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Post by LDCaerdydd on Apr 24, 2024 9:22:56 GMT
In what way was Blackpool a suitable Conference venue back in the 60s/70s /80s in a way that it has ceased to be? At one time Scarborough was also regularly chosen - but appears to have been dropped even further back than Blackpool /Brighton. In the 60s/70s/80s conferences were largely platform based, with very little beyond the main hall and only one item at a time occurring and crucially with very few external attendees. In terms of the main event a quick Google says the Winter Gardens auditorium has a capacity of 7,000. Manchester Central and Liverpool ICC both have seating for 11,000 The move from coastal resorts to cities allows larger conferences in more vibrant surroundings (bars, restaurants etc as well as a wider set of accommodation options). Back to Blackpool, another major problem it has of course is it is somewhat geographically isolated. |
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Post by batman on Apr 24, 2024 9:49:36 GMT
In what way was Blackpool a suitable Conference venue back in the 60s/70s /80s in a way that it has ceased to be? At one time Scarborough was also regularly chosen - but appears to have been dropped even further back than Blackpool /Brighton. I went there for Spring Conference in 2000 (the Party's centenary year) and National Conference in 2002. In the latter year I stayed at a hotel on the Party's list. I still remember the breakfast with horror. I couldn't face another one even though it was included in the price & resolved to go out to a café to breakfast every morning. Only trouble with that was that (don't know if this is still true) greasy spoons actually don't seem to open at breakfast time in Blackpool. I said to myself that if I ever returned to Conference at Blackpool I'd stay in St Annes & travel in, but as above Labour decided not to have further conferences there as basically almost nobody enjoyed them. And as it happens Labour conferences in Blackpool have tended historically to be unhappier than those held in Brighton, which in any case is a far better place. Visits to nice pubs in towns & villages within reach of Blackpool made things a little more bearable. |
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Post by timrollpickering on Apr 24, 2024 9:51:06 GMT
The move from coastal resorts to cities allows larger conferences in more vibrant surroundings (bars, restaurants etc as well as a wider set of accommodation options). I think the accommodation claim is questionable - most of the complaints about moving away from the seaside tend to include the cost of accommodation but also the distance (if you don't get lucky in the early scramble) that makes it harder to nip back to hotels for mid afternoon rests or get changed for fancier evenings. It's also harder to sort things out if you arrive and find your hotel went bust without telling you (or the third party booking site) when the alternatives are so much further away. |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Apr 24, 2024 10:09:24 GMT
I can see what your saying, but whilst hotels in Birmingham, Manchester etc are typically more expensive than Blackpool, there are because you’re in a big city more of them, plus better transport links should your chosen hotel be 2-3 miles/30-40 mins out.
As society has moved on and typically (although not exclusively) we’d much rather staying in a Hilton/Travelodge etc then Mrs Smith’s B&B.
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graham
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Post by graham on Apr 24, 2024 10:17:25 GMT
In what way was Blackpool a suitable Conference venue back in the 60s/70s /80s in a way that it has ceased to be? At one time Scarborough was also regularly chosen - but appears to have been dropped even further back than Blackpool /Brighton. I went there for Spring Conference in 2000 (the Party's centenary year) and National Conference in 2002. In the latter year I stayed at a hotel on the Party's list. I still remember the breakfast with horror. I couldn't face another one even though it was included in the price & resolved to go out to a café to breakfast every morning. Only trouble with that was that (don't know if this is still true) greasy spoons actually don't seem to open at breakfast time in Blackpool. I said to myself that if I ever returned to Conference at Blackpool I'd stay in St Annes & travel in, but as above Labour decided not to have further conferences there as basically almost nobody enjoyed them. And as it happens Labour conferences in Blackpool have tended historically to be unhappier than those held in Brighton, which in any case is a far better place. Visits to nice pubs in towns & villages within reach of Blackpool made things a little more bearable. Whatever happened to Scarborough which for many years was a popular venue? Wilson's 1963 Conference speech re-the white hot heat of technology' took place there. |
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graham
