CatholicLeft
Labour
2032 posts until I was "accidentally" deleted.
Posts: 6,712
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Post by CatholicLeft on Dec 7, 2020 20:30:58 GMT
Doesn't Poland do similarly for the German party? Might be wrong. On a subnational level, Germany has it in Schleswig-Holstein, and that has caused a fair bit of controversy down the years. The interesting thing about Germany's Romanians is that they have provided the current president and its only winner of the Nobel Prize for Literature. President Klaus only stayed in Romania because he is married to a Romanian . His parents emigrated to Germany. The Democratic Forum of Germans in Romania out-perform their expected performance as they are trusted by the Romanians to be more trustworthy. Interestingly, Rudolf Schuster, the past president of Slovakia is part of their German minority. |
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,729
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Post by Chris from Brum on Dec 7, 2020 20:46:33 GMT
It would explain a few things about Bucharest, which is one of very few places I've visited that I wouldn't go back to. I've never been. Is it a bit grim? It was once known as the "Paris of the East", which may have been a little optimistic, but the years of post-war Communist government, in particular the Ceausescu era where the glorification of the leader was paramount, had the effects that you might expect. |
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Post by Arthur Figgis on Dec 7, 2020 20:48:17 GMT
It would explain a few things about Bucharest, which is one of very few places I've visited that I wouldn't go back to. I've never been. Is it a bit grim? Everyone felt like they were trying to scam me. As soon as you leave the city, it’s a completely different world- much better. |
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Post by markgoodair on Dec 7, 2020 21:05:29 GMT
I've never been. Is it a bit grim? Everyone felt like they were trying to scam me. As soon as you leave the city, it’s a completely different world- much better. Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. |
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Post by Arthur Figgis on Dec 7, 2020 21:42:57 GMT
Everyone felt like they were trying to scam me. As soon as you leave the city, it’s a completely different world- much better. Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. As are Sibiu, Sighisoara, and pretty much every other Romanian place I’ve stayed in. |
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,797 
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Post by Georg Ebner on Dec 7, 2020 22:22:28 GMT
Remarkably strong correlation between the PSD and Wallachia + Moldavia ...and finally, how the regions performed in last years EP-election ("W+B"=Walachy&Bucharest, "W+D"=Walachy&Dobruja):  |
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CatholicLeft
Labour
2032 posts until I was "accidentally" deleted.
Posts: 6,712
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Post by CatholicLeft on Dec 7, 2020 22:23:41 GMT
Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. As are Sibiu, Sighisoara, and pretty much every other Romanian place I’ve stayed in. The Mayor of Sibiu is an ethnic German, Astrid Fodor, her predecessor being Klaus Iohannis. The Democratic Forum of Germans in Romania have an absolute majority on the council despite Transylvanian Saxons only being 2% of the population. |
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john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 15,774
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Post by john07 on Dec 7, 2020 23:30:47 GMT
Everyone felt like they were trying to scam me. As soon as you leave the city, it’s a completely different world- much better. Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. I have visited Cluj. I drove overland via Ostende, Munich, and Budapest and stayed initially with my pal Tavi and his mother. Tavi was a Romanian speaker. His friend Ante was a Hungarian speaker. We spend a week or so touring via Brasov (Dracula country in the Carpathians) to Bucharest and on to Constanta on the Black Sea. We were with Tavi’s graduation class from the University of Cluj. They had to go to the University of Bucharest for their job allocation . This was in 1971 under Ceausescu! After that we went to Mamaia but stayed in a rented room in a municipal housing scheme in Constanta. |
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 14,759
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Post by J.G.Harston on Dec 7, 2020 23:35:08 GMT
Everyone felt like they were trying to scam me. As soon as you leave the city, it’s a completely different world- much better. Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. Sorry, I just choked on my tea in a fit of immature Inbetweeners giggles. |
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Post by John Chanin on Dec 8, 2020 8:32:33 GMT
Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. I have visited Cluj. I drove overland via Ostende, Munich, and Budapest and stayed initially with my pal Tavi and his mother. Tavi was a Romanian speaker. His friend Ante was a Hungarian speaker. We spend a week or so touring via Brasov (Dracula country in the Carpathians) to Bucharest and on to Constanta on the Black Sea. We were with Tavi’s graduation class from the University of Cluj. They had to go to the University of Bucharest for their job allocation . This was in 1971 under Ceausescu! After that we went to Mamaia but stayed in a rented room in a municipal housing scheme in Constanta. My university professor (Zevedi Barbu) graduated from the University of Cluj, although I have never managed to visit the place. Transylvania is on my list if I don't get too decrepit before travel re-opens, |
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john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 15,774
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Post by john07 on Dec 8, 2020 11:23:03 GMT
I have visited Cluj. I drove overland via Ostende, Munich, and Budapest and stayed initially with my pal Tavi and his mother. Tavi was a Romanian speaker. His friend Ante was a Hungarian speaker. We spend a week or so touring via Brasov (Dracula country in the Carpathians) to Bucharest and on to Constanta on the Black Sea. We were with Tavi’s graduation class from the University of Cluj. They had to go to the University of Bucharest for their job allocation . This was in 1971 under Ceausescu! After that we went to Mamaia but stayed in a rented room in a municipal housing scheme in Constanta. My university professor (Zevedi Barbu) graduated from the University of Cluj, although I have never managed to visit the place. Transylvania is on my list if I don't get too decrepit before travel re-opens, One thing happened on the journey out that really scared me. I was driving through Hungary getting close to the border when I found myself in the middle of a convoy of armoured troop carriers. This was only three years after the Soviet invasion of Czechoslovakia and Ceausescu had been making some anti-Soviet and indeed pro-Chinese speeches. Some thought that Romania might be next on the list for invasion. When you are stuck in a Warsaw Pact troop convoy heading for the border, it is hard not to think of what might happen, I could have participated in the invasion let along witnessing it! As it happened it appears that it was simply sabre rattling by the Soviets and the convoy turned off the road about 1 km from the border post. |
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The Bishop
Labour
Down With Factionalism!
