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Post by iainbhx on May 22, 2022 17:32:11 GMT
Topical reference. There is a Chantry chapel still standing in Wakefield. Gloriously, one of its uses after the chantries were abolished, was as a cheese shop. "Have you got any prayers for the dead?" "Never at the end of the week. Get them fresh in on Monday".
Blessed shall be the cheesemakers.
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Post by finsobruce on May 22, 2022 17:42:21 GMT
Topical reference. There is a Chantry chapel still standing in Wakefield. Gloriously, one of its uses after the chantries were abolished, was as a cheese shop. "Have you got any prayers for the dead?" "Never at the end of the week. Get them fresh in on Monday".
Blessed shall be the cheesemakers. or indeed the makers of any dairy product.
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Post by Disgusted Of Tunbridge Wells on May 22, 2022 22:48:47 GMT
"To my wife and son, I leave simply a demand to berate boogieeck till his demise" Like those medieval wills that set aside money for prayers for the eternal soul of the deceased? I mean, I wasn't intending for prayers, more the opposite, but yes
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zoe
Conservative
Posts: 599
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Post by zoe on May 23, 2022 6:25:24 GMT
"To my wife and son, I leave simply a demand to berate boogieeck till his demise" Like those medieval wills that set aside money for prayers for the eternal soul of the deceased? ISTR that this is enshrined in law as an exception to law against perpetuities.
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Post by PeopleLikeWe on Jun 23, 2022 11:21:46 GMT
It is with heavy heart that I have now defected from Labour to Reform UK.
I do support Starmer and Rayner, but due to some of the issues in the party not being sorted out such as rampant bullying at a local level, the impotence of Labour (bar a few exceptions) down here and I just feel I don't belong there.
I find Reform UK more suitable to my views especially towards law and order, their economic and health plans. I haven't joined the party yet, but will consider.
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Merseymike
Independent
Posts: 39,145
Member is Online
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Post by Merseymike on Jun 23, 2022 12:02:39 GMT
It is with heavy heart that I have now defected from Labour to Reform UK. I do support Starmer and Rayner, but due to some of the issues in the party not being sorted out such as rampant bullying at a local level, the impotence of Labour (bar a few exceptions) down here and I just feel I don't belong there. I find Reform UK more suitable to my views especially towards law and order, their economic and health plans. I haven't joined the party yet, but will consider. Aren't Reform UK in general the diametric opposite of Labour in terms of their views? Of course, you may have altered your views so they are more congruent with them.
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jamie
Top Poster
Posts: 6,841
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Post by jamie on Jun 23, 2022 12:06:23 GMT
It is with heavy heart that I have now defected from Labour to Reform UK. I do support Starmer and Rayner, but due to some of the issues in the party not being sorted out such as rampant bullying at a local level, the impotence of Labour (bar a few exceptions) down here and I just feel I don't belong there. I find Reform UK more suitable to my views especially towards law and order, their economic and health plans. I haven't joined the party yet, but will consider. Obviously each to their own, but this does seem somewhat contradictory, and I’m not sure Reform UK will be any less impotent than Labour given their almost non-existent level of support.
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Post by PeopleLikeWe on Jun 23, 2022 12:37:00 GMT
I would have thought the SDP would be a better fit for Blue Labour, but like Reform they are so thin on the ground that locally the choice might be a matter of who is present. I can envisage an electoral non-compete pact between a handful of such anti establishment parties. To be fair, I think that would be better. Might be the only way to appeal to those who don't like the major parties. Yes I might seem a bit contradictory and politically confused, but I have had a political awakening. I do feel my views have changed and that I have shifted more centre-right in what I believe in.
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Post by mattbewilson on Jun 23, 2022 12:52:44 GMT
It is with heavy heart that I have now defected from Labour to Reform UK. I do support Starmer and Rayner, but due to some of the issues in the party not being sorted out such as rampant bullying at a local level, the impotence of Labour (bar a few exceptions) down here and I just feel I don't belong there. I find Reform UK more suitable to my views especially towards law and order, their economic and health plans. I haven't joined the party yet, but will consider. I'm absolutely gutted to hear that. I think unfortunately a lot members who joined in last few years just aren't wanting to keep on for one reason and another. We really need a next generation of members but sadly we just don't seem to be getting them
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Post by Daft H'a'porth A'peth A'pith on Jun 23, 2022 15:13:05 GMT
I would have thought the SDP would be a better fit for Blue Labour, but like Reform they are so thin on the ground that locally the choice might be a matter of who is present. I can envisage an electoral non-compete pact between a handful of such anti establishment parties. To be fair, I think that would be better. Might be the only way to appeal to those who don't like the major parties. Yes I might seem a bit contradictory and politically confused, but I have had a political awakening. I do feel my views have changed and that I have shifted more centre-right in what I believe in. Sounds like a similar political journey to mine, I am now in the SDP, reform UK orbit area. Plus Yorkshire Party for devolution.
