neilm
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Post by neilm on Nov 11, 2015 14:49:54 GMT
To clarify, is this an exercise in hoe England and Wales would vote to become independent of Scotland, or how we'd vote in a referendum to force independence upon Scotland (an option I'm enthusiastic about)?
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Crimson King
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Post by Crimson King on Nov 11, 2015 16:53:07 GMT
I assumed it was 'should Scotland be an independent county yes/no' offered to the voters of England and wales
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johnloony
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Post by johnloony on Nov 12, 2015 3:12:48 GMT
So I've been wondering if, hypothetically, Scotland were to trade places with the remainder of the United Kingdom how would the results of the independence referendum look? This would be assuming that politically, England/Wales would trade places with Scotland without any demographic/socioeconomic changes. What on Earth is any of this supposed to mean? What is the actual question in the referendum? What does "trade places with" mean?
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Harry Hayfield
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Post by Harry Hayfield on Nov 12, 2015 9:20:39 GMT
If the question "Do you believe Scotland should be an independent country?", this is how I believe the results would be announced:
YES: Ynys Môn, Gwynedd, Carmarthenshire NO: All the other councils with the exception of... Too close to call: Ceredigion, Caerphilly
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2015 9:31:33 GMT
I have no idea what this thread is on about ... apart from involving Scotland somehow ....
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Nov 12, 2015 9:34:54 GMT
If there was a referendum on Scottish independence but asking voters outside Scotland, there should be an option on the ballot paper for 'Whatever the Scots say'.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2015 11:33:59 GMT
Now I'm even further lost ....
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The Bishop
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Post by The Bishop on Nov 12, 2015 11:35:41 GMT
I understand the question, its just a bit of an odd one to ask
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2015 11:45:00 GMT
I understand the question, its just a bit of an odd one to ask well, you're one up on me is it: If Bath was populated by scots how would they vote? If Bath was in Scotland? If Bath was asked their opinion on scottish independence? or if Bath was in Scotland while Scotland became England Agreed this is one of the more bizarre threads ...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2015 11:47:18 GMT
My guess is that the thread is about T.P. O'Connor, who served as Irish Nationalist MP for the constituency of Liverpool Scotland 1885-1929.
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Post by finsobruce on Nov 12, 2015 11:49:05 GMT
My guess is that the thread is about T.P. O'Connor, who served as Irish Nationalist MP for the constituency of Liverpool Scotland 1885-1929. But how would he, as an Irish Nationalist, have voted in a referendum on English Independence if Liverpool had really been part of Scotland?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2015 11:51:46 GMT
My guess is that the thread is about T.P. O'Connor, who served as Irish Nationalist MP for the constituency of Liverpool Scotland 1885-1929. But how would he, as an Irish Nationalist, have voted in a referendum on English Independence if Liverpool had really been part of Scotland? or would he have gone for the northern powerhouse option ...
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Nov 12, 2015 12:00:17 GMT
If I understand the question correctly (and I agree with the BIshop here) then you are looking at basically the most economically deprived/demographically shitty areas voting for Independence because they believe they will somehow be better off outside the UK. In that case the strongest 'Yes' votes are going to be in Liverpool and Knowsley with probably Yes votes (or at least very narrow No victories in: Manchester, Salford, Wigan, Barnsley, Rotherham, Hull, Durham, Sunderland, Gateshead, South Tyneside, Hartlepool. Possibly Sandwell but not much any further South. Corby would be possible but presumably blood ties would keep many wanting to retain ties to Scotland. I guess we would also have at least some of Blaenau Gwent, Caerphillt, Rhondda-Cynon-Taff and Neath Port Talbot. The shittier London borroughs are difficult to assess as they have no equivalent in Scotland but Barking & Dagenham and Newham at least are possible, maybe also Tower Hamlets and Hackney
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Post by finsobruce on Nov 12, 2015 12:49:30 GMT
well, you're one up on me is it: If Bath was populated by scots how would they vote? If Bath was in Scotland? If Bath was asked their opinion on scottish independence? or if Bath was in Scotland while Scotland became England Agreed this is one of the more bizarre threads ... Uhm...? If Bath was in Scotland and populated by Scots is probably the closest here... If there was a scandal about this we could call it "Bathgate". Would tie things up nicely.
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Post by lennon on Nov 12, 2015 12:50:14 GMT
well, you're one up on me is it: If Bath was populated by scots how would they vote? If Bath was in Scotland? If Bath was asked their opinion on scottish independence? or if Bath was in Scotland while Scotland became England Agreed this is one of the more bizarre threads ... Uhm...? If Bath was in Scotland and populated by Scots is probably the closest here... So trying to do a 'Bath == St Andrews' / Plymouth == Aberdeen or whatever and trying to match the demographics up and see how they would have voted Yes/No?
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Nov 12, 2015 12:54:53 GMT
Has there been any polling or do you have any impression of how the Pakistani vote went in the referendum? One tends to get the impression that they were quite strongly for Yes but that may just be a case of the SNP pushing forward certain spokesmen from that background ('Abu Hamza' (© David Coburn) and Osama wotsit etc). If there was an overwhelming vote in that direction then obviously that's going to have implications for Birmingham, Luton, Blackburn etc.
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Nov 12, 2015 12:56:17 GMT
Uhm...? If Bath was in Scotland and populated by Scots is probably the closest here... So trying to do a 'Bath == St Andrews' / Plymouth == Aberdeen or whatever and trying to match the demographics up and see how they would have voted Yes/No? That's how I've understood it. Its a fantastically pointless exercise, but there's nothing wrong with that
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Tony Otim
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Post by Tony Otim on Nov 12, 2015 13:54:55 GMT
Has there been any polling or do you have any impression of how the Pakistani vote went in the referendum? One tends to get the impression that they were quite strongly for Yes but that may just be a case of the SNP pushing forward certain spokesmen from that background ('Abu Hamza' (© David Coburn) and Osama wotsit etc). If there was an overwhelming vote in that direction then obviously that's going to have implications for Birmingham, Luton, Blackburn etc. My impression would be that they voted on pretty similar socioeconomic lines to the white population - the richer ones tended to vote NO and the poorer ones YES. Again, my impression and somebody can probably disprove this, is that the Pakistani population in Scotland tends to a bit more centred in more socially deprived areas, so in general they may have voted more Yes than the population as a whole, but the key factor may be socioeconomic rather than ethnic. Again, all just impressions and am open to counter evidence.
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johnloony
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Post by johnloony on Nov 13, 2015 13:24:43 GMT
What on Earth is any of this supposed to mean? What is the actual question in the referendum? What does "trade places with" mean? England and Scotland are socioeconomically similar: so if we assume that the political situation within the two countries where to be 'switched' how would this change the referendum? You have repeated the same thing that you said in the first place, but you have not answered the question. What does any of it mean? What is the question in the referendum? Who is voting in the referendum?
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