weld
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Post by weld on Sept 1, 2023 3:56:55 GMT
What if McDonnell got enough backers to challenge for the Labour leadership?
I’m assuming Brown wins handily but is a bit bruised by the campaign and debates.
In September 2007, it is announced that Gordon Brown beat John McDonnell to secure the leadership of his party.
Brown swats away any suggestions of a snap election saying that the British people had given Labour a clear mandate to govern, that his party had put their trust in his vision for a fairer Britain, and that his priority was running the country.
Still, the left smell blood in the water. The MPs who nominated McDonnell represent a big group that Brown cannot ignore so easily.
McDonnell pledges to support Brown but refuses to engage in media speculation about a cabinet post, saying that his job is to represent the people of Hayes & Harlington.
Brown commits that he will not lead Labour in the election after 2010.
Lynton Crosby wastes little time using McDonnell’s attacks on Brown to paint Brown as a grumpy old bugger and incapable of taking the UK into the 2010s.
In September 2008, The Sun runs the headline ‘Labour’s Lost It’ committing to endorsing David Cameron’s Conservatives in 2010.
As a lame duck PM, Brown suffers multiple defeats in the Commons and Labour lose the formerly safe seats of Glenrothes and Glasgow East to the SNP in by-elections. Alex Salmond, celebrating his party’s wins in these Labour ‘heartlands’ calls for an immediate referendum on Scottish independence and suggests that if Labour can’t give the people of Scotland a say on their future, then Brown must go.
After a stunning defeat in Glasgow North East in 2009, Brown commits to a referendum after the next Scottish election and to work “with an open mind” to accelerate devolution, claiming to be the most pro-devolution politician in British history. He claims full credit for the 1997 referendums and pledges to “go big and go bold” on ‘devo max’.
In 2010, the Conservatives scrape an overall majority and Brown says it’s time for a new captain to steer the Labour ship to ensure an equitable economic recovery for the years ahead.
McDonnell runs again, and does respectably, and Ed Miliband commends him for a spirited campaign and his unwavering commitment to public service.
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Post by Daft H'a'porth A'peth A'pith on Sept 1, 2023 7:04:20 GMT
2007 was before the 2008 crash, there was no appetite for such a bruising debate and any leadership ballot would have been a huge landslide for Brown, no after taste nothing.
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weld
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Post by weld on Sept 1, 2023 7:17:00 GMT
2007 was before the 2008 crash, there was no appetite for such a bruising debate and any leadership ballot would have been a huge landslide for Brown, no after taste nothing.
I’m not sure tbh. What about the Iraq War hangover? |
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Post by Daft H'a'porth A'peth A'pith on Sept 1, 2023 7:33:42 GMT
2007 was before the 2008 crash, there was no appetite for such a bruising debate and any leadership ballot would have been a huge landslide for Brown, no after taste nothing.
I’m not sure tbh. What about the Iraq War hangover?
History has made that out to be bigger than it was.
Plus Labour was the government party, therefore it was acting more grown up than it usually does after losing power.
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Sept 1, 2023 8:30:08 GMT
You think Brown would say this straight away/sometime between Spet '07 and Dec '07? Why would he do that having only just become leader having been after it for so long?
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weld
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Post by weld on Sept 1, 2023 8:33:00 GMT
You think Brown would say this straight away/sometime between Spet '07 and Dec '07? Why would he do that having only just become leader having been after it for so long? Possibly to placate the MPs who’d backed McDonnell, or after the onset of the credit crunch in September 2008. |
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Post by LDCaerdydd on Sept 1, 2023 8:56:29 GMT
Even if if what happened in 2015 happened in 2007 and Labour moderates lent McDonnell their nomination*, McDonnell scrapes on the ballot, Brown would have thumped him in party wide vote, worst case scenario for Brown is that he gets around 75% of the vote.
But back to the MPs, the 29 who nominated McDonnell didn't cause Brown any major problems so why would the extra 16 who were backing Brown but wanted a contest cause problems for him? I'm sorry I just don't follow your train of thought here.
* Its also worth remembering at this point that not everyone who originally nominated Michael Meacher agreed to nominate McDonnell.
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 36,636
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Post by The Bishop on Sept 1, 2023 9:40:42 GMT
McDonnell wouldn't have won or even got that close, the time wasn't yet right for his sort of politics. But he might have done more "respectably" than some in the bubble would have expected - a score of 30-35% is IMO quite plausible. Of some interest here is that Brown later admitted it had been a mistake to have an uncontested election in 2007*, and having to campaign for votes might have benefited him in the longer term.
(*I wonder if May has said anything similar about 2016)
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sirbenjamin
IFP
True fame is reading your name written in graffiti, but without the words 'is a wanker' after it.
