.

York, for instance, very much has the feel of a university city although it became one only as recently as 1963.

Compare Glasgow University, founded 1451; yet Glasgow would not spring to most people's minds as a 'university city'.

[Merseymike]

Jul 21, 2024 16:34:23 GMT islington said:

Jul 21, 2024 16:01:59 GMT john07 said:

How do you define a ‘University City’?

Obviously the likes of Oxford, Cambridge, Durham, would certainly qualify as would St Andrews and Lampeter if they had City status.

The problem is that all large Cities and most small to medium ones have Universities. Many small to medium-sized towns have Universities. However, since the advent of the University Colleges in the 1930s and the upgrade of the Colleges of Advanced Technology and the New Universities in the 1960s this spread things even wider.

Post 1992, the upgrade of the Polytechnics and other Colleges has made the term University Cities almost meaningless. Do University constituencies behave very differently to others? Probably yes. But you could say much the same about constituencies with League football teams (one Conservative MP out of 92 teams). No one seems to talk about football constituencies.

Is Lincoln a University City? It certainly looks like one, yet this can only be traced back to 2002 when the University of Humberside was renamed after relocation from Hull. Even the University of Kent, largely based in Canterbury, was only founded in 1965.

York, for instance, very much has the feel of a university city although it became one only as recently as 1963.

Compare Glasgow University, founded 1451; yet Glasgow would not spring to most people's minds as a 'university city'.

Yes, Lancaster is also similar - the 'plate-glass' universities.
University of East Anglia (1963) - Norwich
University of Essex (1964/5) - Colchester
University of Kent at Canterbury (now known as the University of Kent) (1965) - Canterbury
University of Lancaster (now known as Lancaster University) (1964) - Lancaster
University of Sussex (1961) - Brighton
University of Warwick (1965) - Coventry
University of York (1963) - York