The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 25, 2022 10:38:53 GMT
Some of these "good" Tory results involved them slipping back from their 2019 position, so I wouldn't get too carried away. Holding that Castle Point seat was decent though.
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Post by batman on Feb 25, 2022 10:41:46 GMT
These results represent the equivalent of a very fine late season win by a tired Conservative team with a long injury list digging in and refusing to go down despite adversity low expectations and some unruly behaviour on various other pitches. Not desperate defences but far from many dire predictions made. They may have turned a corner as the absurd hoo-hah over parties and Covid recede from the general consciousness and East Europe concentrates minds. Johnson has had one of the more difficult periods of any PM post war. And yet they can still get out the vote and hold much of their core. Labour should be doing far far better at this stage of the cycle and I attribute their failure to the utter madness of the PLP smoothing the way for a Corbyn leadership. the only utter madness is your last phrase. Corbyn isn't even eligible to stand for the leadership let alone win it, and his refusal to sign the Stop the War Coalition letter makes his readmission even less likely. What a steaming pile of horse-dung your comment is. Holding safe wards in their very strongest part of the country is hardly surprising for the Conservatives. Labour did somewhat underperform in Spelthorne; but an underperformance (still a win despite that) in a safe Conservative constituency will be less of a worry for Labour than one would be in a target seat. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 25, 2022 10:47:44 GMT
The bottom line is that in the last few weeks byelections, Labour have won all the seats they might be expected to win.
That hasn't always been the case - indeed, wasn't just earlier this year.
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carlton43
Reform Party
Posts: 50,887 
Member is Online
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Post by carlton43 on Feb 25, 2022 10:49:18 GMT
These results represent the equivalent of a very fine late season win by a tired Conservative team with a long injury list digging in and refusing to go down despite adversity low expectations and some unruly behaviour on various other pitches. Not desperate defences but far from many dire predictions made. They may have turned a corner as the absurd hoo-hah over parties and Covid recede from the general consciousness and East Europe concentrates minds. Johnson has had one of the more difficult periods of any PM post war. And yet they can still get out the vote and hold much of their core. Labour should be doing far far better at this stage of the cycle and I attribute their failure to the utter madness of the PLP smoothing the way for a Corbyn leadership. the only utter madness is your last phrase. Corbyn isn't even eligible to stand for the leadership let alone win it, and his refusal to sign the Stop the War Coalition letter makes his readmission even less likely. What a steaming pile of horse-dung your comment is. Holding safe wards in their very strongest part of the country is hardly surprising for the Conservatives. Labour did somewhat underperform in Spelthorne; but an underperformance (still a win despite that) in a safe Conservative constituency will be less of a worry for Labour than one would be in a target seat. As has been a constant feature of your posting history, you quite wonderfully miss every point. It quite refreshes me to read your posts from time to time. It is like watching a film by The Three Stooges. May I enquire if you are a footballer? If so, what is your record of own goals? |
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Post by jamesdoyle on Feb 25, 2022 11:21:50 GMT
GWBWI (23-24/2/22)
Lab +89
Grn +49
LDm +43
Con -33
The Con result might seem odd given that they won 5 of 7, but they had significant losses in vote share in several defences, and in 4 defences the ward history was so solid that winning barely moved the needle.
Lab figure is built on good scores in Spelthorne and Durham.
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Post by matureleft on Feb 25, 2022 11:25:07 GMT
Well Arsenal have managed some revival (appearing to coincide with the disciplinary approach to Aubameyang). I'm much less tribal and more "pragmatic" than you and so don't share as much of the angst that comes from political disappointment (and, as a player on the field for 25 years in various positions developed a fairly philosophical view of both events and people). A contractor here concerning my long-drawn-out building project wondered this morning how I got my patience and calm.... Well spoken. You are a beacon of light and wisdom in your team, and as I say that I realize the profound harm I may be doing to you in team terms. Much respect your posts. Wish I had your approach but we are as we are with the hard wired position in place at birth so it seems? I've not noted that. Anyway I've always ploughed my own furrow and have paid relatively little regard for how that plays out in intra-party terms. That wasn't an advantageous approach (!) in my active political life but that part of me is "hard wired". Now I'm retired... But I always drew a line at taking steps or making statements that would harm the party - there needs to be an effective centre-left party here and some self-discipline is needed to maintain that. |
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Post by batman on Feb 25, 2022 12:34:34 GMT
the only utter madness is your last phrase. Corbyn isn't even eligible to stand for the leadership let alone win it, and his refusal to sign the Stop the War Coalition letter makes his readmission even less likely. What a steaming pile of horse-dung your comment is. Holding safe wards in their very strongest part of the country is hardly surprising for the Conservatives. Labour did somewhat underperform in Spelthorne; but an underperformance (still a win despite that) in a safe Conservative constituency will be less of a worry for Labour than one would be in a target seat. As has been a constant feature of your posting history, you quite wonderfully miss every point. It quite refreshes me to read your posts from time to time. It is like watching a film by The Three Stooges. May I enquire if you are a footballer? If so, what is your record of own goals? a ) I disagree with you but have not missed the point. I have merely refuted you. b ) no, I'm a cricketer not a footballer |
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Post by listener on Feb 25, 2022 13:22:57 GMT
Middle Englander shows the political composition of Maldon above as 17 Independent, 14 Conservative - but the situation is not quite that simple.
There have been a number of disputes and splits and the composition is better described as 12 Independent Group, 11 Conservative, 8 Non-aligned - a council under no overall control.