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Post by PeopleLikeWe on Jun 23, 2022 15:44:16 GMT
Do you feel that you have become more economically conservative or more socially conservative or both? And what are the salient issues that have caused this? Economically, I am more or less the same but feel that there are ways to manage these crisis than just overspending and finding a way to make work a real incentive. Benefits albeit disability, unemployment, carers and UC should be increased to a manageable level, but tackle the root causes of the cost of living rises by introducing such as rent caps, energy bill caps and cutting or scrapping VAT on things such as electricity / fuel duty. Socially - yes. I am a gay man myself and do respect equality, but I feel we're getting too obsessed with identity politics and limiting free speech. Yes there are things which are offensive such as racist and homophobic abuse, but saying something which isn't too harmful and being offended over everything is pathetic. Not everyone can dance to the same tune, and people have their beliefs. I also think we need be to harsher on law and order. More focus on the main crimes such as murder, sexual abuse, drugs and violence. Be harsh with punishments. No focus on investigating silly crimes or meeting targets. Allow the right to protest by all means, and those extremists who glue themselves to trains and block roads should be jailed for criminal damage. I'm also against Covid restrictions (I know we're not under them). Protect the vulnerable and elderly yes, but the rest of people - get on with it. Offer a freedom of choice with jabs (even though I've had all three and have to). Also stop people wearing masks whilst the restrictions are gone. Immigration should be controlled, unless it's a situation like Ukraine where there's a war on. No to rejoining the EU. You're out, you're out. Sadly Corbyn killed the party. I've seen a CLP ruined by extremists on the far-left (I know there are socialists on here, but they mean well . These people are scaring off the core voters of Labour by being members and even voting for them. Plus despite the attempts to move the party forward, there's a lot of rot. Elected officials getting away with Anti Semitism and harassment, CLPs being moribund when they've got elections on. There are some good people in Labour, but the potential is held back. Whilst Reform is only a small party, it will build.
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Post by mattbewilson on Jun 23, 2022 20:03:21 GMT
Do you feel that you have become more economically conservative or more socially conservative or both? And what are the salient issues that have caused this? Economically, I am more or less the same but feel that there are ways to manage these crisis than just overspending and finding a way to make work a real incentive. Benefits albeit disability, unemployment, carers and UC should be increased to a manageable level, but tackle the root causes of the cost of living rises by introducing such as rent caps, energy bill caps and cutting or scrapping VAT on things such as electricity / fuel duty. Socially - yes. I am a gay man myself and do respect equality, but I feel we're getting too obsessed with identity politics and limiting free speech. Yes there are things which are offensive such as racist and homophobic abuse, but saying something which isn't too harmful and being offended over everything is pathetic. Not everyone can dance to the same tune, and people have their beliefs. I also think we need be to harsher on law and order. More focus on the main crimes such as murder, sexual abuse, drugs and violence. Be harsh with punishments. No focus on investigating silly crimes or meeting targets. Allow the right to protest by all means, and those extremists who glue themselves to trains and block roads should be jailed for criminal damage. I'm also against Covid restrictions (I know we're not under them). Protect the vulnerable and elderly yes, but the rest of people - get on with it. Offer a freedom of choice with jabs (even though I've had all three and have to). Also stop people wearing masks whilst the restrictions are gone. Immigration should be controlled, unless it's a situation like Ukraine where there's a war on. No to rejoining the EU. You're out, you're out. Sadly Corbyn killed the party. I've seen a CLP ruined by extremists on the far-left (I know there are socialists on here, but they mean well . These people are scaring off the core voters of Labour by being members and even voting for them. Plus despite the attempts to move the party forward, there's a lot of rot. Elected officials getting away with Anti Semitism and harassment, CLPs being moribund when they've got elections on. There are some good people in Labour, but the potential is held back. Whilst Reform is only a small party, it will build. I'm not sure I agree with this analysis. Many CLPs were in a poor shape to begin with. I lived in Leicester for 5 years and really struggled to get involved locally. I discovered that many branches basically didn't function. Things did get better after the 2017 election as people feared that if they didn't pull up their socks they'd be activists that would step up instead. It was still far from perfect as there was still fixing and 'bums on seats' which is an expression I learnt in 2012 but after reading Goldings book about fixing NEC votes in the 80s to stop the left it's clearly not a new thing. Also that moment in pride when they fix the union meeting because it's the only way to stop the funding. We have one union meeting a year which is an upgrade from when I was an industrial member and there were no union meetings. However, they suddenly called a union under the guise of new engagement only to find it was to put an emergency motion to censure the new left exec. Branches and CLPs have never served anyone as well as we'd like sadly which is why I try to focus on campaigns
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Post by aargauer on Jun 23, 2022 21:17:00 GMT
Organising by branch (I presume by this you mean ward) is mad.
When I was involved in the local Con party, one of the things I helped pushed through was organising everything at a constituency level, as otherwise the wrong areas end up being worked.
Labour can probably get away with it in London due to huge raw numbers, but elsewhere it must be a problem.
