cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,599 
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Post by cibwr on Oct 18, 2016 9:53:26 GMT
For the sake of some tidyness a separate thread on Welsh Government boundaries form and function.
As mentioned I favour 5 regions and around 30 districts, I'd prefer direct elections to all and by STV. Id like the regions to take over joint board functions, the police, ambulance and fire authorities.
Penddu and jamesdowden have some ideas. perhaps we could go into a bit more detail.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Oct 18, 2016 10:08:40 GMT
For the sake of some tidyness a separate thread on Welsh Government boundaries form and function. As mentioned I favour 5 regions and around 30 districts, I'd prefer direct elections to all and by STV. Id like the regions to take over joint board functions, the police, ambulance and fire authorities. Penddu and jamesdowden have some ideas. perhaps we could go into a bit more detail. What are the five regions you propose? I'm sure you've told us before but I forget - if you can give me those parameters I'd like to have a play around with some districts |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Oct 18, 2016 11:30:26 GMT
I myself have a fair bit of (possibly misplaced) nostalgia for the 1974-96 Welsh local authority boundaries, and would quite like to see perhaps a partial restoration of those, though I suspect that ship may have long sailed.
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Post by Penddu on Oct 18, 2016 11:48:45 GMT
My suggested arrangement would be 4 'city regions' plus 2 'rural regions'
- Gwent
- Cardiff (inc East Glamorgan as far as Bridgend)
- Swansea Bay (inc West Glamorgan and Llanelli & Amman, and Ystradgynlais area)
- Deeside (Wrexham & Flintshire - maybe also incuding Rhyl, Prestatyn & St Asaph)
- Dyfed-Powys (exc Montgomeryshire)
- Gogledd (Gwynedd, Conwy, Denbighshire & Montgomeryshire)
Second tier to be around 20 Districts, but further divided into area committees.
I suggest that districts should be represented by directly elected councillors - say 50 per district - and Regions by directly elected 'commissioners' but who would be subject to oversight by Council of coopted Councillors.
And replace current communities by area commmittees of Districts - no need for separate community councillors
For example, a Councillor elected to Bridgend District Council representing Rest Bay could be co-opted onto Cardiff Region oversight comittee and also to Porthcawl Community (area) committee.
And renumeration to be strictly attendance based.
Just thinking aloud....
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cibwr
Plaid Cymru
Posts: 3,599
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Post by cibwr on Oct 18, 2016 20:00:08 GMT
Well my orginal proposals were 5 regions; Swansea Bay, East Glamorgan, Gwent - which are the city regions and two rural, Gogledd, which is old Gwynedd and Clwyd plus Montgomery and Deheubarth, which was old Dyfed plus Brecon & Rhondda. I have slightly tweeked them now. You can look at my original suggestion here. acardiffvoice.blogspot.co.uk/2011/08/regional-and-local-government-in-wales.htmlI have modified this to suggest 5 regions on the model proposed by Penddu Six regions and counties - with electorate. Wrexham and Deeside 213131 Delyn 55158 Alyn & Deeside 62093 Wrexham 95880 Gwent 410560 Newport 100931 Monmouth 68267 Torfaen 66153 Islwyn 43843 Blaenau Gwent 49661 Caerffili 81705 Morgannwg 583498 Cardiff 227878 Vale of Glamorgan 91056 Merthyr Tydfil 42082 Bridgend 101684 Rhonnda 49161 Taf Ely 72424 Cynon Valley 45368 Swansea Bay 327061 Port Talbot 43861 Neath 59176 Swansea 166822 Llanelli 57202 Dehaubarth 313441 Caerfyrddin 76685 Pembrokeshire 87062 Ceredigion 50432 Brecon & Radnor 52273 Montgomeryshire 46989 North 292308 Gwynedd 80092 Ynys Mon 49287 Conwy 88860 Denbighshire 74069 |
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Post by greenhert on Oct 18, 2016 20:30:24 GMT
My solution here is simple: restore the old Welsh counties but make the cities of Swansea and Cardiff unitary authorities (and in Swansea's case I would separate Abertawe proper from the Gower). Meanwhile, the Welsh Assembly should be elevated to a Welsh Parliament and have powers equal or nearly equal to those the Scottish Parliament currently has.
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Oct 18, 2016 20:35:49 GMT
My solution here is simple: restore the old Welsh counties but make the cities of Swansea and Cardiff unitary authorities (and in Swansea's case I would separate Abertawe proper from the Gower) Which old Welsh counties? Pre-1974 or the 1974-96 boundaries? I ask because in the case of the latter, I pretty much favour your suggestion. The one issue I can see with this though is up in the North, where the verbatim restoration of Gwynedd and Clwyd would necessitate the de-merger of Conwy authority, and the two halves of the Conwy CBC have become significantly intertwined over the past 20 years... |
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Post by greenhert on Oct 18, 2016 20:43:29 GMT
The pre-1974 Welsh counties.
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Oct 18, 2016 20:50:54 GMT
The pre-1974 Welsh counties. Oh good grief, no. Those boundaries were utterly terrible, and I'm largely thinking of old Denbighshire here (an "unholy sprawling mass" is what I'd call it), and though it's not the only one with questionable borders it's definitely the worst. |
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Post by Penddu on Oct 18, 2016 22:45:04 GMT
My solution here is simple: restore the old Welsh counties but make the cities of Swansea and Cardiff unitary authorities (and in Swansea's case I would separate Abertawe proper from the Gower) Which old Welsh counties? Pre-1974 or the 1974-96 boundaries? I ask because in the case of the latter, I pretty much favour your suggestion. The one issue I can see with this though is up in the North, where the verbatim restoration of Gwynedd and Clwyd would necessitate the de-merger of Conwy authority, and the two halves of the Conwy CBC have become significantly intertwined over the past 20 years... |
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Post by Penddu on Oct 18, 2016 22:45:30 GMT
Conwy to Gwynedd. Sorted.