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Post by graham on Apr 24, 2024 10:23:57 GMT
In what way was Blackpool a suitable Conference venue back in the 60s/70s /80s in a way that it has ceased to be? At one time Scarborough was also regularly chosen - but appears to have been dropped even further back than Blackpool /Brighton. In the 60s/70s/80s conferences were largely platform based, with very little beyond the main hall and only one item at a time occurring and crucially with very few external attendees. In terms of the main event a quick Google says the Winter Gardens auditorium has a capacity of 7,000. Manchester Central and Liverpool ICC both have seating for 11,000 The move from coastal resorts to cities allows larger conferences in more vibrant surroundings (bars, restaurants etc as well as a wider set of accommodation options). Back to Blackpool, another major problem it has of course is it is somewhat geographically isolated. But the Conference events were a fair bit more meaningful in those earlier decades. Nowadays they have become largely PR events which pass by the public at large. I don't believe the Broadcasters cover their debates live on a day to day basis in the way that was true back in the 60s/70s/80s. Why not get rid of the fringe events and return to the former format which attracted far more public attention? |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Apr 24, 2024 10:33:48 GMT
Why not get rid of the fringe events and return to the former format which attracted far more public attention? Not for the first time on this forum are you fondly looking back to a bygone age. To answer your final point, scraping fringes and making the conference soley about main hall speeches/debates won’t focus the media/publics attention. In fact the opposite is likely to be true, if you reduce the size of the conference you will in all likelyhood reduce the appeal of them to party members and the fewer people who turn up the less interest the media will pay and thus the less the public will see of them. |
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 24, 2024 10:58:45 GMT
This by the same nepo toff that wrote the article about the marsh farm estate in Luton. Does he get off on dramatised poverty. It’s highly unedifying shit journalism. The truth always hurts. But it is the truth. |
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 24, 2024 11:03:48 GMT
In what way was Blackpool a suitable Conference venue back in the 60s/70s /80s in a way that it has ceased to be? At one time Scarborough was also regularly chosen - but appears to have been dropped even further back than Blackpool /Brighton. In the 60s/70s/80s conferences were largely platform based, with very little beyond the main hall and only one item at a time occurring and crucially with very few external attendees. In terms of the main event a quick Google says the Winter Gardens auditorium has a capacity of 7,000. Manchester Central and Liverpool ICC both have seating for 11,000 The move from coastal resorts to cities allows larger conferences in more vibrant surroundings (bars, restaurants etc as well as a wider set of accommodation options). Back to Blackpool, another major problem it has of course is it is somewhat geographically isolated. Whenever I hear that word 'vibrant' used in that context I reach for my metal baseball bat. |
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graham
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Post by graham on Apr 24, 2024 11:07:09 GMT
Why not get rid of the fringe events and return to the former format which attracted far more public attention? Not for the first time on this forum are you fondly looking back to a bygone age. To answer your final point, scraping fringes and making the conference soley about main hall speeches/debates won’t focus the media/publics attention. In fact the opposite is likely to be true, if you reduce the size of the conference you will in all likelyhood reduce the appeal of them to party members and the fewer people who turn up the less interest the media will pay and thus the less the public will see of them. But the general public tends to ignore these gatherings now in a way that was not true back in the days of Wilson/Heath/Grimond/Macmillan/ Callaghan/Thatcher /Steel. Were the fringe events returned to the lower prominence formerly given them public attention on big debates in the main hall might recover.
Labour conferences - in particular - have become far more boring with no major clashes between the conference floor and the leadership of great significance. The Blair years had much to do this with the emphasis on 'being on message' and a general prevalence of control freakery. I also feel it was a big mistake for all the parties to shift from the former practice of the Leadership - whether the NEC or National Union - sitting on the platform throughout the conference as the debates took place. Nowadays it somehow looks much more contrived and false - and fails to impress.