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john07
Labour & Co-operative
Posts: 14,540
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Post by john07 on Jun 23, 2022 21:53:14 GMT
It is with heavy heart that I have now defected from Labour to Reform UK. I do support Starmer and Rayner, but due to some of the issues in the party not being sorted out such as rampant bullying at a local level, the impotence of Labour (bar a few exceptions) down here and I just feel I don't belong there. I find Reform UK more suitable to my views especially towards law and order, their economic and health plans. I haven't joined the party yet, but will consider. Aren't Reform UK in general the diametric opposite of Labour in terms of their views? Of course, you may have altered your views so they are more congruent with them. Jump right into the loopy juice side of the political spectrum? All very puzzling?
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J.G.Harston
Lib Dem
Leave-voting Brexit-supporting Liberal Democrat
Posts: 13,607
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Post by J.G.Harston on Jun 23, 2022 21:54:16 GMT
Organising by branch (I presume by this you mean ward) is mad. When I was involved in the local Con party, one of the things I helped pushed through was organising everything at a constituency level, as otherwise the wrong areas end up being worked. Labour can probably get away with it in London due to huge raw numbers, but elsewhere it must be a problem. In the Sheffield LibDems it was getting increasingly obvious that organising by constituency was failing, and during a fallow year there was a push that merged the four local parties (covering six constituencies) into a single city party (with stuff to deal with the bits of Barnsley).
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Post by observer on Jun 23, 2022 21:57:00 GMT
Do you feel that you have become more economically conservative or more socially conservative or both? And what are the salient issues that have caused this? Economically, I am more or less the same but feel that there are ways to manage these crisis than just overspending and finding a way to make work a real incentive. Benefits albeit disability, unemployment, carers and UC should be increased to a manageable level, but tackle the root causes of the cost of living rises by introducing such as rent caps, energy bill caps and cutting or scrapping VAT on things such as electricity / fuel duty. Socially - yes. I am a gay man myself and do respect equality, but I feel we're getting too obsessed with identity politics and limiting free speech. Yes there are things which are offensive such as racist and homophobic abuse, but saying something which isn't too harmful and being offended over everything is pathetic. Not everyone can dance to the same tune, and people have their beliefs. I also think we need be to harsher on law and order. More focus on the main crimes such as murder, sexual abuse, drugs and violence. Be harsh with punishments. No focus on investigating silly crimes or meeting targets. Allow the right to protest by all means, and those extremists who glue themselves to trains and block roads should be jailed for criminal damage. I'm also against Covid restrictions (I know we're not under them). Protect the vulnerable and elderly yes, but the rest of people - get on with it. Offer a freedom of choice with jabs (even though I've had all three and have to). Also stop people wearing masks whilst the restrictions are gone. Immigration should be controlled, unless it's a situation like Ukraine where there's a war on. No to rejoining the EU. You're out, you're out. Sadly Corbyn killed the party. I've seen a CLP ruined by extremists on the far-left (I know there are socialists on here, but they mean well . These people are scaring off the core voters of Labour by being members and even voting for them. Plus despite the attempts to move the party forward, there's a lot of rot. Elected officials getting away with Anti Semitism and harassment, CLPs being moribund when they've got elections on. There are some good people in Labour, but the potential is held back. Whilst Reform is only a small party, it will build. Good luck to you. I have made a very similar journey... albeit quite a long time ago now
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Post by aargauer on Jun 23, 2022 22:03:49 GMT
Organising by branch (I presume by this you mean ward) is mad. When I was involved in the local Con party, one of the things I helped pushed through was organising everything at a constituency level, as otherwise the wrong areas end up being worked. Labour can probably get away with it in London due to huge raw numbers, but elsewhere it must be a problem. In the Sheffield LibDems it was getting increasingly obvious that organising by constituency was failing, and during a fallow year there was a push that merged the four local parties (covering six constituencies) into a single city party (with stuff to deal with the bits of Barnsley). Membership in the constituency was around 600. But we also did stuff on a borough basis.
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Post by gwynthegriff on Jun 23, 2022 22:34:29 GMT
Also stop people wearing masks whilst the restrictions are gone. How do you propose to do that? By law?
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European Lefty
Labour
Can be bribed with salted liquorice
Posts: 5,512
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Post by European Lefty on Jun 23, 2022 22:35:52 GMT
Organising by branch (I presume by this you mean ward) is mad. When I was involved in the local Con party, one of the things I helped pushed through was organising everything at a constituency level, as otherwise the wrong areas end up being worked. Labour can probably get away with it in London due to huge raw numbers, but elsewhere it must be a problem. Certainly in Stroud it's helpful for respecting and working with the differences between different areas and coping with the nature of a reasonably large seat
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peterl
Green
Monarchic Technocratic Localist
Posts: 8,047
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Post by peterl on Jun 23, 2022 22:40:57 GMT
An advertising campaign featuring cute animals caught in discarded masks would probably do the trick.
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