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Post by Penddu on Oct 18, 2016 22:52:51 GMT
Well my orginal proposals were 5 regions; Swansea Bay, East Glamorgan, Gwent - which are the city regions and two rural, Gogledd, which is old Gwynedd and Clwyd plus Montgomery and Deheubarth, which was old Dyfed plus Brecon & Rhondda. I have slightly tweeked them now. You can look at my original suggestion here. acardiffvoice.blogspot.co.uk/2011/08/regional-and-local-government-in-wales.htmlI have modified this to suggest 5 regions on the model proposed by Penddu Six regions and counties - with electorate. Wrexham and Deeside 213131 + 30000 Delyn 55158.....North Flintshire Alyn & Deeside 62093......South Flintshire Wrexham 95880 Rhuddlan 30,000 Gwent 410560 - -81705 Newport 100931 Monmouth 68267 Torfaen 66153 Islwyn 43843 Blaenau Gwent 49661 Caerffili 81705......place Caerffili in Morgannwg as it is in Cardiff commuter belt Morgannwg 583498 + 81705 Cardiff 227878 Vale of Glamorgan 91056 Merthyr Tydfil 42082 Bridgend 101684 Rhonnda 49161 Taf Ely 72424 Cynon Valley 45368 Plus Caerffili Swansea Bay 327061 Port Talbot 43861 Neath 59176 Swansea 166822 Llanelli 57202 Dehaubarth 313441 - 46989 Caerfyrddin 76685 Pembrokeshire 87062 Ceredigion 50432 Brecon & Radnor 52273 Montgomeryshire 46989 ....place in Gogledd North 292308 - 30000 + 46989 Gwynedd 80092 Ynys Mon 49287 Conwy 88860 Denbighshire 74069 - 30000 Plus montgomeryshre Some modification suggestions.. |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Oct 19, 2016 12:37:59 GMT
Conwy to Gwynedd. Sorted. Sounds good to me. |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Oct 19, 2016 18:29:35 GMT
And of course if you unite Cardiff commuterland in one region, you get half the population of Wales. Or less tactfully...  By a clear margin, this is the best suggestion on the thread thus far. |
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Post by Penddu on Oct 20, 2016 5:12:27 GMT
James, I have some sympathy for your comment on the size of regions and maybe we only need 3?
But I don't agree with your opinion of the assembly. The purpose of this body is to take powers away from Westminster, not hoover them up from local government.
And if Cardiff Bay is the wrong location, where do you suggest that the UK parliament should be relocated to ?
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Georg Ebner
Non-Aligned
Roman romantic reactionary Catholic
Posts: 9,884
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Post by Georg Ebner on Oct 23, 2016 19:34:13 GMT
392.0 NE (Wrexham)
309.4 NW (ConwyCay) idealiter with a boundary from PointOfAyr onwards
134.6 ME/Powys idealiter less Ystradgynlais
389.3 MW/Dyfed idealiter less Llanelli
529.4 SW/WGlam. (Swansea) idealiter with Llanelli&Ystradgynlais
424.9+ SM/EGlam. (Cardiff) plus RhymneyValley
366.8 CardiffCity
404.0+ SE/Gwent (Newport) plus Islwyn
Bridgend could be made independent (stretching from Afan to BrekseaPoint)
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Post by Penddu on Oct 24, 2016 5:07:03 GMT
I have thought more about regions and what they would do, and now revise my thinking to have 4 Regions only. One covering all of North Wales including Montgomershire.
One covering South East Wales including Gwent and South Powys
One covering South Central Wales including Cardiff and East Glamorgan as far as Bridgend
One covering South West Wales including Swansea, West Glamorgan and Dyfed
These would be supported by around 25 Districts (aka City,County).
I have publish some more details when i get time over next few days.
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Oct 24, 2016 13:15:54 GMT
I laughed at the idea of the Welsh Assembly being in Aberystwyth. And then suddenly it doesn't seem like that bad an idea.
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Oct 24, 2016 14:18:11 GMT
I laughed at the idea of the Welsh Assembly being in Aberystwyth. And then suddenly it doesn't seem like that bad an idea. Whilst on the whole I don't think it really matters too much where a country's capital city/seat of government is located, if the Welsh Assembly were to convene in Aberystwyth then perhaps the Welsh government might be more inclined to pay more attention to the North (though having the D.P.O. and three cabinet ministers coming from Northern seats is something of start, it still feels like this area gets unduly overlooked for most part). |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Oct 24, 2016 14:43:31 GMT
I laughed at the idea of the Welsh Assembly being in Aberystwyth. And then suddenly it doesn't seem like that bad an idea. Whilst on the whole I don't think it really matters too much where a country's capital city/seat of government is located, if the Welsh Assembly were to convene in Aberystwyth then perhaps the Welsh government might be more inclined to pay more attention to the North (though having the D.P.O. and three cabinet ministers coming from Northern seats is something of start, it still feels like this area gets unduly overlooked for most part). I quite often find myself in Cardiganshire, and I'm always taken aback by how difficult it is to get from Welshpool to Aberystwyth and beyond by car, let alone anything else. It seems like there's little political will to fix things like that. |
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