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Apr 24, 2024 11:47:02 GMT
Whenever I hear that word 'vibrant' used in that context I reach for my metal baseball bat. Same when I hear boomers talk :-) |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
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Post by The Bishop on Apr 24, 2024 11:50:28 GMT
It may be unfair (though its not really) but anything the former RCP claque come out with can be automatically disregarded, including the weather and time of day. Kenan Malik? I have cited him myself as an exception before now, but there are few better instances of such a thing proving the rule as this one  |
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 24, 2024 11:57:57 GMT
Whenever I hear that word 'vibrant' used in that context I reach for my metal baseball bat. Same when I hear boomers talk :-) My remark was jocular, abstract and impersonal. Your rejoinder is nasty, personal and very broad. I don't really know what purpose is served by those silly phrases like boomers or generation X and frankly I don't want to know and have no interest the whole daft confection. I am pretty sure that whatever a boomer is I am not one, so it doesn't apply to me anyway. |
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Post by Merseymike on Apr 24, 2024 12:12:16 GMT
I have cited him myself as an exception before now, but there are few better instances of such a thing proving the rule as this one Not completely Spiked, but for me, seems very similar... |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
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Post by Chris from Brum on Apr 24, 2024 12:42:17 GMT
it does have a rather good symphony orchestra but the pubs are below average for a major English town Although the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra performs mainly in a venue called The Lighthouse in *Poole*. |
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Post by philvn on Apr 24, 2024 15:29:47 GMT
I went there for Spring Conference in 2000 (the Party's centenary year) and National Conference in 2002. In the latter year I stayed at a hotel on the Party's list. I still remember the breakfast with horror. I couldn't face another one even though it was included in the price & resolved to go out to a café to breakfast every morning. Only trouble with that was that (don't know if this is still true) greasy spoons actually don't seem to open at breakfast time in Blackpool. I said to myself that if I ever returned to Conference at Blackpool I'd stay in St Annes & travel in, but as above Labour decided not to have further conferences there as basically almost nobody enjoyed them. And as it happens Labour conferences in Blackpool have tended historically to be unhappier than those held in Brighton, which in any case is a far better place. Visits to nice pubs in towns & villages within reach of Blackpool made things a little more bearable. Whatever happened to Scarborough which for many years was a popular venue? Wilson's 1963 Conference speech re-the white hot heat of technology' took place there. There were even a couple of Labour Conferences in Southport in the distant past, and I know the Lib Dems and UKIP have had ones there not too long ago. It does have the second-longest pier in the UK haha (currently closed because the council can't afford repairs). |
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Post by timrollpickering on Apr 24, 2024 15:37:27 GMT
I can see what your saying, but whilst hotels in Birmingham, Manchester etc are typically more expensive than Blackpool, there are because you’re in a big city more of them, plus better transport links should your chosen hotel be 2-3 miles/30-40 mins out. The problem is a lot of hotels are not well advertised by bus route to conference centres plus public transport isn't always running late at night (and many visitors to places they don't know well don't trust the bus systems because they have no idea if they'll find themselves stuck somewhere with no bus that actually turns up accepting their return or all day ticket). Even with easy to use transport links and/or cabs it's still much better to have affordable accommodation within walking distance of the conference centre. |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Apr 24, 2024 15:43:24 GMT
Even with easy to use transport links and/or cabs it's still much better to have affordable accommodation within walking distance of the conference centre. Even if it’s a dingy B&B that hasn’t seen a lick of paint this century? |
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Post by timrollpickering on Apr 24, 2024 15:45:02 GMT
But the general public tends to ignore these gatherings now in a way that was not true back in the days of Wilson/Heath/Grimond/Macmillan/ Callaghan/Thatcher /Steel. Were the fringe events returned to the lower prominence formerly given them public attention on big debates in the main hall might recover. What big debates in the main hall? The Conservative party conference doesn't have those anymore. Now it's either speeches by big names or panels of other names. The Lib Dems still have dreary debates about resolutions by attendees that their leaders often have to spend time distancing the party offer from but they're not exactly ratings hits even when BBC Parliament shows them. It was a bit confrontational and could also look add when individuals on the platform had wildly different reactions to speeches. Even the NUS have ditched the desk format (though they've also changed the basis of their leadership team from my day) and they were in Blackpool last week: |
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Post by timrollpickering on Apr 24, 2024 15:47:11 GMT
Even with easy to use transport links and/or cabs it's still much better to have affordable accommodation within walking distance of the conference centre. Even if it’s a dingy B&B that hasn’t seen a lick of paint this century? If it's somewhere to sleep and get changed that's good enough for many an attendee. And you should see some of the hotel rooms in Birmingham and Manchester I've been in... |
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