The Independent Group includes Richard Siddall, who was elected as a Conservative.
The 8 Non-aligned councillors are 3 Conservatives (Bob Boyce, Michael Helm and Richard Bewick) and 5 Independents (Wendy Stamp, Chrisy Morris, Stephen Nunn, Kevin Lagan and Adrian Fluker). Adrian Fluker was elected in 2019 as a Conservative.
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Post by middleenglander on Feb 25, 2022 13:43:57 GMT
Middle Englander shows the political composition of Maldon above as 17 Independent, 14 Conservative - but the situation is not quite that simple. There have been a number of disputes and splits and the composition is better described as 12 Independent Group, 11 Conservative, 8 Non-aligned - a council under no overall control. The Independent Group includes Richard Siddall, who was elected as a Conservative. The 8 Non-aligned councillors are 3 Conservatives (Bob Boyce, Michael Helm and Richard Bewick) and 5 Independents (Wendy Stamp, Chrisy Morris, Stephen Nunn, Kevin Lagan and Adrian Fluker). Adrian Fluker was elected in 2019 as a Conservative. The Maldon Council website as of a couple of minutes ago shows the position as I wrote last night following the result of the by-election. It may be the system they use is not sufficiently flexible to reflect all the nuances or the situation is so fluid it changes by hour. |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Feb 25, 2022 14:10:22 GMT
Middle Englander shows the political composition of Maldon above as 17 Independent, 14 Conservative - but the situation is not quite that simple. There have been a number of disputes and splits and the composition is better described as 12 Independent Group, 11 Conservative, 8 Non-aligned - a council under no overall control. The Independent Group includes Richard Siddall, who was elected as a Conservative. The 8 Non-aligned councillors are 3 Conservatives (Bob Boyce, Michael Helm and Richard Bewick) and 5 Independents (Wendy Stamp, Chrisy Morris, Stephen Nunn, Kevin Lagan and Adrian Fluker). Adrian Fluker was elected in 2019 as a Conservative. The Maldon Council website as of a couple of minutes ago shows the position as I wrote last night following the result of the by-election. It may be the system they use is not sufficiently flexible to reflect all the nuances or the situation is so fluid it changes by hour. The situation on Maldon has changed so much since the election that they have used the flexibility in the moderngov site to make a distinction between 'Political Party' and 'Political Grouping'. The relevant one is 'Political Grouping'. |
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Post by listener on Feb 25, 2022 14:51:14 GMT
Agreed, David
Since I last looked at the Maldon website a couple of weeks ago, it appears that Vanessa Bell has withdrawn from the Independent Group and is now unaligned - so the political make-up is now Conservative Group 11, Independent Group 11, Unaligned 9 (Independent 6, Con 3).
The Leader and Deputy Leader are from the Conservative Group and the Independent Group forms the opposition. The Chairman and Vice-Chairman are currently both from the Independent Group. The Leader of the Opposition is Richard Siddall, who was elected as a Conservative in 2019, but now sits in the Independent Group.
Confusing, or what?
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Feb 25, 2022 15:11:36 GMT
But it gets better. Remember that former leader Wendy Stamp (Independent) resigned in November over continuous criticism and that the council then made several unsuccessful attempts to hold meetings which were frustrated by disruption. The current leader was not elected until 18 January, when the minutes record that she won by 15-13. |
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Tony Otim
Green
Suffering from Brexistential Despair
Posts: 11,892
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Post by Tony Otim on Feb 25, 2022 15:23:59 GMT
Agreed, David Since I last looked at the Maldon website a couple of weeks ago, it appears that Vanessa Bell has withdrawn from the Independent Group and is now unaligned - so the political make-up is now Conservative Group 11, Independent Group 11, Unaligned 9 (Independent 6, Con 3). The Leader and Deputy Leader are from the Conservative Group and the Independent Group forms the opposition. The Chairman and Vice-Chairman are currently both from the Independent Group. The Leader of the Opposition is Richard Siddall, who was elected as a Conservative in 2019, but now sits in the Independent Group. Confusing, or what? The Conservatives allow 3 of their number to sit as non-aligned and yet still be Conservatives  |
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Post by willpower3 on Feb 25, 2022 23:30:29 GMT
Not much sign of a government in peril. Maybe crisis bounce.
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 26, 2022 11:29:50 GMT
Not much sign of a government in peril. Maybe crisis bounce. Apart from the usual point about postal votes, have you looked at the results at all save for the actual winners? (as a general rule, dropping significantly from 2019 levels isn't a great sign for either Tories or Labour) |
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Post by andrewp on Feb 26, 2022 11:48:35 GMT
Not much sign of a government in peril. Maybe crisis bounce. Apart from the usual point about postal votes, have you looked at the results at all save for the actual winners? (as a general rule, dropping significantly from 2019 levels isn't a great sign for either Tories or Labour) This weeks results, like a lot of local by elections, need a big pinch of salt to extrapolate any trends, 4 of the wards electing on Thursday had Independents, most of whom did respectably. Also, in one of the Lincs wards the candidates went from being Con/ Lab to Con/ Lab/ LD/ Green- in those circumstances it’s very likely that the Con share will drop whatever happens. Also, as has been stated Essex and Lincolnshire are fairly favourable areas for the Tories at the moment. That being said I do think the Tories are doing a little bit better now than they were in December, but we are, pleasingly, clearly seeing local factors reflected in the results too. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
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Post by The Bishop on Feb 26, 2022 11:51:43 GMT
Castle Point was indeed a decent result for them as I said upthread.
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