Posts: 4,979
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Post by sirbenjamin on Sept 1, 2023 13:34:11 GMT
Does McDonnell get any high profile backers from other wings of the party? Or someone who just didn't particularly get on with Gordon?
A Prescott or Harman or Kelly?
Does Ken Livingstone still have enough influence at this point to make a difference? He's still mayor after all.
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Post by finsobruce on Sept 1, 2023 15:26:20 GMT
Does McDonnell get any high profile backers from other wings of the party? Or someone who just didn't particularly get on with Gordon? A Prescott or Harman or Kelly? Does Ken Livingstone still have enough influence at this point to make a difference? He's still mayor after all. You seem to be forgetting the McDonnell's gift for friendship and comradelieness is somewhere south of Brown's.
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sirbenjamin
IFP
True fame is reading your name written in graffiti, but without the words 'is a wanker' after it.
Posts: 4,979
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Post by sirbenjamin on Sept 1, 2023 15:28:08 GMT
Does McDonnell get any high profile backers from other wings of the party? Or someone who just didn't particularly get on with Gordon? A Prescott or Harman or Kelly? Does Ken Livingstone still have enough influence at this point to make a difference? He's still mayor after all. You seem to be forgetting the McDonnell's gift for friendship and comradelieness is somewhere south of Brown's.
Yeah. I wish he wouldn't keep showing off about how he has slightly more friends than I do. Cunt. |
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Post by finsobruce on Sept 1, 2023 16:11:53 GMT
You seem to be forgetting the McDonnell's gift for friendship and comradelieness is somewhere south of Brown's.
Yeah. I wish he wouldn't keep showing off about how he has slightly more friends than I do. Cunt. Indeed - but it's always tempting to go for the easy win.   |
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 1, 2023 18:29:06 GMT
There was a surprise in the Deputy leadership election when Jon Cruddas topped the poll in the first round on an anti Iraq war wave. Crowded field tho and Jon was perhaps more well liked
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Post by eastmidlandsright on Sept 1, 2023 20:17:42 GMT
You think Brown would say this straight away/sometime between Spet '07 and Dec '07? Why would he do that having only just become leader having been after it for so long? Possibly to placate the MPs who’d backed McDonnell, or after the onset of the credit crunch in September 2008. No chance at all. Brown didn't spend his entire life seeking to become PM just to make himself a lame duck on achieving office. When he became PM he would have certainly aspired to the best part of a decade in office. |
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 1, 2023 20:43:30 GMT
Even if if what happened in 2015 happened in 2007 and Labour moderates lent McDonnell their nomination*, McDonnell scrapes on the ballot, Brown would have thumped him in party wide vote, worst case scenario for Brown is that he gets around 75% of the vote. But back to the MPs, the 29 who nominated McDonnell didn't cause Brown any major problems so why would the extra 16 who were backing Brown but wanted a contest cause problems for him? I'm sorry I just don't follow your train of thought here. * Its also worth remembering at this point that not everyone who originally nominated Michael Meacher agreed to nominate McDonnell. I've heard that but never seen a lust of people who supported Meacher |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Sept 1, 2023 20:49:12 GMT
Even if if what happened in 2015 happened in 2007 and Labour moderates lent McDonnell their nomination*, McDonnell scrapes on the ballot, Brown would have thumped him in party wide vote, worst case scenario for Brown is that he gets around 75% of the vote. But back to the MPs, the 29 who nominated McDonnell didn't cause Brown any major problems so why would the extra 16 who were backing Brown but wanted a contest cause problems for him? I'm sorry I just don't follow your train of thought here. * Its also worth remembering at this point that not everyone who originally nominated Michael Meacher agreed to nominate McDonnell. I've heard that but never seen a lust of people who supported Meacher |
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Post by mattbewilson on Sept 1, 2023 20:56:35 GMT
thank you. I can't see all 21 here but more than I've seen before. A better question might be if McDonell backers switched to Meacher.. |
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Post by finsobruce on Sept 1, 2023 21:42:37 GMT
Even if if what happened in 2015 happened in 2007 and Labour moderates lent McDonnell their nomination*, McDonnell scrapes on the ballot, Brown would have thumped him in party wide vote, worst case scenario for Brown is that he gets around 75% of the vote. But back to the MPs, the 29 who nominated McDonnell didn't cause Brown any major problems so why would the extra 16 who were backing Brown but wanted a contest cause problems for him? I'm sorry I just don't follow your train of thought here. * Its also worth remembering at this point that not everyone who originally nominated Michael Meacher agreed to nominate McDonnell. I've heard that but never seen a lust of people who supported Meacher An interesting collective noun. |
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