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Post by islington on Aug 31, 2016 14:46:47 GMT
In recent discussion of the Y&H thread I found myself musing on the difference between (a) the ordinarily bad boundary that one might try to avoid, but ultimately would accept if it helped create a better plan overall, and (b) the downright terrible boundary that one would go to any length to avoid.
I thought that examples of (a), in the current map, are constituencies such as Lancaster & Fleetwood and Shipley.
But then I fell to thinking: are these really the worst that the present map has to offer? Are there some worse boundaries that I have overlooked (either current or in the relatively recent past)?
I'm thinking in terms of electoral boundaries, as opposed to administrative boundaries, and I must admit I was thinking in terms of Westminster boundaries although I suppose it would be interesting to hear of other examples (but UK only, I'd suggest, because otherwise we'll end up capturing endless computer-generated gerrymanders from the States).
I'd like to limit this to boundaries that were used in actual elections, rather than proposals that were never implemented such as Leeds Met & Ossett. And I'd suggest an historic cut-off at 1983, because that was the point at which physically disconnected seats (Stirling, Falkirk & Grangemouth, Clacks & E Stirlingshire) ceased to be acceptable.
Any offers? |
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Post by krollo on Aug 31, 2016 15:15:06 GMT
Pudsey as it is at the moment bothers me a little due to it necking ridiculously on account of the ward boundaries, but it's mostly aesthetic
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Post by minionofmidas on Aug 31, 2016 15:46:49 GMT
In recent discussion of the Y&H thread I found myself musing on the difference between (a) the ordinarily bad boundary that one might try to avoid, but ultimately would accept if it helped create a better plan overall, and (b) the downright terrible boundary that one would go to any length to avoid.
I thought that examples of (a), in the current map, are constituencies such as Lancaster & Fleetwood
That would be an example of a) bordering on b). |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Aug 31, 2016 15:48:17 GMT
The little thin strip that is Cardiff South and Penarth has always bothered me, its shape kind of reminds me of the gerrymander jobs you see over in the United States. |
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Post by andrewteale on Aug 31, 2016 15:57:44 GMT
The pre-1983 Heywood and Royton was a good example of this: an earmuffs-shaped seat stretching around the north of Rochdale, with very little (in some cases only footpaths) connecting the constituent towns.
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Post by greatkingrat on Aug 31, 2016 16:00:59 GMT
West Suffolk, although that is the fault of the county boundary rather than the constituency.
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Aug 31, 2016 16:25:09 GMT
If we're going into pre-1983 constituencies, then the old seat of Denbigh springs to mind; largely coterminous with the pre-1974 Denbighshire county (bar a few areas), essentially a great, big sprawling mass across north Wales.
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Aug 31, 2016 16:31:57 GMT
There were the ones with detached parts for pointless historic reasons, eg East Flintshire or Dunfermline.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2016 16:53:07 GMT
There were the ones with detached parts for pointless historic reasons, eg East Flintshire or Dunfermline. Nothing was ever originally pointless, even if it later appeared inconvenient. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2016 17:02:19 GMT
Bath being wrapped around by NE Somerset
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Aug 31, 2016 17:04:19 GMT
That River Yare situation in Thjorpe Hamlet wards (and therefore Norwich South constituency) is extremely irritating and perhaps leads to the most absurd looking parliamentary constiutuency boundary (except that it mostly isn't visible)
Those maps that include a couple of islands in the Severn estuary in Avonmouth/Bristol North West also make that very annoying but I wouldn;'t count that
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Post by greenhert on Aug 31, 2016 18:55:29 GMT
In my opinion, the 10 constituencies that currently exist in Britain that in my opinion have the worst boundaries are:
1. Clwyd South
2. Carmarthen West & South Pembrokeshire
3. Cardiff South & Penarth
4. Meon Valley
5. Central Devon
6. St Austell & Newquay
7. Basildon (North) & Billericay
8. Brigg & Goole
9. Lancaster & Fleetwood
10. Dumfriesshire, Clydesdale & Tweeddale
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Harry Hayfield
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Post by Harry Hayfield on Aug 31, 2016 19:19:35 GMT
Whilst opinion may be divided on the merits of the word "worst", these are the constituencies since 1983 that have always left me scratching my head as to why?
1983: Cheltenham, Bath, Great Grimsby, Darlington, Carlisle
1997: Colchester, Slough, Cheltenham, Aberdeen Central
2010: Dumfriesshire, Peterborough, Lewisham East, Havant, Bath, York Central, York Outer, Great Grimsby, Preston
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Post by John Chanin on Aug 31, 2016 19:38:01 GMT
Meon Valley is pretty terrible. Since no-one else has mentioned it, also a vote for Arundel & South Downs.
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Aug 31, 2016 20:11:49 GMT
West Suffolk, although that is the fault of the county boundary rather than the constituency. It's not a particularly good constituency, particularly in terms of road links, but it gets better every year as the dominant identity in more and more of it is Cambridge commuters. Central Suffolk & North Ipswich strikes me as much more incoherent. In terms of non-contiguous constituencies, I'll point out once again that Harwich & North Essex is in the same position as Lancaster & Fleetwood - linked only by a summer ferry. |
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Post by Lord Twaddleford on Aug 31, 2016 20:14:40 GMT
In my opinion, the 10 constituencies that currently exist in Britain that in my opinion have the worst boundaries are: 1. Clwyd South It's as if when they were drawing up seats, Clwyd South was created from what was left. |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Aug 31, 2016 20:15:09 GMT
Whilst opinion may be divided on the merits of the word "worst", these are the constituencies since 1983 that have always left me scratching my head as to why? 1983: Cheltenham, Bath, Great Grimsby, Darlington, Carlisle 1997: Colchester, Slough, Cheltenham, Aberdeen Central 2010: Dumfriesshire, Peterborough, Lewisham East, Havant, Bath, York Central, York Outer, Great Grimsby, Preston I'm not terribly familiar with the 1983 boundaries, but none of the 1997 boundaries you mention seem to be anything but entirely sensible, and amongst the 2010 lot only Dumfriesshire and York Outer are problematic. What's your reasoning? |
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Post by Andrew_S on Aug 31, 2016 20:18:53 GMT
Whilst opinion may be divided on the merits of the word "worst", these are the constituencies since 1983 that have always left me scratching my head as to why? 1983: Cheltenham, Bath, Great Grimsby, Darlington, Carlisle 1997: Colchester, Slough, Cheltenham, Aberdeen Central 2010: Dumfriesshire, Peterborough, Lewisham East, Havant, Bath, York Central, York Outer, Great Grimsby, Preston Mid Staffordshire 1983-1997 was pretty awful, as was Knowsley 1997-2010. |
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Post by greenhert on Aug 31, 2016 20:36:20 GMT
You mean Knowsley North & Sefton East? The Knowsley constituency was not created until 2010.
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Harry Hayfield
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Post by Harry Hayfield on Aug 31, 2016 21:04:31 GMT
Whilst opinion may be divided on the merits of the word "worst", these are the constituencies since 1983 that have always left me scratching my head as to why? 1983: Cheltenham, Bath, Great Grimsby, Darlington, Carlisle 1997: Colchester, Slough, Cheltenham, Aberdeen Central 2010: Dumfriesshire, Peterborough, Lewisham East, Havant, Bath, York Central, York Outer, Great Grimsby, Preston I'm not terribly familiar with the 1983 boundaries, but none of the 1997 boundaries you mention seem to be anything but entirely sensible, and amongst the 2010 lot only Dumfriesshire and York Outer are problematic. What's your reasoning? They all look just odd, that's the main reasoning |
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