Posts: 38,889
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Post by The Bishop on Dec 8, 2020 12:40:49 GMT
Tbf in 1971 Romania was a relatively "normal" place - some think it was a visit to North Korea around that time that started Old Nick's descent into madness.
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Chris from Brum
Lib Dem
What I need is a strong drink and a peer group.
Posts: 9,729
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Post by Chris from Brum on Dec 8, 2020 13:12:24 GMT
Tbf in 1971 Romania was a relatively "normal" place - some think it was a visit to North Korea around that time that started Old Nick's descent into madness. Dad's school organised a week's trip there via the Schools' Travel Service, so we all got to go as a family, this was in 1975. There were definitely elements of the personality cult present in the reading that we did before going, and in Bucharest it was all "Traiascu Partidul Socialista Româna" (basically "Up with the party") on hoardings and buildings belonging to the government. Outside Bucharest this was much less evident, but armed police would be in sensitive spots, and "No photography" signs on fences around certain buildings. Our tour guides were helpful but wary of what they said and where they said it, there definitely was that degree of paranoia around, but this was, I think, common to all countries under the Soviet sphere of influence. |
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john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 15,774
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Post by john07 on Dec 8, 2020 22:54:21 GMT
Tbf in 1971 Romania was a relatively "normal" place - some think it was a visit to North Korea around that time that started Old Nick's descent into madness. My pals Tavi and Ante would disagree. There were plenty of signs by then that the process was well under way. Maybe not so apparent to the outside world but it was definately there by 1971 even before the visits to North Korea, North Vietnam, China and Mongolia in 1971. He was delivering neo-Maoist speeches that year. However Tavi maintained that the process was well under way by then. I went there in the late spring. I had just taken my A Levels as an external candidate. I had to apply for a transit visa to travel through Hungary and avoid the 'long way round' trip via Yugoslavia. As soon as it arrived I set off. I had to go via Croydon to pick up my Green Card from the Whitgift Centre on the way to Dover. So I would have been there before the 1971 July Theses speech had been delivered. Ceaușescu was seen in the west as a moderniser when he briefly aligned with Josip Broz Tito and Alexander Dubček in opposition to the Soviet Union. In reality, he was becoming a rather extreme Romanian Nationalist and banned contraception and abortion to try and boost population. Romania certainly appeared less controlled that Hungary but this was as much to do with the incompetance of the police as anything else. |
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,797
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Post by Georg Ebner on Dec 9, 2020 11:12:13 GMT
Tbf in 1971 Romania was a relatively "normal" place - some think it was a visit to North Korea around that time that started Old Nick's descent into madness. But he had become the sole leader already before, making a personality-cult very likely. When appointing a shy, stuttering man, his colleague forgot to take his ambitious wife into account... |
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,797
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Post by Georg Ebner on Dec 11, 2020 1:15:09 GMT
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,797
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Post by Georg Ebner on Dec 11, 2020 1:32:33 GMT
P.scr.: The maps above are based on the numbers for the Lower Chamber (~ "Camera dei Deputati").
Surprising, that Aur/Gold performed well in the SW of TransSylvania (but from said Arad we have the first notice of Latin-speakers in the country) and not so good in western Walachy (Oltenia).
USR+Plus is and remains very much an urban party, of course.
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,797
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Post by Georg Ebner on Dec 11, 2020 5:09:17 GMT
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,797
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Post by Georg Ebner on Dec 12, 2020 22:46:06 GMT
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john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 15,774
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Post by john07 on Dec 12, 2020 23:20:54 GMT
Everyone felt like they were trying to scam me. As soon as you leave the city, it’s a completely different world- much better. Cluj is a much more pleasant place to visit. I recall an incident from my trip to Cluj back in 1971. Earlier that year Professor Trofin from the English Department of the University of Cluj came to Manchester for a Conference. Tavi, who was one of his students let us know and we made contact and took him out for a meal at the Brocklehurst Arms near Macclesfield. He wanted to return the favour so I went along with Tavi and his mother, for a meal with him and his family in Cluj. We hadn’t been there long when a gypsy women came into the restaurant try to sell flowers. An altercation happened. It was translated for me subsequently to the effect: Buy my flowers. No Why not? I am saving up to buy a car (This could take 5 to 10 years in Romania) Well the car will crash and you will be killed! An authentic Gypsy curse! Apparently, she was known to ‘terrorise’ the city to buy flowers. |
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